Why does 8 minute pace feel the same to me as 6 minute pace?

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  • Confusedrunner212
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 3:31pm CST
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    For me, running is broken down into 3 catorgories: a sprint, a near sprint and a slow jog.

    Sprint: 4-5 min miles
    Near sprint: 6-8 min miles
    Slow jog: 9-12 min miles

    But here’s the thing.. the 4 minite pace feels like exact SAME as the 5 minite pace... the 6 minute pace feels like exact SAME as the 8 minute pace and 9 minute pace feels like exact SAME as 12 minute pace. The only difference is not that I breathe harder or move my legs faster but that I engage my core more.

    6 minute pace and 8 minute pace are two different worlds, so why do they feel the exact SAME to me?
  • ShipYard
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 5:10pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
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    They probably feel the same because you’re new to running, and as such have some misconceptions about different paces. I buy that 4-5 minute pace is all varying levels of sprint to you. I buy that 9-12 is a slow jog (although I’d guess 9 minute pace after an hour feels more difficult than 12 minute pace after an hour). The difference in paces is not due to engaging your core more; it’s due to breathing harder and using your legs more.

    If you spend a little more time running in the 6-8 minute range you’ll discover 8 is much easier than 6. Perhaps each is a little too fast for you right now. So spend more time in the 9-12 minute range developing your strength, and then try again.
  • SDSU Aztec
    registered
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 5:39pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
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    I don't know 6 and 8 minute pace would feel the same to you - maybe an out of body experience? Anyway, your race times are good indicators of what pace you should run. I was a 14:50 runner and did my easy runs at about 6:45.
  • are you elite
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 5:45pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
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    Are you a sub 13 minute 5000m runner?
  • Confusedrunner212
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 6:22pm CST
    re: are you elite
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    are you elite wrote:

    Are you a sub 13 minute 5000m runner?


    Add ten minutes onto that then yes
  • all the same
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 6:38pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
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    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    are you elite wrote:

    Are you a sub 13 minute 5000m runner?


    Add ten minutes onto that then yes


    If 6-minute pace feels the same as your 5K race pace, why not run 18:40 instead of 23:00?
  • Confusedrunner212
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 6:41pm CST
    re: all the same
    Forum Index
    all the same wrote:

    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    are you elite wrote:

    Are you a sub 13 minute 5000m runner?


    Add ten minutes onto that then yes


    If 6-minute pace feels the same as your 5K race pace, why not run 18:40 instead of 23:00?

    Im talking about when I do inetrvals 400m-1600m
  • Romberg
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 6:43pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
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    Because you have neurosyphilis.
  • Confusedrunner212
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 6:56pm CST
    re: Romberg
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    Romberg wrote:

    Because you have neurosyphilis.


    Wtf?
  • changeitup
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 7:18pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
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    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    all the same wrote:

    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    are you elite wrote:

    Are you a sub 13 minute 5000m runner?


    Add ten minutes onto that then yes


    If 6-minute pace feels the same as your 5K race pace, why not run 18:40 instead of 23:00?


    Im talking about when I do inetrvals 400m-1600m


    When I clicked on the thread I thought this would make no sense. But as a new runner, with a 23 minute 5k, and doing interval workouts, ok, I get it.

    Me recommendation would be to do intervals sparingly. Work on more tempo runs and comfortably hard steady state runs. Those will both improve your aerobic fitness and all around run times, and they should also help with your internal pace gauge. Mine was horrible when all I did was intervals, too (way back in HS, thanks coach!).
  • Mustabeenayoungster
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 7:25pm CST
    re: changeitup
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    changeitup wrote:

    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    all the same wrote:

    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    are you elite wrote:

    Are you a sub 13 minute 5000m runner?


    Add ten minutes onto that then yes


    If 6-minute pace feels the same as your 5K race pace, why not run 18:40 instead of 23:00?


    Im talking about when I do inetrvals 400m-1600m


    When I clicked on the thread I thought this would make no sense. But as a new runner, with a 23 minute 5k, and doing interval workouts, ok, I get it.

    Me recommendation would be to do intervals sparingly. Work on more tempo runs and comfortably hard steady state runs. Those will both improve your aerobic fitness and all around run times, and they should also help with your internal pace gauge. Mine was horrible when all I did was intervals, too (way back in HS, thanks coach!).


    Yes, we probably do get some real young kids who are confused with many things running.
  • Romberg
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 7:30pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
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    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    Romberg wrote:

    Because you have neurosyphilis.


    Wtf?


    From your thread title, I gathered that you are having trouble with proprioception.
  • Confusedrunner212
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 7:48pm CST
    re: Romberg
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    Romberg wrote:

    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    Romberg wrote:

    Because you have neurosyphilis.


    Wtf?


    From your thread title, I gathered that you are having trouble with proprioception.


    Well I’ve never heard of that, what made you come to that conclusion just out of interest?
  • Romberg
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 8:00pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
    Forum Index
    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    Romberg wrote:

    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    Romberg wrote:

    Because you have neurosyphilis.


    Wtf?


    From your thread title, I gathered that you are having trouble with proprioception.


    Well I’ve never heard of that, what made you come to that conclusion just out of interest?


    I’ve decided that I don’t actually think that you have neurosyphilis. If you’re worried, stand with your feet together and close your eyes. If you can do this without falling over, you probably don’t have neurosyphilis.
  • Confusedrunner212
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 8:07pm CST
    re: Romberg
    Forum Index
    Yeah I can do that without falling over easy, my balance is probably about average... certainly not great but not bad enough to cause me any issues. Thing is, I find it just as hard to do 20-30 min run at 8 min mile pace or 4 miles worth of 7:30-8:00 intervals (800m-1200m) as I do to do 6-10 x 400m at 6:00 pace with 1 min rest. Am I just more anaerobically conditioned? I am not exactly new to running. I am 23 and have been running since 17. I am female, I usually beat boys over 100m-800m but get my @ss handed to me in 5k/10k runs (even park runs).
  • changeitup
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 8:41pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
    Forum Index
    Confusedrunner212 wrote:

    Yeah I can do that without falling over easy, my balance is probably about average... certainly not great but not bad enough to cause me any issues. Thing is, I find it just as hard to do 20-30 min run at 8 min mile pace or 4 miles worth of 7:30-8:00 intervals (800m-1200m) as I do to do 6-10 x 400m at 6:00 pace with 1 min rest. Am I just more anaerobically conditioned? I am not exactly new to running. I am 23 and have been running since 17. I am female, I usually beat boys over 100m-800m but get my @ss handed to me in 5k/10k runs (even park runs).


    I stand by what I said before (even if you're not new to running). More miles. More tempo/uptempo work. You are aerobically unfit. Lots of people can gut out 10 x 400 at a fast pace. And those same people will get their @ss handed to them if they are not aerobically fit.

    If you've got the speed to beat the guys at shorter distances, that is awesome. Now work on extending that speed.
  • Confusedrunner212
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 9:05pm CST
    re: changeitup
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    I agree to be honest. A couple of months ago I was running 7-8mpw of nothing but sprinting or fast anaerobic intervals 3x a week. Since october I have built up to 25-30mpw (I plan to keep building to 50mpw and beyond and eventually get my mile to 5:30 and go sub 20 in the 5k by next winter). Ive been running 40-45 min per day and doing that at 9-10 min pace but still do 400/800 workouts. I still struggle with tempo work so I am going to incorporate more 25 min runs and mile repeats over the next month.
  • amkelley
    registered
    1 year ago 12/15/2018 9:48pm CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
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    8-minute pace now (age 60) feels about like 6-minute pace did at age 30. I don't think this is what the OP had in mind, though.
  • changeitup
    1 year ago 12/16/2018 7:50am CST
    re: Confusedrunner212
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    This sounds good. And it will help with your goals. While you're building mileage, you can even consider cutting all the longer speed sessions. Just add miles, work on building up to a 90 minute long run once a week, do a tempo-ish run once or sometimes twice a week. Then for your speed, just do some strides two days a week. They'll keep your running economy up but they won't burn you out in anyway as you adjust to the different training.

    It will take a little time, but I can see you hitting those time goals.
  • stateroftheoblivious
    1 year ago 12/16/2018 11:56am CST
    re: changeitup
    Forum Index
    I have noticed a similar experience when going from about 9:20 to 8:00 pace.

    I attribute it to a change in form efficiency.
    At 9:20 my foot is striking ahead of my center of balance and I am not only pounding wasted energy into the ground, i am slowing myself down.
    At 8:00 my foot is more under my center of balance and I am not wasting that energy or slowing down as much.

    So running 8:00 can seem easier and feel smoother than running 9:20.

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    Another possibility is that you have some neurological condition which alters your sense of pain.

    Kayla Montgomery experienced this. But it was from Multiple Sclerosis and she would collapse after the finish line.
    If you are not doing that then it could be something else. Hopefully benign.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dvKjPzU39o