Road Racing and Training Thread - Week Ending 11/17

Once again i have returned from the unknown to post... Only this time thee is a strong reason!

Today was the day of my race... The Leeds Abbey Dash 10K, possibly the fastest 10K here in the UK. This years race saw 14 sub 30s and a whole host of ridiculously quick times. I have the pleasure of calling this the best race i have ever competed in (taking part and winning small 5k parkruns is all fine and dandy but competing with the elite is a whole new level). Anyway before i get carried away, heres the story:

32:49114th place Previous 10K best 34:06!!

I don't think it has sunk in yet just how amazed i am by this performance! Jumping from 34 straight to 32 is a massive confidence boosterb. . I think the key to this for me personally has been focusing purely on speed rather than mileage. When i joined my new club in May, the number one reason was so i could train with faster guys and i have not been let down. Today has shown that this 20 year old has lots more to give to the running world!

I will start to post my training on the forum on a regular basis once again as the XC season comes. I look forward to sharing and getting some insight on how old faces are doing :)

Nice job on the marathon pacing stone cutter. Solid week too by the looks of things!

Nice week guys! Here's mine:

M - 9/4 double

T - AM: 4mi. PM: 3mi w/u. Fartlek of 3,2,1,3,2,1,2 with 1min off.

W - 4/5 double

R - AM: 4mi. PM: 3mi w/u. Fartlek of 1min/1min for 4mi. 5:30/mile avg.

F - 4/4 double

S - AM: 4mi. PM: 3mi w/u. 2x800 w/200mjog. 3x1mi w/800mjog. 2x800m w/400mjog. 3mi c/d.

S - 5/3 double

Total: 84

Pretty good week with three workouts. Tuesday went so-so, really just running by feel. Thursday went pretty well averaging 5:30 for 4miles. Saturday was the last hard goal pace workout. I had splits of 2:26, 2:27, 5:00, 5:00, 5:02, 2:30, 2:28. Short rest on the first set of 800s got my legs a little tired but I was able to really lock in to goal 10k pace which I'm pleased about. Solid volume this week despite cutting down the mileage on recovery days. I'm looking forward to my goal race! I hope everyone has a great week!

I hope everyones races went well today and good luck to those racing tonight. I know GarbageDisposal is doing Vegas tonight.

The Stone Cutter nice job on pacing your buddy and glad to hear that his race went well and he came in right around his target time. Awesome to hear your other friend with a 22 min PR. Solid week overall!

dcrunner0910-Huge congrats on the PR, especially with the time you shaved off your previous best! I cant believe 32:49 is 100+ place, definitely a fast race. Welcome back to the thread, looking forward to seeing you post again.

Forcerunner-Great week. I know by definition it is whatever you feel like but do you plan your Fartlek workouts in advance or make them up during the run?

Weekly: 51.4

YTD: 2,794.3

Goal: try to get healthy and build base over the next 6 weeks and jump in a few races for fun

Mon: 6 Recovery @ 7:40

Tues: 7 Recovery @ 7:34

Weds: 8 E @ 7:16

Thurs: 5 E @ 7:04

Fri: 7 E @ 7:19 in Denver

Sat: 8 E @ 7:24

Sun: 10 E @ 7:06, Set out for 12 but run short because left shin was really bothering me and no need to push it at this point with no races

This was a planned easy week after Savannah marathon last weekend. My left shin is still nagging but it's runnable. I've been doing core work and foam rolling like crazy so hopefully that pays off.

nice workout yesterday Forcerunner

way to help out some runners Stone Cutter, it's always fun to pace people who aren't falling apart too badly.

my week, nearing the end of the season.

M 9 @7:28

T 11 w/5x1mi dropping down. 5:33, 5:29, 5:19, 5:13, 5:07. grass loop, poor footing. probably 10-15sec slower than track.

W 5/4 double, both slow.

Th 8.2 @7:22

F 12x400 in 72-75, 200m rec in ~55sec. easy workout, really wanted to do extra but coach said no. beer mile in pm

Sa 6 @7:26, skipped my planned second run.

Su 13.1 @7:39. point-to-point, which is fun, but it was 100% roads, so my legs were taking a beating. I never do more than a couple miles at a time on roads.

total 66.8 @7:22

7 days out from PAUSATF XC champs in san francisco. not even excited about this race, as my season hasn't been great. not even sure what would be a good race for me. i'll probably just hang onto some teammates

goal: 15:59 5000m (spring)

goal: 4:10 1500m (spring)

m: no am run, 3 mi wu/cd, 12 x 400m w/ 200m rest

t: 4 mi, 4 mi

w: 8 mi, 4 mi

th: 4 mi, 3 mi wu/cd, 4 mile tempo

fri: 4 mi, 5 mi

sat: 13 mi (6:55/mi)

sun: 3 mi

monday workout: felt good. slowest was 79, fastest was 75, most were averaged right around 77. it set me up for a great thursday workout. i don't know how to tell what sort of shape im in with this workout though.

thursday: big day for me. 24:01 for 4 miles. if you look back at my training about a month ago, i was running 6:20 for tempo. big big jump, especially because I've only broken 18 for 3 miles 3 times in my life, so to do it in a tempo really excites me. i went 6:06, 6:00, 5:58, 5:55. i felt good and strong, and starting conservatively really helped a lot.

would anyone be able to semi-accurately judge what sort of shape i'm in for a 5k?

comments coming later, but for now:

stone cutter: how did you like that workout? and nice job with the pacing duties, it always feels great to help someone reach their goal!

dcrunner: wow, that's one hell of a pr. congrats! and 114th place? jeez, talk about a fast one! i gotta check that one out.

forcerunner: nice volume as always. when do you plan on lowering your mileage? just for tapering?

Goal: recover from last week, good mileage, 1 hard workout

Goal race: 38:30 10km on 11/23

Mon = off

Tues = 5 easy w doggie (8:15)

Wed = off

Thurs= 8 with 5x mile (6:40/6:21/6:01/6:23/5:39), plus 30 minutes cross train

Fri = 4 easy-ish (8:05)

Sat = 10 with some hills (8:13)

Sun = 60 minutes cross train

Total= 27 miles

Thursday went really well. 1 minute rest between intervals. Plan was 6:40/6:20/6:00/5:40 but the 6:00 felt easier than I expected, so I added another interval at 6:20 before going on to my final mile. 5:40 is the 2nd fastest mile I've run in over a year and didn't feel all that hard, which gave me great confidence looking ahead to next Saturday 10km race with goal pace of ~6:12.

Saturday 10 miler felt really easy and heart-rate was low, so I'm very happy with that.

1 more hard workout in the middle of next week then go-time on Saturday.

Hope everyone had a good week. Cheers.

Stonecutter Wow Congrats to your buddy. a 22min PR is crazy. No doubt a Sub 3 for him next time.

DCRunner Man that is an impressive jump in your 10k. Very nice indeed. 114th with that time reminds me of when I started running and that was the type of depth at every race.

Force Solid workouts. That last one with the 800's and miles looks great. Think your race will rock.

CMM Meh nothing like a little 50+ recovery week after a marathon. Take care of that shin.

Reed you left out the most important stat! What was the result of the beer mile?

Ramanujan Nice cutdown tempo. You have come a ways since only breaking 18min 3x. I am guesssing you can now do that on any day you care. 400's look good as well. How long do you take to cover the 200m recovery?

My week

Goal: HM Mid March time: TBD

Mon unplanned day off

Tue 7.5mi (inclu 1 x 800 and 8 x 400)

Wed 6.5 @ 7:28

Thu off (unplanned)

Fri off (unplanned)

Sat 6.5 @ 7:28

Sun 10.65 @ 7:11

Weekly Total: 31mi

Tues: I have not done anything like this in about 17yrs. I did a pretty hard 3mi w/up then an all out 800 TT (2:14) 10min walk/jog/talk then 8 x 400 with a 55-60sec recov. 1st one in 73 then pretty much rest in 75.

Next day my calves were pretty tight(sorta expected) but then on Thursday still a little sore so I decided to play it safe and took 2 days off. My calves are what derailed me when I made my "comeback" about 6wks ago. Figure 2 days now is better than 2 months later.

dcrunner, forgot to congradulate you on your massive 10k PR. in ~11 days i plan to have my own breakthrough at 10k, at least 2 minutes off.

perkunas, if your goal race is next saturday, you shouldnt do any more hard workouts. tuesday should just be an easy session, maybe 800s at goal pace or a fartlek.

ramanujan, hard to gauge fitness off of those 400s for sure, but 6:00 for a tempo run probably gets you about 17 flat for 5k depending on how hard that tempo was for you.

I didn't have time to comment on other people's training last week. I'm really sorry. This keeps happening.

Regionals are in a week for me and nationals are in four. This was my week:

Monday: 8.5 miles at 8:12 pace. Fatigued. Slow, tired, and sore, but no injury pains at all.

Tuesday: Hilly 6.5 at 7:59 with strides at the end. Relaxed and strong. Core in the evening.

Wednesday AM: 5 at 7:57, also relaxed.

Wednesday PM: Practice, 10.5 total with 5 x 1200 with 2:00 rest alternating "slow" and fast, some jogging into 5 x 30 second hills with 2:00 rest. 1200s were 4:34 / 4:28 / 4:35 / 4:27 / 4:32. Faster than my group was supposed to go but I felt amazing, like a new person, like I had a gear I didn't know about on the fast ones. Hills felt fast and strong. I did strength, box jumps, and high step-ups after.

Thursday: 8.5 at 7:58 pace. Easy. Legs tired but otherwise OK. Core in the evening.

Friday: 8 at 8:05 pace. Pick-ups at the end. A little tired. Hungry.

Saturday: Practice, 10 total with 3 x 8 minute hilly loop. I don't really know the exact pace, I don't think that was the point, but my last one was faster and my quarter split was like 92 for all of them. I would guess ~6:15-6:20 with the giant hill (not soapbox) which was the kind of hill I struggle with (steep, dirt). Probably good for what I need to work on. I was tired, though, feeling this week.

Sunday: 16 just under 8:00 pace, mostly with the group, a little alone. Felt decent, but tired at the end.

It was my second week in a row at 73, so the most I've ever done in two weeks. It was good until late this week, then it caught up to me, and now I'm tired.

Debating between cutting back a LOT next week (like 35-45 at most) or just a little at the end of the week (probably 45-50 total). I think at this point I'm tired enough and have enough work behind me that I might benefit from a larger cutback, plus I really want to run well at this meet. But it just feels lazy, and nationals should be my real focus.

I've been going through some emotional stuff outside of running and work which is making things a bit more difficult. I am trying to get on top of it.

PF has been a bit better and I got more involved with my club's board so that was fun. Nice to see the inner workings of my club and how much they do to support up-and-coming runners.

Hope everyone who had raced this weekend killed it! Here's my week:

Goal Race: USA Half Champs. / January

Mon- 8 miles at 7:20 pace / 4 miles at 7:30 pace. Weights.

Tue- 8 miles at 7:06 pace / 4 miles at 7:33 pace. Strides.

Wed- 13 miles. 9 mile tempo avg. 5:20. (5:39, 5:34, 5:33, 5:25, 5:22, 5:19, 5:15, 5:09, 4:55).

Thur- 8 miles at 7:19 pace / 4 miles at 7:34 pace. Weights.

Fri- 8 miles at 7:20 pace / 4 miles at 7:20 pace. Strides.

Sat- 18 mile long run. 6:29 avg. Tried progressing the last 6-8 miles. Only avg. 5:50 pace.

Sun- 9 miles at 7:37 pace / 4 miles at 7:41 pace. Weights.

Total- 92

Not a bad week. The tempo on Tue was probably the thing that stood out. The conditions sucked so I was very open minded when starting it. The combination of cold and windy weather. Just started slow and worked into it. Finished strong. The long run didn't really go as planned Sat. I couldn't get the legs to go faster then 5:45 pace in the progression. Nothing to worry about. Bad days come and I haven't really had one yet so I'll take it. I will be tempo'ing a turkey trot 10k. I can't miss the thanksgiving tradition!

I will comment later.

dcrunner, that is a HUGE PR. Congrats!!! That is a very big deal.

Some great stuff going on this week!:

dcrunner - Holy Moses, man! Most of us mere mortals are trying to shave a minute or so off of HM-Marathon times - you're busting out a 1:17 10K PR! Beautiful running - you've really stepped up your game this year. I am glad to see the benefits of your new club already paying off huge.

Forcerunner - you've gotta be feeling VERY confident right now. That Saturday workout was perfect.

cmm268 - I might consider running every other day for 7-10 days to see if that added rest gives your shin time to heal, especially since you are in a down period. You could cross-train (elliptical, bike, pool) on the off days, but I would just be interested to see if extra time off running would take care of it now while you have no races on the schedule rather than trying to run through it. Just a thought. Can't be believe you got in 50mi+ in the week after a SECOND marathon! :)

reed - it sounds like you don't have high expectations going into XC Champs next week, but maybe that's what you need. I like what I am hearing about still feeling hungry on those 12x400s with moderate recoveries. You might surprise yourself and pop one out of nowhere.

Ramanjuan - I think you are right in 17:00-17:15 territory as we speak. I ran a 17:24 off similar workout ability back in September, but in warm conditions off HM-specific training. With more speed-oriented training, you might be closer to 17:00.

And I think you missed my recap of your "5 Gear" workout in last week's thread (let's see if I can cut and paste it without screwing up the formatting):

The "5 Gear Workout," as Ramanujan describes it, is a 25:00 continuous tempo run comprised of 5x 5:00 sets. Each set has 5 paces that last for 1:00 each. The paces I had planned were 7:30/7:00/6:30/6:00/5:30/mi, which roughly equate to my long run/moderate/marathon/half-marathon/5k paces.

Here's how I did for the sets (which I ran on the road using a Garmin):

7:21/6:35/6:28/5:53/5:31

7:26/7:00/6:14/6:00/5:32

7:28/6:48/6:26/5:59/5:30

7:28/6:50/6:27/5:59/5:29

7:26/6:51/6:30/5:56/5:30

The workout is challenging because there is a tendency to switch straight from Gear 1 to Gear 3 - I kept finding myself having to slow down for each Gear 2 segment. By the time you get to Gear 5 pace, you feel like you are really flying, even though it is "just" 5K pace. I imagine this would make for a great XC workout, as you can practice surges and hit goal pace during the workout without overly taxing yourself.

I averaged 6:21/mi overall for the 25:00, which is a tad faster than marathon pace for me. I am sure there are multiple benefits from this kind of workout, aside from just breaking up the monotony of a 25:00 tempo run.

I would highly recommend it as a base workout (how I used it) for 5K-Marathon runners who are looking to re-introduce turnover without killing themselves, as an in-season workout for 5K or XC runners to practice surges, or for anyone who likes something new.

Perkunas - good luck next week!

qrkid - that's a fast 800m to just uncork at the start of a workout! Pretty good sign that you managed 75s after that. Next time though, I would recommend the opposite - do your 400s, take a mile recovery jog, and then see what you have left for an 800. Less risk of injury that way since your muscles are already primed.

xenonscreams - for what it's worth, I am going to be experimenting with my upcoming training cycle working off of 4 week blocks: 3 higher volume workout weeks (65-80/mi) backed up with a recovery cutback week of easy runs and strides(44-48/mi). As my pseudo-coach explains it, the recovery week allows for you body to make the proper adaptations from the volume/workouts. I hope he is right. Maybe you can be my guinea pig. :)

Runnersfix - I like how you worked into your tempo run in crummy weather. I have been doing that a lot lately on my medium runs (10mi+). And that's still a good "bad" workout you had on Saturday. You have the right attitude.

Comments first, my week later.

Stone Cutter - Glad to see you out enjoying the running in Phily. Itoo am thinking about doing that 5 gear workout during this cycle.

DCRunner - Super congrats on the 32 10k. At 20 years old, you've got the world ahead of you. You'll need new goals soon.

Forceruner - Very nice week. What is your goal race?

CMM268 - Slacker! What is this, you have one good race and start taking it easy? Just kidding. I'm still bowled over by your Savannah race.

Reed - Hope the season ends well for you. Or, just go right into the holidays and start anew in 2014.

Ramanujan - Just keep working on it. Improvement comes in bunches. My bet is that you are in high 17, low 18 5k shape right now.

Perkunas - I think with one more good workout you can grab the 38:30. good luck.

qrkid - I'm worried that your focusing on track stuff without enough miles under you. That's what led to my calf strain when I first got back into training again in 2009.

xenonscreams - I've found that I don't do well with too much of a taper. Maybe just cut back to one workout on race week. By the way, things are never going as well or as bad as you think. Hang tough and roll with it.

RunnersFix - Yeah, I'd say that was a good week. Remember, Turkey Trots are blood sport. Crush some Thanksgiving dreams.

Hello everyone!

week 4/8 10k training goal 37:30

M - 0

T - 7 (8:03)

W - 13 (7:18) 4x1m@I/3min standing rest 5:55,6:00,5:57,6:04 Bonked, tired

T - 4 (9:18) Recovery, Really tired and heavy legs

F - 3 (9:24) Recovery, Still very tired

S - 8 (8:34) Recovery, Talking it very easy

S - 5 (7:45) Legs are back, ball of foot pain, did 5 instead of 15

Tot 40

No so great week, fatigue got me on Wednesday, after the interval session, and couldn't run more than 3/4 miles on the next days due to extreme fatigue.

Legs got better today, but I'm dealing with a mild case of metatarsalgia, so I decided to cut the run early and make it an easy week.

Be back tonight for comments, hope everyone had a great week!

Stone Cutter- Very nice week and it looks like you had an awesomely productive Sunday with 16 miles of it being within 10% or so of your marathon pace. Looking pretty good man.

Dcrunner0910- congrats on the huge breakthrough man! Although to be honest I thought you were in that kind of shape this spring/summer. Let's go sub-32 together this spring.

CMM268- Your post-marathon weeks look like my post-HM marathons. You sure recover fast from these things. Any more thoughts on whether you're gonna do Charleston in January?

Reed- Don't get discouraged with your race results this season, as your training shows you are capable of way more. Good luck next weekend buddy.

Ramanujan- You're putting together some really solid weeks this far out from your goal race/season. It's hard to gauge 5K fitness from tempos, but if you're running tempos at 6-min pace you're probably in about 78-min HM shape, which is about equivalent to a 17-min 5K. Might not hurt to hop in a turkey trot in a couple of weeks to know for sure and to beak up the monotony of training some.

Perkunas- Nice week and awesome mile repeats workout. Always a good feeling to bang one out at the end while feeling good like that.

Qrkid- Damn that sounds like a pretty hard workout on Tuesday, but great job on showing the discipline of taking a couple of days off to nix the injury before it gets worse. Hope you're feeling pretty much healed now.

xenoscreams- Solid week and nice quality.

Runnersfix- Great show of discipline in tailoring your expectations on Tuesday to the conditions and then shaking off an off day on Saturday. It's been very informative not in following your training but also how you're handling the ups-and-downs of each day mentally.

Goal Race: Kiawah Island Marathon (12/14/13)

Next Race: 8k Turkey Trot

My Week:

M: 9.0 Easy (8:06/mi)

T: 12.7 with 4 Strava Segment accelerations at tempo pace

W: 8.2 Easy (7:55/mi)

T: 14.7 with 13.1 @ 13.1 pace

F: 8.7 Easy (8:32/mi)

S: 16 Easy (8:04/mi)

S: 3.1 race with another 3.8 warm-up and cool down.

76 miles for the week. 2,117 miles for the year.

Highlights:

Tuesday's run was going to be easy, but I decided to chase a couple of local Strava segments. Managed to CR 3 out of 4.

http://app.strava.com/activities/94710892

Thursday's run was an attempt at an MP run. But after mile 1, decided to just try to hit 6:30's for the full 13.1. That's actually better than my most recent HM race. So I'll take it.

http://app.strava.com/activities/95071310

I decided to enter a local 5k today. It's in my old neighborhood, so I wanted to do well. And, based on my Tuesday run I though I could give the leaders a run for their money. The course is very tough with 257 feet of climbing spread throughout the route.

I went out in the lead, but was passed by 3 guys in the first mile. I hung close to them and picked off 2 of them on the 2nd and largest climb. The leader was a local HS XC kid and he did not run the downhills hard. So, I passed him at about the 1.5 mile mark.

I took that lead all the way to the final 100 meters when that same XC kid came zipping by me to take the win. Damn kids. They don't respect their elders anymore.

I was still happy with the effort and it sure helped build my confidence ahead of the Kiawah Marathon. Maybe I can still run 6:30's down there.

http://app.strava.com/activities/95649985

Forcerunner - nice quality this week.

Cmm268 - hope the shin heals up soon.

Reed - consistent mile repeats session. What was the recovery? Good luck for your 10K in the upcoming week.

Ramanujan - solid sessions. Working nicely towards your goals. What is your current 5K fitness? Come over to the UK and check it out, be worth the long journey :p

Perkunas - blistering last mile in that session. Shows you have some left in the tank. I reckon you'll have a solid 10k next sat.

Qrkid - good call on taking the days off. It definitely helps.

Xenonscreams - solid 1200s. I would cut the mileage considerably next week if this is one of your target races, stay as fresh as possible.

Runnersfix - wicked 9 mile tempo. You are indeed fast. Don't worry about one bad workout, things happen. Plenty of time to make up for it. What is your target time for the half?

Printer - i am already planning ahead for the future :)

Main goals for XC are to run well at the County Championships in early Jan (hoping to be 1st Under 20 which is my category for XC. If that happens will be picked for my county to go to the UK counties championships in March. I also hope to increase my mileage gradually over the course ofXc in preparation for a road 10K in May. My target time has not been decided yet.

:)

Slartzio- Hope the foot is feeling better after the short day today. Maybe the down week will be a blessing in disguise and help you recover for the last few weeks of your training.

Printer- 3 fast days in a solid week, and your legs couldn't have been that fresh for the 5K. Keep up the great training!