Hall ran 2h runs at 4:45min/mi pace IN TRAINING

You know something , I think the guy is ready this time around , I think he will surprise , Im excited for him and the shot and getting it right.

GoHall wrote:

I get so confused when I see people on a distant running message board speak ...

Come a little bit closer

You're my kind of man

So big and so strong

Come a little bit closer

I'm all alone

And the night is so long

it is interesting that guys are running near marathon pace for 2 hours plus.

i don't understand it. but cannova is talking about some impressive efforts nearly equivalent to a marathon in 208 or something like that.

i think the idea is to see how many 44x miles you can do 3 days a week and recover and build.

instead of the 2 hour near marathon in practice, maybe try 2 or 3 runs on hard days of 10 to 15 k at 44x mile pace. and the next day would surely be focused recovery.

it's a brave new world out there, super elite marathon training. a new dimension.

longjack wrote:

it is interesting that guys are running near marathon pace for 2 hours plus.

i don't understand it. but cannova is talking about some impressive efforts nearly equivalent to a marathon in 208 or something like that.

i think the idea is to see how many 44x miles you can do 3 days a week and recover and build.

instead of the 2 hour near marathon in practice, maybe try 2 or 3 runs on hard days of 10 to 15 k at 44x mile pace. and the next day would surely be focused recovery.

it's a brave new world out there, super elite marathon training. a new dimension.

How do you suppose the body will be ready for 26 miles at 4:4x/mi pace when you've only been asking it to do 6-9 milers at that pace a few times per week? This is a bonk waiting to happen.

Running 4% slower than race pace for the race distance in training makes a good deal more sense from a physiological standpoint, especially for races that require the body to spare glycogen.

As an example, I would have much more confidence in running a 15:00 5K in a race off of running a 15:40 5K in training once a week versus running 1200 to 1600 meters at 4:48/1600 pace 2-3 times a week.

As he come down from altitude too early? He's in the pictures from last week. Someone on here mentioned you lose much of the benefit if you come down more than a few days before your race.

It makes sense to an extend. Being at 9000 feet, the "Marathon effort" is obviously much slower than 4:45 and therefore the impact on his legs.

The impact on the cardiovascular system on the other hand would be identical than a Marathon.

This, in my opinion is mostly psychological ("burn out"). So if he is able to handle it, ok...

We'll see on Monday.

sub240 wrote:

It makes sense to an extend. Being at 9000 feet, the "Marathon effort" is obviously much slower than 4:45 and therefore the impact on his legs.

The impact on the cardiovascular system on the other hand would be identical than a Marathon.

This, in my opinion is mostly psychological ("burn out"). So if he is able to handle it, ok...

We'll see on Monday.

4:45 sea level is worth about 5:10 at 9000'. Definitely less abuse on the legs. Not exactly identical on the cardiovascular system, otherwise there'd be no point in training at altitude; it's tougher on the cardiovascular system.

Psychological "burn out" is very closely related to nervous system exhaustion.

I think Ryan will have a good run, but will never be in contention for the win because he'll let a gap open up immediately and just run at his own pace. Or at least that's what he's always seemed to have done in the past. That loses him about 2:00-2:30 over the course of the marathon, assuming those he could run in a pack with didn't completely fry him up. That's the risk you have take with the marathon, though. If you want to win, you have to go all in and run with the front group. If you can't do that, the best hope is to play it safe and hope for 2nd or 3rd at best.

I would be so pumped if Ryan won Boston. In fact, I would go to church the rest of that week and sing praise to Saint Ryan de Gran Oso.

Nellie wrote:

You know something , I think the guy is ready this time around , I think he will surprise , Im excited for him and the shot and getting it right.

He's not going to ever win Boston if the big boys show up. He doesn't have the talent and his form is awful for a professional marathoner.

I am writing to support Ryan Hall in hopes more people will continue to post positive messages.

I knew Ryan when he was 14-15yo running 55 sec,2:02+, and 4:20's . To see him healthy and claim he has had the best 2 yrs of training says a lot coming from a kid who would run up Snow Summit double black diamond runs multiple times by himself.

We should be cheering him on in hopes of pushing one of our best American distance runners ever.

Holly Yuya wrote:

Halleluja wrote:

That is truly remarkable.

Not so remarkable once you understand that Gerry Lindgren was acting as pacemaker and the efforts must go down as aided.

I wish him luck at Boston and would think of it as a win for him if he made it to the Framingham Dairy Queen with out injury.

If Gerry Lindgren ran marathon pace of 2 hours he would actually run more than a marathon.

*for

GoHall wrote:

I get so confused when I see people on a distant running message board speak so critically of America's best distant runner -- EVER.

Ryan Hall, is Khalid Khannouchi?

Have you ever watched him race??? Do you not remember Boston when he took the lead and the winner told interviewers that Ryan MADE the race? Do you not recall London when he was with the lead group and told the pacers to SPEED UP??? Where are you coming up with this BS? Ryan is a fierce competitor. You are ill-informed

sub240 wrote:

I think Ryan will have a good run, but will never be in contention for the win because he'll let a gap open up immediately and just run at his own pace. Or at least that's what he's always seemed to have done in the past. That loses him about 2:00-2:30 over the course of the marathon, assuming those he could run in a pack with didn't completely fry him up. That's the risk you have take with the marathon, though. If you want to win, you have to go all in and run with the front group. If you can't do that, the best hope is to play it safe and hope for 2nd or 3rd at best.

J.R. wrote:

GoHall wrote:

I get so confused when I see people on a distant running message board speak so critically of America's best distant runner -- EVER.

Ryan Hall, is Khalid Khannouchi?

You can only count his accomplishments for which he was a US citizen -- can't have it both ways -- but in any case, Ryan has a faster all-time PR in 5k, HM, and slightly slower marathon if you only coins his London. So no, you are not correct.

sub240 wrote:

That's the risk you have take with the marathon, though. If you want to win, you have to go all in and run with the front group. If you can't do that, the best hope is to play it safe and hope for 2nd or 3rd at best.

I disagree. In the last two years, both Wesley Korir and Kebede have won major marathons by letting the field gap them and coming back. It's not really a matter of risk... if you can't go with the pace you shouldn't.

The answer when asked such a question before a big race: "If I tell you, I'll have to kill you."

Khalid Khannouchi became a naturalized citizen of the United States on May 2, 2000.

2002

London Marathon, winner in world record time (2:05:38)

Chicago Marathon, winner (2:05:56), becoming the first man in history to break 2:06 twice in one year

Ranked as the number #1 marathoner in the world by Track & Field News and their American Athlete of the Year.

For some reason I can't picture him in the front group. Maybe Beijing got burned into my head? I'll have to watch his big Boston performance again, thanks for the heads up.

HardLoper wrote:

sub240 wrote:

That's the risk you have take with the marathon, though. If you want to win, you have to go all in and run with the front group. If you can't do that, the best hope is to play it safe and hope for 2nd or 3rd at best.

I disagree. In the last two years, both Wesley Korir and Kebede have won major marathons by letting the field gap them and coming back. It's not really a matter of risk... if you can't go with the pace you shouldn't.

You are absolutely correct, of course, if the pace is too hot it's suicide. What troubles me is watching guys run alone much of the way and hit a 2:08-2:10, when the winner runs with a pack and finishes in 2:05. The energetic output is quite similar for the two performances.