No respect for Dave Smith and Oklahoma State men’s cross country team

What? Isn’t Denis Kipngtich a 22 year old freshman? At least that’s what his profile says lol. He was born in 2001 bro. You do the math. So much for a super talented high schooler lol.
By the way the other freshman Adisu Guadie was born in 2002 in Ethiopia making him 21 and the third Kenyan freshman in their top 5 has no birthdate available but I’m willing to bet it’s not 18 or 19 lol

NAU has been doing this for years! Now that OkSt is besting you, why do you NOW complaint? How about looking in the mirror?

Just curious, when did NAU bring in a 22 year old Kenyan freshman? Let alone 3 in the same season lol.

Every XC title Dave Smith has is due to Kenyans. The guy doesn’t coach. Run the miles he tells you to do, run the workouts he tells you to do. Besides making phone calls to Kenya and Ethiopian that’s all he does

Please give us the list of Kenyans when he won the title??? Exactly number per championship that he won….We all know NAU also needed those foreignors to win the championship!

NAU has won 6 titles, 5 of which Mike Smith was the head coach. Eric Heins did a fantastic job of building up the NAU program and very well could have won the same number of titles, but to imply that Smith is simply riding Heins' coattails is asinine. One title does not make a dynasty. And when was the last time NAU women were ranked #1 in the country?

And, FFS, altitude is not a magic bullet.

AAU membership is by no means definitive of whether a school is a national research university. There were 62 members for a long time and now they expanded it to, I believe, 70, including a # of schools that are by no means superior to OSU. There are many top research universities not in AAU. Their metrics are peculiar. For instance, colleges of education are locked out. I think that agriculture is another area they don't consider. I could name many, for instance, Dartmouth, ND, Georgetown, Wake Forest, ...

How much did Dave build up Kipngetich, who was already third at Kenyan xc nationals in 2023? If you believe he's just 20, I have a bridge to sell you. I'll re-sell that same bridge to you if you believe that Musau is 17, his listed age. He's getting guys who are elite NCAA level right out of the box. Yet, he remains fully capable of bringing Americans to that same level--it just takes longer. Look at Alex Meier and Isai Rodriguez, or look at most of the NAU women's xc, which won regionals in dominating fashion with one top Kenyan finished product and the rest appearing to be Americans. Mike Smith, by contrast, has developed the occasional foreign transplant while relying on American runners. Kang Nyoak is Sudanese via Australia, I believe, but he was nowhere near the top seven until this year and he was their 2nd runner at regionals. Grijalva was born in the U.S. and was a top recruit but became a 12:50 guy with Mike Smith. Abdihamed Nur had been in the United States for a long time and he had to take a year before NAU to qualify academically before starting; he did not run fast in high school (roughly 4:20/9:20) and was not one of their top guys for quite a while before finally emerging to run 13:06 his last year there. Theo Quax of New Zealand has been an occasional contributor. Their top guys were very good high school runners. The South African runner via Nebraska was the first sub-4 miler for the Cornhuskers before adapting to xc at NAU. So, he does get contributions from foreign runners but he builds and develops them, rather than getting guys who are near the top in the nation in their first races, and the team does not rely heavily on them.

No answers. Just whining about “foreigners”.

why does it matter where athletes are from so long as they meet the NCAA's initial eligibility requirements?

we should be celebrating these African kids who chose to uproot themselves, go wayyyy outside their comfort zone and come to America in pursuit of an education and the opportunity to run at a high level

America's greatest strength is its diversity and nowhere is that better reflected than its higher education system. Good for OK St for creating a program culture where people from all backgrounds feel welcome

Denis Kngtich is listed as a 22 year old freshman both on the OSU website AND on his World Athletic International profile. Both say he was born in 2001. You really telling us we should believe you instead of those organizations? Lol

Dave also ruined Tom Farrell didn't he? Look where Tom is now? He is out and retired due to injury and burnout I suppose. However Shadrack Kipchirchir did much better as a pro.

Notre Dame and Dartmouth are AAU.

OSU is an okay school, I have family members and friends that have graduated from there, but I would still not consider it more than a regional research university.

Am I reading your post wrong, or are you saying that the NAU women's team has one Kenyan athlete, with the rest being Americans? I'm an NAU fan and in agreement with most of what you wrote, but your characterization of their women's team doesn't seem accurate at all.

Of their top ~10 athletes, they have

Americans: E. Stearns, A. Reiss, A. Upshaw, M. Congdon, M. Van Pelt, A. Fenske

Foreigners: G. Larkin (CAN), M Grice (UK), R. Smee (AUS), K. Moore (AUS), N. Moore (AUS)

*transfers listed in italics

I'm not sure exactly what their lineup will be next Saturday, but it's likely that either 3/7 or 4/7 will be foreigners. I think it's fair to say both that Smith is great at developing under-the-radar talent out of American high schools (Stearns, Reiss, Nur, Day, Prosser, etc.) and that his current women's team leans heavier into the foreign talent pool. That may be less an intentional change to his recruiting philosophy than an isolated result of the UNM dissolution, though.

You're kidding, right??

2011&2012

Girma Mecheso - hometown Addis Ababa, Ethiopia

Kirubel Erassa - (This one is a stretch as he did compete as a junior and senior in HS)

Shadrack Kipchirchir - Kenyan born

Joseph Manilafasha - like Erassa he ran several years in HS so this is another small stretch.

4 of their 7 were born in East Africa. It does not take rocket science to figure this out.

Many of Mike Smith's top American athletes have faster times than the international athletes Dave Smith brings in. Musau only ran 13:54 and 3:50 1500 prior to arriving at OSU, both at age 21 or 22. Messaoudi ran 3:38 as a 21 year old.

Nico ran 13:50 at 17 or 18, before superspikes. Sahlman ran a 3:56 mile at age 17 or 18.

So actually Dave Smith develops BETTER because he is getting 21 year olds who were previously slower than Mike Smith's 18 year olds, and getting them to win. An 18 year old should develop more because they are younger but they are developing slower with Mike Smith. And Mike Smith has a massive advantage being at altitude.

Girma Mecheso was 9th at Footlocker nationals. So I guess he went to American high school as well

mecheso, Erassa and Manilafasha are all US citizens and we’re US citizens when they ran at OSU. All were recruited by multiple high profile cross country programs