The Most Obvious Case of Doping Never Caught?

Most obvious? wrote:

Women’s 800m world record

Jarmila looks much more womanly these days after getting off dangerous levels of T which is the opposite of how it’s supposed to work; women are meant to get less womanly as they get closer to menopausal age.

Another vote for Paula Radcliffe as the #1 drug cheat in history.

No question about it. wrote:

Another vote for Paula Radcliffe as the #1 drug cheat in history.

Eli wrote:

Lance Armstrong-NO WAY. I hope that was a joke.

16 years later

What a question!

If I had to pick only 1, of course it would be a woman because they change more physically. So difficult, Kratochvilkva, FloJo, or Jeter, all of whom had radical physical changes and WR-record-level performances. 3-way tie.

Among men, it has to be Dolt. His WR performances and increments were equalled by only Ben Johnson. Always vulnerable until he visited Hans and then could beat anybody in history shortly thereafter. Komen for his performance, Makhloufi for his act, but right behind Dolt might be Aries Demerritt for me.

Am resurrecting this thread because this past Sunday, twice-charged Doping Doctor Eufemiano Fuentes appeared on Spanish television to give his “farewell” interview: he’s retiring.

Briefly, Fuentes was trained as a gynecologist but always worked in sports medicine. The Royal Spanish Athletics Federation sent him to East Germany in the early 80’s to learn about their “training methods,” which he then brought back to Spain “so that our athletes could compete on a level playing field (“en igualdad de condiciones).

That 50 professional cyclists from groups for which he was the team physician were caught doping – some of them were actually punished, others got off – and that Fuentes was caught with over 200 code-labeled blood and plasma samples as well as EPO, testosterone and anabolic steroids in his lab is all old news. At the time he was arrested he was carrying 10 mobile phones, several memory sticks containing coded files, and the equivalent of 80,454 US dollars in Swiss Francs and Euros.

What Fuentes revealed on Sunday was that he was the “personal physician” for 15 Spanish athletes leading up to and including the Barcelona ’92 Games and that “some of these were medalists.” The name Fermín Cacho (gold medal, 1500 meters) came up three times in the interview: Fuentes admitted that Cacho was one of “his” athletes, although when asked directly he would not confirm that Cacho was doping; Fuentes said that he met with Cacho in the Olympic Village during the Games; and perhaps most importantly, Fuentes said that, based on their relationship, Cacho was the intermediary between the Spanish Secretary of State for Sport, Jaime Lisavetsky and Fuentes in the run up to the 2008 Games. Fuentes said that the Spanish Athletics Federation “wanted results but they didn’t want problems and they didn’t want positive tests.” Fuentes said that he turned down the offer to be team physician at the Beijing Games.

When the interviewer ask directly if Cacho was doping, Fuentes gave an evasive answer: “It I told you I don’t remember, you wouldn’t believe me…but if I named all the Spaniards who were doping in '92, medals would disappear…”

And, as he insisted several times during the interview, what constituted doping in some other countries was legal in Spain at the time. Doping was not made illegal in Spain until 2013. That is why Fuentes was charged only with “endangering public health” in the two, big doping busts “Operación Puerto” and “Operación Galgo.” In the first he was found guilty and given a one-year suspended sentence. In the second, the case was dismissed.

The day after the television program aired, Cacho’s local newspaper in Soria (northern Spain) contacted him to get a reaction. “I can’t believe it,” he said, “I’m still in shock.” Cacho said he was contemplating suing Fuentes, not for libel or slander, but for “violating doctor-patient confidentiality.” A strange reaction from the champ…

Taking what you write at face value, that seems like virtual confirmation in a case that was already fairly obvious.

And yet still, is it the most obvious? Somehow East German/Soviet Bloc women of the 70s and 80s still have him beat. Ma’s Army? Equally ludicrous. 7:20 Daniel Komen? Hard to believe.

Mo Farah deserves some credit in this contest as well.

Carl Lewis (I'm sure someone has already mentioned this one).

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2003/apr/24/athletics.duncanmackay

I mean there are just so many it's impossible to know where to start.

Mo Farah, Galen Rupp, Paula Radcliffe, Carmelita Jeter, Amel Tuka, Mo Suleiman - I mean man.

So I'll do a mens and womens champion for this one

Womans "most obvious but never caught" Champion...

Genzebe Dibaba. Her 1500m "WR" might be the most outlier record in the books. It's not just the fact that she supposedly destroyed the times of consensus dopers (Ma's crew in the early/mid 90s) but how she went from being insanely dominant in 2015 (1.57.3 last 800m in winning the world title) to looking like an absolute novice only 2 years later where off basically the same pace she could run 2.08 (where she finished dead last) - all funnily enough after her coach Jama Aden was arrested in Spain in 2016 with a refrigerator loaded with drugs. It's the total package - the performances, the consequent drop-off in performances, the physique and running form that also dramatically disappeared seemingly overnight. I think the thing that sets this one apart is I still remember the Letsrun.com doping pole conducted years ago where her fellow pros basically voted out everyone under 3.55 (the Chinese and Eastern Bloc) which meant that she stood alone as over 5 seconds better than anyone else in history in the women's 1500m. I've never seen such complete and utter nonsense.

Mens "most obvious but never caught" Champion...

Yuriy Borzakovskiy. I haven't looked at all the pages here but I doubt this name has been mentioned so hear me out. We now know that doping was state sponsored and completely institutional in Russia for a very long period of time including the period of time when Borazkovskiy was the preeminent 800m runner on the planet (2001-2007) - almost down to the reality that you almost wouldn't be selected for the national team if you weren't onboard with/partaking in it. You want me to believe that the BEST Russian athlete (Olympic 800m champion and 4 time world champs medalist in the single hardest event in track to medal) of that time period was the only guy not cheating? Nothing about Borza passes the sniff test - starting with the above, down to the classic "doper" look of being gaunt (especially in the face) and rail thin yet ripped and being able to run 1.42 running up the home straight poking your tongue out at a guy (see Brussels 2001 vs Bucher). Again in amongst some comically obvious names - his never appears. He gets my vote.

I nominate Usain Bolt

Probably

LANCE ARMSTRONG

HICHAM EL G

MO FARAH

MAKHLOUFI

BARRY BONDS

MARK MCGWIRE

CARL LEWIS

Joe Biden for his debate with Bernie

She wasn't. It was alleged. She died and they buried her quickly.

Eli wrote:

Lance Armstrong-NO WAY. I hope that was a joke.

Anyway- my vote goes to REGINA JACOBS. Would someone please take a look at "her" ? That "woman" is a man, I swear!

17 years ago...

This made me laugh. I wonder how this guy reacted when it all came out? You still around, Eli?

Mo Greene

Flo Jo 100M/200M

Usain Bolt 100/200

Marita Koch 400M

Jarmila Kratochvílová 800M

Genzebe Dibaba1,500M

Almaz Ayana 10,000M

Peppermint Patty of York wrote:

I nominate Usain Bolt

I mean he's also pretty obvious right. I can't actually believe that so many people think he was clean. Every sprinter under 9.80 seconds in history has been either caught or implicated with PED use.

Gay, Blake, Powell, Gatlin, Coleman, Carter, Mo Greene, Mullings - and yet Bolt, the best of them all by 0.11 seconds (a ginormous margin in the 100m), is the only one clean?

On top of that, you have a magical transformation from 2007 to 2008 (noticeable visibly physique wise) and the fact he was part of the Jamaican federation that was subject to only ONE out of competition test in the 5 months prior to the London Olympic Games, despite having at a minimum at least half of the worlds top 10 sprinters on the mens and womens side (funnily enough the test wasn't on Usain Bolt either).

So yeah, Bolt is kind of obvious.

This reminded me of a story I heard about Cacho from a British athlete I knew that had lived and trained in Spain with the national middle distance team, and who had witnessed first hand the lengths they would go to to avoid doping (such as security gated entries and underground secret basements where athletes would hide to avoid being home (this was before the whereabouts rules came into effect). He said Cacho was "heavily religious" (as many drug cheats supposedly are) and lived a double life with respect to doping and the very reverent lifestyle with his wife and family. If any of you remember his career, he won the Olympics in 92, was second in 96 and then set the European record of 3.28.95 in 1997. He had a couple of decent seasons after that running 3.31/2 (which was still very fast back then) and then dropped completely off the map at the age of 30. The reason I was told, was that Cacho's wife found out about the doping and threatened to leave and out him unless he stopped immediately. Cacho, with probably nothing more to gain after such an unexpectedly great career did just that and stopped cold. He couldn't even break 3.42 off the juice so just quit. Classic story. The same British athlete also told me that the reason Reyes Estevez was bald in his late 20's was because he was a complete maniac with doping and would do anything. He once witnessed Estevez lose his mind at a bar and start literally throwing wads of peseta everywhere during the time just before Spain would transition to the Euro. Pretty good times back in Spain in the 90's - especially in middle/distance running

Interesting story there - and Cacho sure did slow down right after 2000.