Why didn't Hunter go to the front?

Just sayin n stuff wrote:

Seriously. If you think you have no chance to get top 3 and are only trying to "get experience", but the race goes out slow as you-know-what, why would you stay in the back? Just start hammering and make everyone run fast. He probably would have finished in the top 10 if he had.

I was surprised to see him behind Saarel and Prakel, since Fisher ripped them pretty bad in a similar race at PAC-12.

Doesn't Hunter have better chances in a faster race in general? Seems to time trial real well.

Literally that was his first professional race that was truly tactical. He might have been gunning for top 8 and thought that the best way to do that was to track it. Certainly not his best result, but he did well to even make the final.

Something I found interesting, and encouraging: his last 800 was run in 1:53.5 (last 400 in 54.5) and ran 3:46. Exactly two years ago, in the Junior Boy's 1500, he ran a 1:54 last 800 and ran 3:58 (last 400 in 53). So he's certainly improving. He was just overmatched by, in order:

The best kicker in the US and perhaps the world

The best tactical 1500 meter runner in the world

a 3:53 miler with 5 years of NCAA experience who ran his best race ever

The best American collegian 1500 runner who was 4th at Olympic Trials

a 3:36 runner who nearly beat Cheserek and ran a great race

a 3:34 flat guy 10 years his senior

One of the fastest NCAA 1500/milers, but a beatable guy theoretically (Prakel)

One of the fastest NCAA 1500/milers, but a beatable guy theoretically (Thompson)

The D2 NCAA Champion, perhaps a beatable guy theoretically (Ribich)

The most talented NCAA runner in recent years, even if he's been hot and cold, perhaps a beatable guy theoretically (Saarel)

That's a very strong lineup. Hunter BEAT (an admittedly injured) Murphy and (a self-sabotaged) Blankenship. Those are two guys one wouldn't expect him to beat. Maybe he could have beaten Saarel, Ribich, Prakel, and Thompson, but there's no reason to expect he'd beat any of them. Three of them are faster than Hunter on paper, and Ribich has years of NCAA experience. Hunter did well not to finish DFL. Knock the learning experience spin all you want, but this really was a learning experience, and he will be a lot smarter for it. It sucks that he has to learn this in the USA final rather than the PAC-12 meet, but that's the way the chips fell for him. Lucky for Hunter, he's 19, and has a very long while to figure out how to place highly. Things will be easier for him once he's running 3:34 or 3:32, not 3:38.

Maybe he wanted experience racing, not rabbiting and getting killed in the final lap

HardLoper wrote:

rabbiting and getting killed in the final lap

That is also racing.

He's what, 19? Hunter's definitely the best distance prospect in the U.S. by far, but he's still young enough to where people shouldn't expect big things yet, I think it will be 1-2 years before he's sniffing a world team. Making the final, for him, already exceeded expectations, and even he knew that.

Has a 19 year old made the final of the 1500 at USA's before this year? Anyone know?

Thank you for the analysis Tinman and congrats on making the final.

Wait, Tinman is posting under that name now?

HS Coach here wrote:

Has a 19 year old made the final of the 1500 at USA's before this year? Anyone know?

Um, ever hear of Jim Ryun?

Ideaman2001 wrote:

Thank you for the analysis Tinman and congrats on making the final.

Yikes, I guess I'm too much of a fanboy. Nope, not Tinman. I'm a 20 year old who raced Hunter semi-regularly in high school (I once only lost to him by a minute). That's it. I haven't even talked to him before.

OK, sure, Jim Ryun, a long time ago, I wasn't even thinking about that long ago, but you are certainly right. How about since? I can't think of anyone, but surely there was someone in between?

HS Coach here wrote:

Has a 19 year old made the final of the 1500 at USA's before this year? Anyone know?

If you are really a HS school coach you might want to learn more about the history of the sport. Not only did Jim Ryun make the Olympic team at age 17, but at 19 he set world record of 3:51.3.

Webb finished 5th in 3:38 as an 18 year old. Tom Byers probably at least made the finals at that age too.

I know plenty about the sport. Sorry I don't have the progression of the 1500m world record memorized as you evidently do. Yes, I am a high school coach, and a successful one. Asked a simple question. Do you know the answer?

Also, ever heard of Jordan Hasay?

There have probably been a few teenaged females who made it, but fewer men.

HS Coach here wrote:

Has a 19 year old made the final of the 1500 at USA's before this year? Anyone know?

Different event, but much more difficult for a youngster, was German Fernandez finishing 5th at USATF 5000m as an 18 year old in 13:25.

Of course that's the year he ran the solo 3:55.0 mile indoors, the 7:47 indoors, and won the NCAA 1500m outdoors (3:39, leading every step).

All at 18-18.7 years old.

Plus the others mentioned above. So let's stop the "only 19" stuff.

Parody of itself wrote:

Literally that was his first professional race that was truly tactical

Are you sure it wasn´t figuratively?

Hunter's big race was just making the final.

Also, Liquori made the Olympic team at 18, and was a top finisher at 19. Tom Beyers. Not sure about Rick Musgrave but he ran fast at 19 or 20. And Dub Meyers.

From a 10 year old LR thread.

Oregonian

RE: Dub Myers??? 7/9/2007 6:24PM - in reply to PDXTrack

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Dub Myers was a great miler. Certainly could have run faster than his 3:37, which he did as a sophomore. Finished second in 1984 to Joaquim Cruz in 3:37 at the 1984 NCAA's as a 19 year old. Ran 3:57 as a Freshman at Oregon. Won the 1983 Junior USATF's over Mike Stahr, and his roomate in college, Harold Kuphaldt.

Classic Dub Myers moment was in the 1984 Olympic Trials. Last lap, three hundred to go, sitting in 10th place, hits the accelerator and goes from 10th at the start of the backstretch to 3rd place and almost running over Steve Scott and Jim Spivey at the end of the backstretch. You could see on the telly that he was wearing fruit of the looms underneath those old Oregon Adidas short they wore back then. Then I think he wasn't sure what to do next because he faded and was passed by Sydney Maree, Chuck Aragon and Tim Hacker. Not bad though for a 19 year old.

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=2006243