Why doesn't Drew Hunter train with anyone at/above his level?

0202020 wrote:

Parsons has decent PRs, but couldn't compete for US teams, which presumably is Hunter's goal. He's 24, been a pro for 6 years, and wouldn't make Oregon's DMR team after deciding to skip college running...

Are they trying and failing to recruit good NCAA talent into Tin Man? Or just happy where things are? Are there any other Adidas pros he should be thinking about linking up with?

Because everyone knows the tinman group is a bunch of tools that would rather sell t-shirts than train seriously. And the coach sucks.

Drew should leave but he's too much of a wimp. He loves being a big fish in a small pond.

Prioritising having friends around him as opposed to high calibre teammates. Understandable mistake from someone who made the decision young. Maybe too invested now to undo it.

Shame he never got to see the benefit a collegiate team/squad/facilities could have done for his career.

How did having high caliber team mates work out for Mary Cain? Or many others?

TME and Drew were able to create an environment that's relaxed and easy to prosper in. There isn't the same amount of pressure and expectation that something like being in BTC would have.

Tinman's training is mostly focused on CV, threshold and tempos - easy/moderate long runs at best. You don't need a 13 flat runner to push you through these sessions. If you did, then you probably aren't running at CV or threshold anymore.

For the few key sessions that they are doing, they can make it so other TME guys run parts of what Drew does with him or he just runs it on his own. Builds mental strength anyway.

I think he has an ideal environment, and an interesting coach that has done a lot of research and already achieved a lot on the high-school level at least. The sport needs runners and teams like Drew and TME that are relatable to people and open-minded and not just more secret bases like NOP used to be or top secret CIA athletes like Rupp where you get to know nothing about.

I like it because of the social atmosphere. My life isn't just about running. : )

LateRunnerPhil wrote:

There isn't the same amount of pressure and expectation that something like being in BTC would have.

For the few key sessions that they are doing, they can make it so other TME guys run parts of what Drew does with him or he just runs it on his own. Builds mental strength anyway.

Yeah, we wouldn’t want our future star runners to have any expectations of themselves.

Also, the strategy you describe above is what every high school team does. All the other guys help out the one fast guy.

It seems fun at first but it just ends up turning off the other guys because they’re just means to an end for someone else’s goal.

Nobody at that level takes his glorified high school coach seriously. His teammates have never won anything big and don't know any better.

Because he wants to be the next Pre, which means running about 13:20 and getting beaten when it matters most.

LateRunnerPhil wrote:

TME and Drew were able to create an environment that's relaxed and easy to prosper in. There isn't the same amount of pressure and expectation that something like being in BTC would have.

Then why does BTC have 100x the accomplishments and prosperity that TME does?

When you want to be the best in the world, pressure and expectations are necessary.

drew was a sub 4 miler in hs but only a 13:17 5k guy now. something is obviously wrong lol!

looking for truth wrote:

0202020 wrote:

Parsons has decent PRs, but couldn't compete for US teams, which presumably is Hunter's goal. He's 24, been a pro for 6 years, and wouldn't make Oregon's DMR team after deciding to skip college running...

Are they trying and failing to recruit good NCAA talent into Tin Man? Or just happy where things are? Are there any other Adidas pros he should be thinking about linking up with?

Because everyone knows the tinman group is a bunch of tools that would rather sell t-shirts than train seriously. And the coach sucks.

Drew should leave but he's too much of a wimp. He loves being a big fish in a small pond.

I don't begrudge the other guys, who are only semi-pro talents, for being into tshirts, youtube videos, brand management. Something has to pay rent (in Drew's house). But don't get why Drew is happy to be their mascot rather than finding world-class training partners and coaching versus... a coach his mom found for herself online 20 years ago?

too be fair, how many Adidas guys in the U.S. are much faster than Drew? If he was to join a group where he has a few runners ahead of him then his options are basically Bowerman, OTC, uhhh...

0202020 wrote:

looking for truth wrote:

Because everyone knows the tinman group is a bunch of tools that would rather sell t-shirts than train seriously. And the coach sucks.

Drew should leave but he's too much of a wimp. He loves being a big fish in a small pond.

I don't begrudge the other guys, who are only semi-pro talents, for being into tshirts, youtube videos, brand management. Something has to pay rent (in Drew's house). But don't get why Drew is happy to be their mascot rather than finding world-class training partners and coaching versus... a coach his mom found for herself online 20 years ago?

It really is a strange situation. Tom Schwartz seems like a snake oil salesman of the highest order. He really lucked out by having the privilege to coach a high schooler as talented as Drew Hunter; if you look at his stable of athletes before Drew's sub4 and after, it's a pretty stark contrast.

ADP, right down the highway from where he lives, has plenty of guys who could push Drew to greatness and a coach with real pro knowhow. And they don't require a sponsorship change at all.

I think LRC has a bit of an obsession with Drew, who seems like a good kid, & is giving it his all to get better.

I feel like there are a couple of studs every year who run professional times & then end up getting professional contracts. You could start a thread saying the guys from Oregon are better than 53 other pro runners, but the thread was started with Drew as the comparison.

The jury is still out on Hunter. He's getting better in an environment he likes. He's also running a business and is setting himself up for the long-term. He's still getting PRs and made the 5k team at 21 years old. There isn't a one path fits all approach in running. It's not a knock that some college guys are running fast right now. We can be happy that there are some good runners that will be joining the pro ranks. The sky isn't falling for Drew because other guys are good.

` wrote:

0202020 wrote:

I don't begrudge the other guys, who are only semi-pro talents, for being into tshirts, youtube videos, brand management. Something has to pay rent (in Drew's house). But don't get why Drew is happy to be their mascot rather than finding world-class training partners and coaching versus... a coach his mom found for herself online 20 years ago?

It really is a strange situation. Tom Schwartz seems like a snake oil salesman of the highest order. He really lucked out by having the privilege to coach a high schooler as talented as Drew Hunter; if you look at his stable of athletes before Drew's sub4 and after, it's a pretty stark contrast.

The funny part is Tinman claimed Drew wasn't that talented and that his training was what led to his success.

NERunner53 wrote:

He's also running a business and is setting himself up for the long-term.

No, he's the face of a brand but it isn't his brand. Schwartz is the owner and Parsons is the creator. Hunter has an army of guys riding his jock and he has as much ownership of the brand/business as Tom Brady does the Buccaneers.

BLM!! wrote:

` wrote:

It really is a strange situation. Tom Schwartz seems like a snake oil salesman of the highest order. He really lucked out by having the privilege to coach a high schooler as talented as Drew Hunter; if you look at his stable of athletes before Drew's sub4 and after, it's a pretty stark contrast.

The funny part is Tinman claimed Drew wasn't that talented and that his training was what led to his success.

Yeah I've heard that before and it's incredibly absurd, self-aggrandizing BS. Hunter ran 8:16 in the 3k as a sophomore! How is that not absurdly talented? I'm not saying Tinman is a bad coach, but I do think he is an incredibly mediocre high school and amateur level coach who happened to luck out with one of this generation's top running talents.

Prakel, Avila are 2 I know of

` wrote:

0202020 wrote:

I don't begrudge the other guys, who are only semi-pro talents, for being into tshirts, youtube videos, brand management. Something has to pay rent (in Drew's house). But don't get why Drew is happy to be their mascot rather than finding world-class training partners and coaching versus... a coach his mom found for herself online 20 years ago?

It really is a strange situation. Tom Schwartz seems like a snake oil salesman of the highest order. He really lucked out by having the privilege to coach a high schooler as talented as Drew Hunter; if you look at his stable of athletes before Drew's sub4 and after, it's a pretty stark contrast.

Careful, don’t call Hunter talented or you’ll summon LateRunnerPhil in here.

Anyway, a good example is Effraimson, who wasted a few years by sticking with her high school coach but looks to have gotten out early enough to salvage a career on the world stage with a good group/coach above her current level.