Kid slaps teachers hand, calls him a ‘cracker’ - Teacher is arrested

Maybe you are racist and need to explore the concept of implicit bias and question your white fragility.

I understand Americans are very sensitive on race and I did post to the NYTimes article about it being better to allow sensitive discussions of race in schools and pondering if for certain subjects and posts it is better to let people refute them. One such post is your post.

When you write, "And you are willing to admit schools with a majority of black populations have on average more discipline problems." on its own and don't attempt to provide any context (about poverty levels, status of households, etc) I concluded you had a racist intent. I am wrong and you are trying to make another point let me know what it is.

This thread was about a specific incident and if you are going to make broad generalizations about the race of the people involved I think that is racist. Even if you could prove that one race when you control for every imaginable variable has more discipline problems than another in schools (I don't think you can) I would still argue who cares, what's the point. There is enough variability across individuals that it wouldn't matter. All people should be treated with dignity and respect. Just let me know where I'm off base.

Friedman has an ideological point to make about minimum wage, which serves only the interest of employers, not employees, but no actual data points. Unemployment rates don't differ very much with no minimum wage but standards of living do all the way up to 2-3 times minimum wage.

https://www.epi.org/publication/minimum-wage-15-by-2025/

zcvxzcxv wrote:

Friedman has an ideological point to make about minimum wage, which serves only the interest of employers, not employees, but no actual data points. Unemployment rates don't differ very much with no minimum wage but standards of living do all the way up to 2-3 times minimum wage.

https://www.epi.org/publication/minimum-wage-15-by-2025/

Unemployment rates DO differ, but you cannot compare one sample size to itself in real time. Just as with popular measures of inflation, the CPI and PCE, the gauges cannot capture the total and discreet effects but only the relative effects.

Flagpole wrote:

facing facts wrote:

It is not racist to say on average majority black schools have more behavior problems than majority white schools.

It is not racist to say black neighborhoods have more crime than majority white neighborhoods.

It's foolish and reflects a denial of reality to say otherwise. And it's hypocritical to call people racist who are honestly speaking the truth.

That guy said ALL classrooms (meaning all black classrooms), and that is NOT true and demonstrates a racist attitude. You also are making assumptions based on no knowledge. Do you have stats to back up your claims? No you don't. All BS.

You don't believe that. It's a logical deduction and I certainly could give you links. But your response to my statement "on average majority black schools have more behavior problems than majority white schools" is in your terminology BS.

You are a smart guy right? Are majority black schools more likely to come from poorer neighborhoods with more crime?

Are majority black schools therefore likely to have more discipline problems?

(So who is full of BS)

I honestly find it weird that it's so taboo to speak these words out loud. That attitude doesn't help finding solutions to problems.

facing facts wrote:

Flagpole wrote:

That guy said ALL classrooms (meaning all black classrooms), and that is NOT true and demonstrates a racist attitude. You also are making assumptions based on no knowledge. Do you have stats to back up your claims? No you don't. All BS.

You don't believe that. It's a logical deduction and I certainly could give you links. But your response to my statement "on average majority black schools have more behavior problems than majority white schools" is in your terminology BS.

You are a smart guy right? Are majority black schools more likely to come from poorer neighborhoods with more crime?

Are majority black schools therefore likely to have more discipline problems?

(So who is full of BS)

I honestly find it weird that it's so taboo to speak these words out loud. That attitude doesn't help finding solutions to problems.

what's your proposed solution?

All I see you doing is clumsily throwing innuendo around. That seems to be your purpose. Do you have anything of value to actually say on the topic?

Flagpole is a smart poster but even he can't talk about race without being hypersensitive that he might even remotely be in the wrong side of an issue.

There is real racism in this country and it's a problem, but when we start seeing hidden or implied racism in any race related statement, or when we become fearful that others will think our statement might be racist that will suffocate honest discussion.

Hi Rojo! wrote:

facing facts wrote:

You don't believe that. It's a logical deduction and I certainly could give you links. But your response to my statement "on average majority black schools have more behavior problems than majority white schools" is in your terminology BS.

You are a smart guy right? Are majority black schools more likely to come from poorer neighborhoods with more crime?

Are majority black schools therefore likely to have more discipline problems?

(So who is full of BS)

I honestly find it weird that it's so taboo to speak these words out loud. That attitude doesn't help finding solutions to problems.

what's your proposed solution?

All I see you doing is clumsily throwing innuendo around. That seems to be your purpose. Do you have anything of value to actually say on the topic?

I am not so presumptuous to think I have solutions. But I do know if we can't speak honestly and respectfully we won't find solutions.

facing facts wrote:

Hi Rojo! wrote:

what's your proposed solution?

All I see you doing is clumsily throwing innuendo around. That seems to be your purpose. Do you have anything of value to actually say on the topic?

I am not so presumptuous to think I have solutions. But I do know if we can't speak honestly and respectfully we won't find solutions.

So you're just dog-whistling. awesome.

hope you got your weird jollies and can stop now.

facing facts wrote:

Hi Rojo! wrote:

what's your proposed solution?

All I see you doing is clumsily throwing innuendo around. That seems to be your purpose. Do you have anything of value to actually say on the topic?

I am not so presumptuous to think I have solutions. But I do know if we can't speak honestly and respectfully we won't find solutions.

LOL....lets not forget that you jumped into this conversation to defend this statement:

" You have not been in a school with black kids."

Now you that you have been called out you try to act like you're just here trying to promote 'respectful' dialogue on the subject.

Ok that was a typical thoughtful Wejo response and it's appreciated. My comment was made in the context of a discussion and there was a purpose to it. Your question about my intent on making such a statement is appropriate. It wasn't to give fodder to racists trying to imply blacks are inherently more aggressive or anything like that.

I purposely stated, "are you willing to admit......." to highlight the reactivity and hypersensitivity that many whites have in discussing race relations. Many seem so quick to condemn others behavior as racist and are fearful of themselves saying anything that others would construe to be racist. I wonder if many whites do that either out of guilt or some repressed bias that they might have. I don't know but they do it and it interferes with honest dialog.

My statement about average black majority schools ( consider the number of inner city schools) and discipline was accurate but I knew many whites would struggle with that. (I challenged someone to admit something that was difficult for them.) And sure enough to prove my point I was attacked by a number of people for making that post.

We need to be able to speak honestly, freely and respectfully to others. Having taboo thoughts filtered by fear that can't be expressed does not help.

Race relations are amazingly difficult for some whites to openly discuss. That was my point.

...and yet again you try to act like you didn't wade into this thread by defending this post:

"You have not been in a class with black kids."

Exactly. False racism accusations are too plenty, and the US is one of the least racist nations out there, but this thread spiraled out of control based on a comment that was indeed racist and then a bunch of people eager to defend it by trying to wordsmith it. This is not an example of people lazily calling someone they disagree with racist.

Affirmative action rewards incompetence.

Good clear demonstration of the point I was making. I didn't read this whole thread and don't recall that post at all. So no I was not defending that post. Yet you are full of condemning and false assumptions of me being racist.

In your defense, you are not alone in your hypersensitivity to any possible racism and you are probably well intentioned.

Another interesting point I would like to make, is that it's basically impossible to say"I am not a racist, without sounding like a racist". I noticed that right after I typed that statement. Seriously, people's reaction to this topic is amazingly interesting. There is guilt from simple accusation. I can see why people are so wary of discussing this topic.

(I will probably continue to be attacked due to my posts on this sensitive topic)

facing facts wrote:

Hi Rojo! wrote:

...and yet again you try to act like you didn't wade into this thread by defending this post:

"You have not been in a class with black kids."

Good clear demonstration of the point I was making. I didn't read this whole thread and don't recall that post at all.

It was literally included in and the subject of the quote tree of your first response.

Florida... what's in that Lake Okeechobee water?

facing facts wrote:

Flagpole is a smart poster but even he can't talk about race without being hypersensitive that he might even remotely be in the wrong side of an issue.

There is real racism in this country and it's a problem, but when we start seeing hidden or implied racism in any race related statement, or when we become fearful that others will think our statement might be racist that will suffocate honest discussion.

There are honest discussions to have about race in America. Starting with that ALL black classrooms are filled with chaos and disrespect isn't how that is to start properly. I have called out the racist statements in this thread, because that's what should be done when someone makes them.

Good clear demonstration of your dishonesty.

You claim you didn't read that post, yet...

You quoted that post, in your first post here on page 4. You say you weren't defending it, or even read it....but remove that statement and the follow up statements from that thread and your post makes zero sense. It's clear to anyone who is not a moran that those were the posts you were responding too and defending.

The post you were most directly attacking, the one at the end of that chain, was this one:

I suppose you'll pretend you didn't read that one either. You were just posting completely out of the blue, without an agenda, quoting posts you didn't even read, in order to spread honesty. Right.

You are part of the problem.