DJ Príncipe 15:17 @ bowdoin

swerve wrote:

Chgghvgvhhvgvyjghvgvh wrote:

Nick Ryan is #2 on this course. Not a household name...

That being said, a lot of good runners have run on this course. Príncipe, I believe, is the top contender at NXN.

Nick Ryan is an FM kid and was a contender at NXN and was a 4:05/8:55 guy in high school. Irrelevant now like most FM runners, but was known back then.

I thought brannigan broke Ryan's record when he was a junior

no Nick ryans record held for 5 years i think. maybe 4

Nick Ryan had the all-time record at 15:27 since 2012, topping Rosa's 15:35.

Mikey Brannigan beat the junior class record at 15:29.90 in 2013.

Principe broke the all-time back in September with a 15:23.30 at the Bowdoin Classic, and re-broke it Saturday at NXN-NE with a 15:18.

Hey Glen . . . or someone . .

Can you describe the Bowdoin course . . . not knowing anything about it, it must be a bear . . . since many legit 5k courses have records well under 15 . . . thanks for any info . . .

AKMarmoset wrote:

It's a conspiracy, gmtirds.

Do you have something to contribute?

Didn't he already do so?

Having never run the course myself (hahaha!), there's gotta be someone else who can describe it better than I can.

I can tell you with great confidence that the 15-16 times I had to walk up that stupid mountain to get out of the park after races were sincerely some of my least favorite moments of my sons high school career, so there's an indicator. lol

If nobody else jumps in, I'll have a go at it.

AKMarmoset wrote:

cool kid wrote:

false.

I don't care how fast he went out, the first half mile is flat then uphill.

If he actually went out that hard he would not have won.

Like I said, I just heard another coach take the split and I can't verify it. Just in response though, isn't the.5M mark right below the playground at the base of the hill?

He definitely slowed down a little after the playground hill, that was clear. But I think the possibility of a low-2' isn't totally outrageous for the first.5M. Top NCAA guys have gone 4:10 for the first mile of an 8k and still settled into a strong pace for the duration of the race. It's fun to speculate about it...Principe ran very well, it was a bold, impressive race regardless of the splits.

Not sure how you're comparing top NCAA guys to a high schooler. No way he went 2:01 for the first 800, you've gotta be crazy to think that. World class pros wouldn't even go out that hard if they were running this 5k course (in fact, most diamond league races go out slower than 2:01). Also what NCAA guys have gone out in 4:10 for an 8k, when 4:10 is like 7:47ish pace for 3k? Lol.

the first half of the race goes up, and gets steeper and rockyer the more distance you go. then it reaches the top and heads down for the next mile or so, and flattens out at the bottom 500-1000 meters. the down is not as steep as the up and the first half of the race is painful. also the second mile is on narrow trails through the woods so if your a mid pack runner like I was when I raced bowdoin (3 years ago) then navigating around slower runners and walkers on the hill is a bich.

XCGuy wrote:

Hey Glen . . . or someone . .

Can you describe the Bowdoin course . . . not knowing anything about it, it must be a bear . . . since many legit 5k courses have records well under 15 . . . thanks for any info . . .

The first quarter mile is on a flat field, then it funnels down across a bridge which is wide enough for a bunch of people. For the first mile, the course has a few bends and is mostly on grass and is slightly uphill, without any real big hill- just a lot of upsloping terrain. At some point late in the first mile it goes onto a trail in the woods and after some more climbing early on in the second mile, there is a big hill roughly 1.2-1.3 miles into the race that lasts close to a quarter of a mile. On this hill there are a bunch of bends and the trail gets narrow at many points, making it hard to pass or get momentum. After the uphill it is flat for a VERY short period of time and then it goes downhill like crazy. Again, there are tons of bends and at the regional meet the trails were soaked and torn up, making it very difficult to take advantage of the hill. Once you hit the bottom it is mostly flat or down sloping and for the beginning of the third mile you loop back towards the start- it's a little downhill but not very noticeable. For the last half mile, you take a trail around the start field- it's mostly flat but it's extremely tough mentally because you can see the finish line from half a mile away. With a couple hundred meters to go there is a mini uphill and then you break into a field roughly 100-150m away from the finish and sprint home.

Overall, when it rains, the course gets muddy really quick as it got a little muddy on Saturday-not horrible though. Getting out fast at this course is critical because it is hard to pass in the woods so races go off really quick. The funnel itself isn't horrible but the bends in the first mile can bring the middle to back of the pack to a near stop.

Both very good assessments of the course.

And, "...it's extremely tough mentally because you can see the finish line from half a mile away.", is an incredibly good point, and something that never even occured to me in four years of watching races there. We'll done on that.