BYU women dominate stanford

bigmig19 wrote:

WA Covid report wrote:

I would be willing to bet a lot of money that anyone on Stanford would not be able to beat Orton by a minute with everyone running their best. In fact, I think Orton would be the betting favorite straight up against Dudek.

No not by a minute, just saying, she has run very low 19s and based on her track, she is getting better very quickly. Before injury.

When has she run very low 19s for 6K? I must have missed that.

xc-fan wrote:

FastTuohy wrote:

Just for some perspective, here is the second place finisher who was just behind Orton. Pretty consistent 16:15-20 5K equivalent times. Maybe she has taken a step forward this year, but I don't think this time shows it.

https://www.lacctic.com/runners/24305

Alison Pray

Southern Utah (SR)

LACCTiC Rating: 16:03 (15:58 - 16:09)

She ran this race 20 seconds faster than she did last year.

That would be a nice step forward if equal efforts.

Last year:

OSU Invite: 5th behind Orton, Roe, Frentheway, McArthur.

Battleborn: 11th, six seconds behind Donaghu and Dudek and ahead of Heymach.

Big Sky champs: 3rd, six seconds behind Taryn O'Neil and Summer Allen both top 7 at NCAA.

NCAA: dropped 20 places over the last 2K to finish 50th.

All I was saying is 20:20 on this course is nothing great. Runners who ran that time in the 2019 regional at this location were well out of the top 20-30 at NCAA championship. Orton if fit should be top 5. Maybe Pray will run much faster in 2 months. I hope she does.

stanford women's top 10

1) SR Heymach (did not race)

2) SR Lawson (did not race)

3) FR Dadamio (did not race)

4) SR Aragon (raced)

5) FR Dudek (did not race)

6) SO Archer (did not race)

7) FR Jenks (raced)

8) FR Connolly (did not race)

9) SO Story (raced)

10) FR Starcher (raced)

Fyi, the course is fast and net downhill

FastTuohy wrote:

bigmig19 wrote:

No not by a minute, just saying, she has run very low 19s and based on her track, she is getting better very quickly. Before injury.

When has she run very low 19s for 6K? I must have missed that.

This supports my suggestion that she is so under the radar all last year. She arrived on campus and was a few seconds slower than one of the fastest people in the country. And yes she has run in the low 19s. Faster than tuohy.

Aragon and Jenks should be two of Stanford's top-5.

So, I sure hope they were using the race as a workout.

Because, if they were not -- meaning, were actually racing -- then Stanford women are no where near the 3rd best team in the country.

Roberts has raced very poorly since transferring in from Northwestern while Lawson hasn't had a decent race since early last year before the C19 shutdown. Have no idea what their malfunctions are but they are not performing the way the pollsters who picked Stanford women 3rd nationally are expecting them to.

On the other hand, Ricardo Santos took a different approach with the men. He loaded them up, told them to go, and they did. Hicks, Sprout and Boyden are a really good top-3. And all are frosh. 5th year seniors Bolger, Lane and Vernau have yet to debut. It's the men who should be ranked 3rd, not the women.

Stanford has a small Sacramento Invite meet on the calendar in a couple weeks but Nuttycombe in mid-October will be their first serious effort -- at least for the women.

On FSU post-race article the coach said “the course was slow” whatever that means.

Apparently conditions were pretty damp and humid.

I don’t think the times really mean anything this early in the season.

BYU's dominance proves that conservatives do it better!!!

bigmig19 wrote:

FastTuohy wrote:

When has she run very low 19s for 6K? I must have missed that.

This supports my suggestion that she is so under the radar all last year. She arrived on campus and was a few seconds slower than one of the fastest people in the country. And yes she has run in the low 19s. Faster than tuohy.

That is noteworthy as 19:19.5 is the fastest NCAA championship 6K time I can find.

No shortage of Stanford cash wrote:

runnerexpert wrote:Long way to travel and expensive for a tempo run but that appears to have been what they did. I understand they want to see the course before nationals but incredible expense and time invested.

$$ is something that Stanford is not short of.

Did the top three runners that didn't run stay at home? They sure couldn't see the course prior to nationals if they didn't make the trip. Kind of defeats the purpose.

Not only that, but the Stanford men seemed to have used this as a true racing opportunity and started the majority (if not all) of their men. Which begs the question: why have one top-5 team race, while the other one does a fractured "workout?"

FastTuohy wrote:

bigmig19 wrote:

This supports my suggestion that she is so under the radar all last year. She arrived on campus and was a few seconds slower than one of the fastest people in the country. And yes she has run in the low 19s. Faster than tuohy.

That is noteworthy as 19:19.5 is the fastest NCAA championship 6K time I can find.

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/w_cross_country_champs_records/2020-21/D1.pdf

19:25.8 Bill Dellinger Invitational 2018

CougGolf wrote:

On FSU post-race article the coach said “the course was slow” whatever that means.

Apparently conditions were pretty damp and humid.

I don’t think the times really mean anything this early in the season.

Thanks for the heads up. Here is the article. Humid, perhaps damp, but does not appear real muddy. Perhaps a better measure when FSU, MSU, Minn, NC State, NM, AL (and many more teams) all meet in 2 weeks at Notre Dame.

blamb61 wrote:

19:25.8 Bill Dellinger Invitational 2018

https://www.tfrrs.org/athletes/5998586/BYU/Whittni_Orton.html

Thanks, but I think Bigmig was saying Dudek has run low 19s.

bigmig19 wrote:

FastTuohy wrote:

When has she run very low 19s for 6K? I must have missed that.

This supports my suggestion that she is so under the radar all last year. She arrived on campus and was a few seconds slower than one of the fastest people in the country. And yes she has run in the low 19s. Faster than tuohy.

Dudek's 19:14 at the Pac12 championship cannot be directly compared to other races.

In context it is no better than her 20:00+ races. That course was not legit.

If healthy she would have likely been top 15 at NCAA champs but Herberg and McArthur show it was not a lock.

1 - 19:02 - Herberg - 55th at NCAA

2 - 19:09 - Donaghu - 10th - 20:26

3 - 19:14 - Dudek - 156th - injured

4 - 19:21 - Heymach - 13th - 20:32

5 - 19:22 - McArthur - 166th

As noted that was a super fast course and those times did not translate at all at the XC nationals. I still remember Donaghu absolutely wrecked at the finish line. Especially as freshmen college runners have trouble adjusting to the grind of the season, and are prone to bad races. That NCAA course did in quite a few, so cannot project. Dudek could not hold the pace by the second mile. Whether that was due to injury or the injury the result of exhaustion, who knows?

xc-fan wrote:

Dudek's 19:14 at the Pac12 championship cannot be directly compared to other races.

In context it is no better than her 20:00+ races. That course was not legit.

If healthy she would have likely been top 15 at NCAA champs but Herberg and McArthur show it was not a lock.

1 - 19:02 - Herberg - 55th at NCAA

2 - 19:09 - Donaghu - 10th - 20:26

3 - 19:14 - Dudek - 156th - injured

4 - 19:21 - Heymach - 13th - 20:32

5 - 19:22 - McArthur - 166th

Thanks - forgot about that - clearly something amiss with the course measurement

Dudek has a lot of potential and I wish her the best. But there's no evidence that she was running at such an elite level last year considering more than half the girls she was about even with had poor showings at Nationals

Callie Logue another one she was about even with was 125th

And in high school she had one really good cross country race, a couple of fast miles and 1 Fast 2 miles. She showed nice Improvement but this idea that she is an elite level College Runner already is really presumptuous. Isn't it possible she was running all out in races where other Runners were tuning up for Nationals. Anyway she definitely has potential but so do a lot of young Runners who have better times than she does like thorvaldson, brown, starliper, Hutchins, as well as tons of Stand Out College runners

FastTuohy wrote:

CougGolf wrote:

On FSU post-race article the coach said “the course was slow” whatever that means.

Apparently conditions were pretty damp and humid.

I don’t think the times really mean anything this early in the season.

Thanks for the heads up. Here is the article. Humid, perhaps damp, but does not appear real muddy. Perhaps a better measure when FSU, MSU, Minn, NC State, NM, AL (and many more teams) all meet in 2 weeks at Notre Dame.

https://seminoles.com/wildschutt-wins-fsu-xc-open/

Agree with this take. The best teams are peaking in November. Stanford and BYU women don't care at all about the result from this meet. Stanford women that ran literally ran tempo . Look at the splits. Only reason they showed up is to get on the nationals course. We will start to get a glimpse of things to come at Notre Dame and get a pretty clear picture on the top teams by the Nuttycombe 2 weeks after that.

Last year BYU opened on the OSU course and at the championship averaged 26 seconds faster. And that was with Orton slower due to injury. I expect we will see something similar this year.