US XC Nationals in Boulder? Huh?

OK. I'll bite. Why not?

Altitude? It's not like people are trying to run PRs in XC (or if they are, they're goofy anyway). Also, it's not like it's Mexico City type altitude.

Snow? More likely for there NOT to be snow here. If there IS snow, it can be plowed from the course (as they were prepared to do yesterday if necessary). Or...gasp, runners might have to run in "the elements" during a XC race. It couldn't be any worse than last year in Indy.

The positives:

- Easy to get to (Denver International Airport)

- A very supportive running community, one of the meccas of distance running. This will draw more people than a lot of areas for both competing and spectating.

- A great place to visit, which is attractive to people taking trips.

What do other people think?

I say it's about time, and let's work on it!

BDG

Boudler would be a GREAT place for Nationals. The weather here is usually very nice. Right now it is 68 degrees and sunny. I guess the altitude might be tough for people coming from sea level, but I think that it would make the race more strategic.

I was discussing this topic this morning (after reading that quote), and we were trying to come up with good sites for courses. While I like CU's Buffalo Ranch course, it's not ideal, as most people consider the surface too hard (very little or no grass) and rocky. Yesterday's course is fine for a smaller race, but there would be issues with a big field. There wouldn't need to be a huge space, as the criterium style courses seem to be the current preference. Any ideas?

BDG

BDG wrote: There wouldn't need to be a huge space, as the criterium style courses seem to be the current preference. Any ideas?

Could maybe make a 2K loop out of the soccer field(s) area near Kalmia and 47th, but that's going to be flat and boring. Or something near Wonderland Lake made partly of trails and green belt. Some hills there to spice things up too. Or perhaps Lake Valley might not mind having some fairways chewed up.

I'm thinking all the people in support of this idiotic idea either come from boulder/some other high altitude place or have never tried to do a workout at altitude and dont understand its effects

I do, i have family up in the denver area and go up there once every summer or so and as thats in the middle of the base training phase...i try and keep up with my running

lets describe it...for the first 3 days or so its a mightly struggle to complete a 5 mile jog

after that I can do that but forget any type of intervals and ill laugh my ass off if anyone even suggests racing

it takes at least a month to get acclimated to altitude enough to where you could be in anything close to a condition to race in and after that ud be good...but its not practical to expect all the sealevel runners to try to get p there a month early or do enough high altitude work to already be used to it

if u have nationals in boulder u eliminate any chance of a sea level runner qualifying, which is simply not a fair way to pick the team to worlds

The soccer fields have been used for a nice race in the past that Chuck Trujillo put on, but I don't know how interested they are in letting those fields get beaten up.

The issue with Wonderland Lake is probably the biggest issue with having off road races in general in Boulder. The open space is almost exclusively off limits for racing. The only open space like area that is fair game is the Boulder Res area, but I don't think that would work too well for a good XC race.

Maybe bringing it to Boulder should actually be somewhere just outside of Boulder (Boulder county). Otherwise we need to find the right park with some variety and some wide areas for a start/finish.

BDG

Dude, You must be in very poor shape or weigh 300 lbs., I moved to Boulder many years ago and was able to maintain the training i was doing at the time without any trouble. The altitde was noticable on the uphills and since i was just doing mileage at the time i had no ill effects.

I also raced a 5k in Denver the the morning after i arrived, felt fine til the last 1/2 mile, then it hit. But i wasn't in 5k racing shape anyway.

I hear your points, but here's my issues with your thinking (and I realize you're not alone):

A. Why is it that it's OK to have XC Nationals or the Olympic T&F Trials in areas with high humidity? Is that fair to runners who live and train in low humidity areas (hmmm...like Boulder for example)?

B. One certainly does NOT need to live at 5200' of altitude to be ready to race well.

C. I'm not suggesting that the meet be here every year. Look at the issues that took place at the last 2 meets: you had the over-the-top mudbath in Houston (where are you from???), and the ice covered course in Indy. While everyone had to deal with the same issues, those meets were far less than ideal.

BDG

Ok, so maybe the average recreational runner has a real hard time even training at alt., but give me a break, it is not that hard. Anyone with a sac and in racing shape (any real contenders at nationals) is going to be able to race alright up in boulder or wherever they go. So yeah, no one will probably PR, but if you are looking to PR, go race on a golf course in florida. That course in Portland this year was real fast...

Sorry, on my point B. I meant to say:

One certainly does NOT need to live at 5200' of altitude for a month to be ready to race well. Elite and non-elite runners alike have done quite well on less than a week (or just days in some cases) at the Bolder Boulder. Yes, I live in Boulder County, but like most of us, I'm not from here originally.

BDG

How about Ft. Collins?

The soccer fields in N. Boulder would be a neat place to hold an XC meet, but judging from the fence height around the fields, I doubt that it would ever happen.

I personally hate the Buffalo Ranch for the reasons that BDG has already stated.

CO-Runner wrote:

How about Ft. Collins?

The soccer fields in N. Boulder would be a neat place to hold an XC meet, but judging from the fence height around the fields, I doubt that it would ever happen.

I personally hate the Buffalo Ranch for the reasons that BDG has already stated.

Just to clarify. I actually enjoy the Buffalo Ranch course, but I'm aware that some people don't (like CO-Runner) or have issues with it. What I like about the Buff Ranch course:

- It's not flat - there's a variety of hills on the course.

- It's a dedicated (and marked) XC course that's open to the public.

- Not all XC courses need to be on grass.

- Not all courses need to be criterium style (although the Buff Ranch course is fairly spectator friendly without it).

- XC courses should be different. I'm fine with park courses, golf course courses, and dedicated areas for XC.

All that being said, I don't think it's what USATF is looking for in a Nationals course.

BDG

Sorry, I should have been more clear - I'm one of those that doesn't like it because it is rocky and there isn't any/much grass. ;-)

NO! Everyone MUST love the CU course. No exceptions, CO-Runner.

BDG

Isn't the lower loop of Buff Ranch just short of 2K? Maybe it could be stretched to a full 2K with some zig-zag stunt in the lower, flat area and/or a widening of a couple turns.

There are a few hotels within a couple miles of the place, with a Days Inn just on the other side of Foothills. Maybe the Harvest House would be willing to provide continuous shuttle service if they were the meet hotel.

The Buff Ranch course has its own set of advantages - a good hill, measured, set on a large enough property where its not going to bug anyone but ...it is fairly rocky and about as hard as any road, and in some places as hard as a side walk. To Tim's point, it is probably not what USATF is looking for.

The more I think about it, the more I think the biggest issue in getting a race to come to Boulder would be the city itself. I doubt the city would let hundreds of runners trample over Valmont or Platts Hollow. In fact - thinking about it now - its pretty impressive that Pete was able to swing yesterday's event.

Hey - Pete - nice job yesterday. I found that course to be a bit harder than I would have expected with the sand, the side hill running and that crazy set of turns around the tennis courts. It was good to get out and see everyone. Let us know if we can help get that thing going in the fall too.

GZ

Isn't a high school regional race held somewhere in Boulder? That could be a possible location.

That would be BDG's favorite course. ;-)

Will wrote:

Isn't a high school regional race held somewhere in Boulder? That could be a possible location.

That would be Buffalo Ranch