We're working on our men's recap. It should be up shortly but here is what Jon Gault has tentaively written about the 25th mile. Can you recall a faster split anywhere else?
Quick Take: 4:21 is the fastest mile split we can remember seeing in a marathon
London has seen some great marathoners run some crazy splits through the years, but we can’t remember anything like Kipruto’s 4:21 25th mile (unless you count Yehualaw’s 4:43 for mile 24 in the women’s race today). Back in 2018, the men’s leaders went mad and ran 4:22 for the first mile. But you can at least understand how that happens – everyone is fit and excited, someone gets carried away, and the rest of the field follows. To do it late in the race with the title on the line is a different thing entirely. Many marathoners – including Kipruto – rarely touch 4:21 pace in training.
So how does one run 4:21 that late in the marathon? Well if Kipruto is in 2:02 shape right now and was on 2:05:15 pace at 35k, he likely had a lot left in the tank (though his coach Berardelli was still worried at that point – “to be honest I was a little bit concerned when I realized that the race was getting slower. Amos is very good with a constant pace.”) And a common refrain about the super shoes is that their added cushioning save your legs compared to traditional flats, allowing top athletes to close harder than before. His coach said there is no simple answer.
“It’s a combination of many things,” Berardelli said.
Kipruto trains in one of the strongest groups in Kenya. His training partners include the last two Boston champs, Benson Kipruto and Evans Chebet. Both are running fall marathons (Chicago for Kipruto, NYC for Chebet) and have been keeping up with Amos Kipruto in training.
“I’m expecting good things,” Berardelli said.
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September 29, 2022
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Amos Kipruto ran a 4:21 25th mile today to win London. Is that the fastest mile in marathoning history?
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Didn't Ramaala run a faster mile in NYC the year he just lost to Tergat?
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Didn't Ryan Hall have like a 4:13 split in 2011 Boston?
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There was a Sub 4:20 IIRC at NYC 2006 roughly at mile 16-19... but it was downhill I believe.
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hell no wrote:
Didn't Ryan Hall have like a 4:13 split in 2011 Boston?
Not a legal course though.
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Pikachu wrote:
There was a Sub 4:20 IIRC at NYC 2006 roughly at mile 16-19... but it was downhill I believe.
Yeah they went wild coming off the bridge and onto First Ave. I don’t remember the exact split though. I wouldn’t be surprised if it was 4:20-ish.
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What is with the Italian coaches in Kenya?
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hell no wrote:
Didn't Ryan Hall have like a 4:13 split in 2011 Boston?
https://www.letsrun.com/2011/bostonrrw-tail-0417.php
I seriously doubt that, looking at the 5k/10k/half splits and considering that Mutai’s fastest segment of the race was his final 10k in 28:22.
Aside from the opening mile in London mentioned in the OP, the fastest I’ve “confirmed” is Geoffrey Kamworor/Stanley Biwott/Lelisa Desisa going 4:24 for the 21st mile in NYC 2015.
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I recall someone running 4:18 but I don't remember what race it was. I don't think it was Boston or any other net downhill race.
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rojo wrote:
We're working on our men's recap. It should be up shortly but here is what Jon Gault has tentaively written about the 25th mile. Can you recall a faster split anywhere else?
Quick Take: 4:21 is the fastest mile split we can remember seeing in a marathon
London has seen some great marathoners run some crazy splits through the years, but we can’t remember anything like Kipruto’s 4:21 25th mile (unless you count Yehualaw’s 4:43 for mile 24 in the women’s race today). Back in 2018, the men’s leaders went mad and ran 4:22 for the first mile. But you can at least understand how that happens – everyone is fit and excited, someone gets carried away, and the rest of the field follows. To do it late in the race with the title on the line is a different thing entirely. Many marathoners – including Kipruto – rarely touch 4:21 pace in training.
So how does one run 4:21 that late in the marathon? Well if Kipruto is in 2:02 shape right now and was on 2:05:15 pace at 35k, he likely had a lot left in the tank (though his coach Berardelli was still worried at that point – “to be honest I was a little bit concerned when I realized that the race was getting slower. Amos is very good with a constant pace.”) And a common refrain about the super shoes is that their added cushioning save your legs compared to traditional flats, allowing top athletes to close harder than before. His coach said there is no simple answer.
“It’s a combination of many things,” Berardelli said.Kipruto trains in one of the strongest groups in Kenya. His training partners include the last two Boston champs, Benson Kipruto and Evans Chebet. Both are running fall marathons (Chicago for Kipruto, NYC for Chebet) and have been keeping up with Amos Kipruto in training.
“I’m expecting good things,” Berardelli said.If your statement I marked in bold is true, why? Why wouldn't elite Marathoners do: (6 to 8) x 800m workouts averaging (2:02.5 to 2:05) with 105 seconds recovery once or twice a month for two or three months leading to Marathon? Marathoners, especially elite Marathoners race Marathon as a ratio to their 1500m time. Eg. Your Rod Dixon & M. Farah types raced Marathon about (36.xx to 37.xx) times their 1500m personal best; your Al Sal, Bill Rodgers & Dick Beardsley types raced Marathon close to (32.xx to 33.xx) times their 1500m personal best or 1500m capability.
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Seems like we have had this conversation a few times but here is the last time we talked about a 4:21 split at NYC by Ramalaa.
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GreatDane wrote:
hell no wrote:
Didn't Ryan Hall have like a 4:13 split in 2011 Boston?
Not a legal course though.
No mile split in a marathon is a "legal course." Ryan Hall and the lead pack split 4:23 for mile 3 in the London marathon but it was downhill. Can't think of anything faster than 4:21 off the top of my head.
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R. Johnson's statement, he believes 4:21 mile is rare training pace for elite Marathoners plus the down arrows shows why in aggregate, U.S. male Marathoners, not named Rupp are awful. I recall eight and nine years ago, I asked some local sub-2:35 Marathoners to do (6 or 7) x 800m workouts at 3000m race pace with me. None wanted to. I ended up doing 800m workouts with a professional hockey player. Too many U.S. Marathoners would rather trot (15 to 20) miles than do a decent 800m workout and U.S. Marathoners wonder why.
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Don't want to change the subject or discredit the great performance but... "the fastest mile split in the history of marathon" really only means "fastest mile split in the history of London, Boston, NYC, and Chicago marathons".
Stats like this should stick to metrics unless you think Berlin, Tokyo, Valencia, Amsterdam, Rotterdam, Paris, Milan, Dubai, and etc never produce fast splits.
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600yd/600m man wrote:
R. Johnson's statement, he believes 4:21 mile is rare training pace for elite Marathoners plus the down arrows shows why in aggregate, U.S. male Marathoners, not named Rupp are awful. I recall eight and nine years ago, I asked some local sub-2:35 Marathoners to do (6 or 7) x 800m workouts at 3000m race pace with me. None wanted to. I ended up doing 800m workouts with a professional hockey player. Too many U.S. Marathoners would rather trot (15 to 20) miles than do a decent 800m workout and U.S. Marathoners wonder why.
3k pace is sort of an akward training pace for distance guys. Most are better off running 5k pace for volume.
But I find it hard to believe most marathoners don't occasionally run 5k paced workouts (something like 4:12 for these guys) or 10k (low 4:20s) ones.
RoJo statement might be true for 2:15 guys with their 29 min 10k tmes. I bet most 2:04 guys on the other hand with their low 27 times are a different story
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Pretty damn sure most of the sub 2:05 runners run that pace often.
4:21 is 27:00 pace. For sure they do at least some running at those paces.
It's ridicoulous to think people go out 1:02:14 (4:44-pace) and never training at 4:20. I am pretty sure that everyone out of the lead group is able to run sub 28 (and that is very conservative).
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What about those dudes that get to front of pack in Boston back in the years when there was only like a 60s gap after the pro wave? I remember hearing they had to hit like a 4:00 1500 to get in front of the camera
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CJ Albertson should go for this record at Boston next year.
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Pretty sure Rob De Castella ran around 4.20 for his last mile 83 Rotterdam. 29.20 last 10 k 14.20 last 5 k.
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fkkfkfkfkf wrote:
600yd/600m man wrote:
R. Johnson's statement, he believes 4:21 mile is rare training pace for elite Marathoners plus the down arrows shows why in aggregate, U.S. male Marathoners, not named Rupp are awful. I recall eight and nine years ago, I asked some local sub-2:35 Marathoners to do (6 or 7) x 800m workouts at 3000m race pace with me. None wanted to. I ended up doing 800m workouts with a professional hockey player. Too many U.S. Marathoners would rather trot (15 to 20) miles than do a decent 800m workout and U.S. Marathoners wonder why.
3k pace is sort of an akward training pace for distance guys. Most are better off running 5k pace for volume.
But I find it hard to believe most marathoners don't occasionally run 5k paced workouts (something like 4:12 for these guys) or 10k (low 4:20s) ones.
RoJo statement might be true for 2:15 guys with their 29 min 10k tmes. I bet most 2:04 guys on the other hand with their low 27 times are a different story
You may have seen me post on here several times stating the pace difference from 3000m to 1/2 Marathon, for runners who race in that range is less than the pace difference for 400m & 800m athletes. My 3000m workout, 7 x 800m at 3000m race pace; my 5000m workout, 6 x 1200m at 5000m race pace. Not much difference in pace. Men's world record pace per mile, 3000m, 3:59.xx per mile pace; men's world record pace per mile, 5000m, 4:03.xx per mile pace. I cannot believe elite Marathoners don't run sometime at their 15K pace. Isn't 4:21.xx per mile about 15K racing pace for elite Marathoners? I really hope U.S. Marathoners aren't doing 10 x 800m at Marathon pace once or twice a month and considering that a workout.
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