Could running every day actually be bad for performance?

Continue to run 5+ days a week but drop that 15 miler. Concentrate on quality miles under 7:30 pace. Two weeks isn't long enough for your body to adapt to increased mileage or intensity. You should have at least one tempo or progression run a week. No need to hammer intervals this time in season. Build a nice base of at least 50 mpw if you plan on running track that way when you drop the mileage and add the race specific workouts you don't lose as much endurance strength.

Tara Dooley fan #1 wrote:

If you dont want to be tired don't run(ever). If you want to run well your going to be tired a lot. The thing with over training is at least you are in pretty good shape even though you can't maximize performance. Alternatively under training you definitely wont maximize performance.

Also 17 is a bit young to be doing marathons just be sure you are ready before you go and do some damage.

Also you are running pretty slow for your age did you start running recently?

Been running for 2.5 years now. I usually run at around 7:40 on average for runs but since increasing my miles i have been hugging 8:00. my 15 mile long runs once a week are at 7:55

its people like you that i love to know exist. thanks so much for taking the time to type that out. i guess my runs have been quite high a heart rate and thats why i feel so sick and tired of running. ill begin taking my runs at 8:45, maybe having a long run once a week/every two weeks at 7:55 to keep my speed-endurance thing going on

but taking my runs slower i think will help. i always knew i shouldnt be breathing so hard at my easy runs it was just hard to wrap my head around running so slow, even slower

Possble Yup wrote:

1. Pace: You were running 8:00 pace, and have now slowed to 8:10 pace. Not the bible, but a decent sanity check for paces is the Daniels Running Formula. Your 5:36 mile time is a 48 VDOT, which recommends easy pace no faster than 8:45 or so.

No. 5:36 mile equates to 52 VDOT, not 48. His easy pace should be about 8:16/mile. 48 VDOT is 5:36 for 1500m.

Running Formula reader wrote:

Possble Yup wrote:

1. Pace: You were running 8:00 pace, and have now slowed to 8:10 pace. Not the bible, but a decent sanity check for paces is the Daniels Running Formula. Your 5:36 mile time is a 48 VDOT, which recommends easy pace no faster than 8:45 or so.

No. 5:36 mile equates to 52 VDOT, not 48. His easy pace should be about 8:16/mile. 48 VDOT is 5:36 for 1500m.

Well to make matters worse, it was a mile time, not 1600m but it shouldnt really throw too much off.

I just did a 5 mile run at 9:00/mi...thanks for telling me th wrong info.. :/

Running Formula reader wrote:

No. 5:36 mile equates to 52 VDOT, not 48. His easy pace should be about 8:16/mile. 48 VDOT is 5:36 for 1500m.

jacobfrederick wrote:

Well to make matters worse, it was a mile time, not 1600m but it shouldnt really throw too much off.

I just did a 5 mile run at 9:00/mi...thanks for telling me th wrong info.. :/

My sincere apologies. I did make an error on the VDOT. I do think much of my post still stands though, and will explain in a moment.

Thank you to the "running formula reader" for catching my error. I looked at 1500m times column instead of Mile.

Your 5:36 mile is a 52 VDOT. **BUT** Your 1:39 Half marathon is a 45 VDOT. You appear to be weaker as the race distance increases ("aerobically weaker"), which is makes sense due to your short running history, and relatively low mileage.

I was very similar to you a few years ago, and in hindsight, I wish I'd just done my easy runs off of my half-marathon VDOT. I had a significantly faster 5k VDOT (like you with your mile PR) and I kept forcing the faster easy pace, and it held me back. Take from that what you will.

Anyway, Daniels recommends no faster than 8:16 pace based off your mile time, and about 9:17 pace based off your half marathon time. So, your ideal easy pace if likely somewhere between the two.

What was your heartrate on that 9:00 pace run?

It really is better to err on the slow side for easy runs when you are in early base phase and adding in additional mileage. If 9:00 felt good, I'd pay attention to your body's signals. The VDOT is great. HR is great. But your body's signals are #1.

I would be conservative... at least until you start feeling good again and not run down/depressed/sore/etc. Maybe use a) the 8:16-9:17 range... leaning toward the slow side (9:00 pace is NOT going to hurt you... too fast WILL), b) your heartrate (sub 152), and c) how you feel (are you recovering well) & your breathing (could you hold a comfortable conversation on your easy runs?) You will quickly bump to your goal mileage, and it won't take long before you start cruising faster anyway and getting hungry to start adding in some tempo'ish runs a few times a week.

You heart rate certainly indicates to me that your 8:00-8:10 pace was likely too fast. The fact that you weren't handling the 40mpw well at that pace also indicates it was too fast. The fact that your half marathon VDOT suggests 9:17 pace (vs 8:16 pace from mile VDOT) suggests you might be aerobically weak, and could afford to lean towards the slower VDOT for easy runs (I'd guess your faster intervals & repetitions would more match the faster VDOT, since they are at the faster end of the spectrum).

Here is the calculator... so you can check for yourself as your race times improve. (And double check my work - so you don't have to rely on guys like me prone to mistakes. sorry again about that).

**If you put in your 1:39 half marathon, and get the 45 VDOT, notice the marathon pace is 7:57. That matches up pretty well with what I suspected earlier - you were doing all your runs around marathon effort, or even faster. You can often get away with that on 20-30 mpw (I did), but when you start adding more miles it becomes problematic.

Did 9:00 pace feel good, too slow, or something else?

Also, what is your goal race distance?

Sounds like you're running too fast...

Balian wrote:

Your body is adjusting to a 25% mileage increase. You should have gone up around 10% every two weeks.

25% is way too much. Crazy in fact.

Back off to 33 miles a week and after two weeks go to 35. Then after several weeks go to 38 and so forth.

When you get to 40 stay there for a month or two and then if you feel really good start the process again.

go back to runners world Balian.

25% isn't crazy when you are doing 30-40mpw. my 12 yr old sister does 25-30 miles a week. it's like 30 minutes of running a day.

Just saw your post about a mid-May Marathon. If that is your goal race distance, please disregard that question above.

And if so, that Easy pace & Marathon pace are going to be keys for you. And, your Half Marathon VDOT will be much more relevant to your Marathon training than your mile VDOT.

jacobfrederick, you have started to run 2 years ago, so you will need more time. keep up the effort, be patient, run most of your miles easy, 2 fast sessions/week, but a few striders every single day will help. 40 miles isn´t dangerous. listen to your body and when you are ready and ambitious to run more - do so.

read this:

http://pih.bc.ca/summerofmalmo.html

If you cannot handle 40mpw, you have absolutely no business doing a marathon. There's no glory in finishing a marathon aside from what some chumps who know nothing about running will give you. Focus on shorter distances for now and gradually build up your mileage. You have plenty of time to run a marathon.

Raptured wrote:

If you cannot handle 40mpw, you have absolutely no business doing a marathon. There's no glory in finishing a marathon aside from what some chumps who know nothing about running will give you. Focus on shorter distances for now and gradually build up your mileage. You have plenty of time to run a marathon.

Much of this is true, and if the OP isn't dead set on a marathon, it's not a bad approach to stick to the 5k-Half Marathon distance for another year or two. That's the advice I received when I asked the top runner in my area about my own situation, and I am thankful I listened.

But, the OP isn't running a marathon now. He is considering one in mid-May 2014. That is 6 months away and if he builds up his mileage sensibly, it is very likely he can achieve much higher mileage by then.

If he followed up this 6-month marathon training period with a summer/fall 5k-10k cycle, I could see it working out very well for him. Very Lydiard-like.