Move On.org Estate Tax Petition

I agree that that is a horrible rational for the tax. I think the best justification for the estate tax, and the one that should be emphasized, is that it helps maintain our society as a meritocracy. Of course, it is impossible to be a complete meritocracy, but with the estate tax a 1 billion dollar fortune can be dissipated over several generations. Sure, it's unfair for the person who built an empire and earned a fortune but it's probably better for society as a whole to prevent those with inherited wealth from becoming entrenched in positiosn of power they did not earn solely because of their wealth.

The second best justification is that the estate tax encourages charitable giving. The foundations established by wealthy donors trying to avoid the estate tax (e.g. the Gates Foundation) have made possible the establishment of many hospitals, libraries, universities, parks, etc., that would not have been established without the threat of estate taxation.

"Sure, it's unfair for the person who built an empire and earned a fortune but it's probably better for society as a whole to prevent those with inherited wealth from becoming entrenched in positiosn of power they did not earn solely because of their wealth."

WELL SAID, COMRADE!

I oppose the death tax for a pretty simple reason--they already taxed your $ multiple times when you were living.

The government taxes you when you first earn the money. Then, if you invest whatever you have left, they tax the corporation you invest in on its profits and you on any dividends and capital gains (aka double taxation).

Then, if you buy anything with your $, they tax the sale. If you buy an asset like a house or car, they tax it as personal property, too.

So, the government taxes you multiple times on your earnings. I don't see any justification to confiscate any portion of what's left when you die.

The real issue is that Federal spending is completely out of control. That's the only reason we're even having this conversation.

Trust Fund Babies want to rule the world, and will donate $$$ to conservative causes and political candidates who will protect "their" status quo.

"So, the government taxes you multiple times on your earnings. I don't see any justification to confiscate any portion of what's left when you die"

Ever heard of tax breaks, and tax deduction, for property owners, and certain business owners? Taxes were avoided; never paid.

Nobody likes the death tax, not even the liberals who enjoy mooching from the hard work of others. It is 100% unfair, and those dollars wind up being taxed at least twice. So why does it still exist? Every four years, it's an easy sell to convince low-information voters that the government can somehow spend money to benefit society more efficiently than private industry can (never mind the automobile, computers, mobile phones, etc created by private industry). As long as the numbers of low-information voters stay high (ultimate dream of liberals), the death tax will remain.

As a lifelong Liberal who largely supports high taxes, I cannot argue with the point of the OP. The last decade has me reconsidering many of the positions I once held. Sure, some of that is related to making more money (and not wanting to lose it), but I also have more problems with the arguments made by both sides of the aisle. They seem so petty.

Listen, we need to invest money into society and we have to have a state and federal way to do this. Education is an example of what should be a top priority and there needs to be a governing body, but it seems like the worst areas of society are the ones getting the most federal and state funding. Baltimore is the hot example right now, but every state has areas like Baltimore. Why can't we agree that the problems in Baltimore come from terrible mismanagement from BOTH sides. Why do we need to either side with the police or the rioters? Both are in the wrong. BOTH should be held accountable for their actions. Why the subterfuge from the media on BOTH sides?

I don't know the answer, but I am hoping we can get some people in office - both Democrats and Republicans - who will find a happy medium. I look at this like raising children: you'll get terrible results if you totally baby your children and never let them make mistakes or "learn the hard way," but you'll also get terrible results if you act like a dictator who inflicts nothing but corporal punishments. I think it is time for our country's leaders to act more like benevolent parents to their constituents... I am no longer sure if that is even covered under any of the current parties...

Am I even making sense? I feel so isolated politically these days. I turn on the news and I am disgusted by all channels.

Trust Fund Babies wrote:

Trust Fund Babies want to rule the world, and will donate $$$ to conservative causes and political candidates who will protect "their" status quo.

Do you really think trust fund babies are voting conservative? Have you ever been to an Ivy League campus?

What is more likely to happen is a huge swing to the right, followed by a huge swing to the left, all due to the 24-hour cable news cycle.

You are so close to seeing the answer....you are right that the problem is that both sides are responsible for the mismanagement of governmental programs. Why? Because people act in their own self interest. Simple as that. So, the bigger government gets, the more power those in charge wield and will take greater risks to maintain control - at the expense of those they are claiming to help. The answer is to look for other ways to structure the role of government. Need to move away from tax and spend programs and look to influence the behavior of society by using incentive based programs.

Fool, learn to understand before you post. This is the ultimate perversion of the tea party movement, which began as a populist revolt in 2009 but has since been hijacked by wealthy and corporate interests. The estate tax has been part of American law in some form since 1797, according to the advocacy group Americans for Tax Fairness, a shield against the sort of permanent aristocracy our founders fought to rid themselves of.It had long been a conservative ideal, and the essence of the American Dream, to believe that everybody should have an equal shot at success. But in their current bid to end the estate tax, Republicans could create a permanent elite of trust-fund babies.http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/republicans-push-for-a-permanent-aristocracy/2015/04/14/aa434f82-e2e5-11e4-81ea-0649268f729e_story.html

Talking Heads wrote:

Trust Fund Babies wrote:

Trust Fund Babies want to rule the world, and will donate $$$ to conservative causes and political candidates who will protect "their" status quo.

Do you really think trust fund babies are voting conservative? Have you ever been to an Ivy League campus?

What is more likely to happen is a huge swing to the right, followed by a huge swing to the left, all due to the 24-hour cable news cycle.

It's ironic that move-on.org is funded by George Soros, who has been hiding billions from the IRS, and probably will never see the hand of Lois Lerner through clever tax avoidance schemes.

they aren't taxing you. They are taxing your deadbeat kids who didn't do skit for that money. You are dead. You no longer own that money. You no longer have any property rights. You are dead. Your deadbeat kids are lucky they are allowed to be given any money that society allowed you to earn.

The fairest tax would be a 100% estate tax on all sizes of estates. That would encourage spending while you are alive, and would allow us to reduce the income tax.

The estate tax is not taxing the dead person. They're dead. They can't use it.

This is taxing people who receive money as income that is new to them.

You work and earn money, you have income tax.

You inherit money, you have income tax on it.

Besides being a much needed revenue source, the merits of the estate tax is that it encourages the spending, donating or transferring of money before the person dies if they are concerned about the tax.

Concentrated wealth is an issue with slowing down the velocity of money.

If they spent it while they were alive it would be an economic stimulus.

And they argument against the estate tax is just to help people that did not even earn the money.

The last two posters need to understand what it is like to have children. I work really hard so that my children and grandchildren can have opportunities that I was not able to have growing up.

I would be happy living on sardines and camping in the mountains, but I save money for my kids. It is something that I - the guy earning the money - am choosing to spend my money on: my children's future. They are not deadbeats!

You need to see it from the perspective. I want to give my wealth to my kids so that they can use it on their children, etc. I don't want to buy a bunch of fancy cars and expensive clothing. I want them to have trusts to ensure that they don't have to worry about college expenses, medical bills or housing. And I raise them to understand the importance of proper spending and saving... and philanthropy. I don't want to raise Paris Hiltons. I just want to raise children who do not go without. That is my main financial goal.

Want to see philanthropy dissolve? Tax away estates... then you'll only have 6 people in the world who are willing to fund philanthropies. Gone are the arts. Gone is culture.

Don't even bother. You are arguing with a portion of society that is so self-obsessed that it has infected their thinking. It is scary. You owe them something and you ought to be thrown in jail for having the gall to make something of your life. Nevermind your intentions!

nah wrote:

they aren't taxing you. They are taxing your deadbeat kids who didn't do skit for that money. You are dead. You no longer own that money. You no longer have any property rights. You are dead. Your deadbeat kids are lucky they are allowed to be given any money that society allowed you to earn.

The fairest tax would be a 100% estate tax on all sizes of estates. That would encourage spending while you are alive, and would allow us to reduce the income tax.

You're a flipping idiot....Let's say that I die before my kids get to college...all the savings I've put away should go to the Government and you trust people like Obama to distribute it fairly? Your right to vote should be revoked.

The estate tax is necessary because otherwise some income never gets taxed.

For example, you are an owner of a corporation that does very well and you never sell your shares in that corporation. During your lifetime those capital gains are never taxed. Without an estate tax those shares could be passed down through generations indefinitely without ever being taxed.

What? No Way. wrote:

The last two posters need to understand what it is like to have children. I work really hard so that my children and grandchildren can have opportunities that I was not able to have growing up.

Oh, I have children.

And I work hard to give my children more opportunities than I had.

I've done well without needing to receive anything from my parents.

But my children will get more things than I got.

They will get more help for cars and college. If I can, i will help with a starter house.

They are not going to have to wait for me to die to get all that I can give them.

The "children" who normally get the benefits of a large inheritance are over 50 years old. They are established in life.

The estate tax, as it is now, is not hurting anyone in need of opportunities.

Blah Blah Blah wrote:

The estate tax is necessary because otherwise some income never gets taxed.

For example, you are an owner of a corporation that does very well and you never sell your shares in that corporation. During your lifetime those capital gains are never taxed. Without an estate tax those shares could be passed down through generations indefinitely without ever being taxed.

I'm sorry, but this is crazy. Of course you get taxed--when you sell the asset.

Until you sell the asset, it's not liquid. So, why should the feds get any $?

Making people sell their companies to pay an estate tax is wrong both morally and from a pure econ perspective. I won't bother to explain why...