Gene Dykes breaks Ed Whitlock's record at Jacksonville Marathon!

they're the worst wrote:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXalKNoB8z_/

Oh, stuff it.

So basically any Masters runner with some muscle is a TRT cheat? Has this guy actually been caught? His pic was posted in another thread as alleged proof that doping is rife in Masters, and yet I can't see any info on Google about him being busted.

I don't know whether this guy is on TRT or roiding or whatever, but he's not much older than me and I have more muscle than him. Of course I'm not doing his mileage or running as fast as him, but I haven't noticed any impact on my muscle composition since I started running a year ago. I've never taken a PED in my life, nor have I ever been on TRT.

Maybe there's a correlation between 50 year old guys who still have the ability/motivation to run marathons and the ability/motivation to get in the gym and lift weights 5 days a week as well?

I'm as anti-doping as anyone here, but you can't just assume that because a middle-aged guy has a bit of muscle and can still run fast that he must be on TRT or roiding.

The cost benefits of having a muscular frame as a runner are probably a little different as you get older.

YMMV wrote:

In the Age of TRT, Ed-like performances will become more common. Not saying Gene is doing this, but the numbers are compelling. When you have 100K men on TRT, in some way or another it will start affecting masters sports results, given the token nature of performance testing at this level. It's like trying to keep out illegal aliens with a poorly defended border.

Well...how are we going to know which masters athletes are using TRT and which are not? They sure as heck aren't going to say that they're using TRT. And why is this such a touchy subject in the masters ranks? You can't even bring this subject of TRT up on the Grandmasters 50+ forum without getting people angry.

Thou Shall Not disparage the great Ed Whitlock. His only flaw was being a Canadian.

Wonder if Gene has ever considered changing his last name? It's somewhat disconcerting in a visual image way.

S.O.W.P.

Training for old people wrote:

I am not sure how much TRT alone will help with distance running for the 70+ runners. As a runner getting close to that age, overuse injuries to connective tissue and joints from training too hard or racing generally are the limiting factor on performance. TRT obviously makes it easier to build muscular strength and to recover quicker from a hard training effort, but I don't know that it will improve the durability of connective tissue and joints. However, there are some studies that have shown that HGH can stimulate and improve collagen synthesis. Probably, some cocktail of Testosterone, HGH and EPO will be figured out for older athletes who can afford it that will significantly improve performance. I think that right now, unless you finish in the top 3 at a Masters National championship, your odds of getting drug tested are zero.

TRT is the poor man's version of HGH. HGH is for the rich dudes. There's an old saying with HGH: "If you got the dough...you're in the show." There have been Hollywood actors using HGH from these upper end anti-aging clinics with great results over the years. When it comes to anti-aging therapies...it's all about the $$$.

A touchy subject wrote:

YMMV wrote:

In the Age of TRT, Ed-like performances will become more common. Not saying Gene is doing this, but the numbers are compelling. When you have 100K men on TRT, in some way or another it will start affecting masters sports results, given the token nature of performance testing at this level. It's like trying to keep out illegal aliens with a poorly defended border.

Well...how are we going to know which masters athletes are using TRT and which are not? They sure as heck aren't going to say that they're using TRT. And why is this such a touchy subject in the masters ranks? You can't even bring this subject of TRT up on the Grandmasters 50+ forum without getting people angry.

A little more googling reveals that 11 million men in the U.S. are being given T by a single health provider (doesn't say who, obviously one of the biggest). There are roughly 40 million men over age 40. I'll leave the math up to the reader.

YMMV wrote:

A touchy subject wrote:

Well...how are we going to know which masters athletes are using TRT and which are not? They sure as heck aren't going to say that they're using TRT. And why is this such a touchy subject in the masters ranks? You can't even bring this subject of TRT up on the Grandmasters 50+ forum without getting people angry.

A little more googling reveals that 11 million men in the U.S. are being given T by a single health provider (doesn't say who, obviously one of the biggest). There are roughly 40 million men over age 40. I'll leave the math up to the reader.

Okay...great, then it's not dopingif they have an Rx for it and they're under a doctor's care.

Coevett wrote:

YMMV wrote:

$8.5 BILLION in testosterone sales this year.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/320301/predicted-annual-testosterone-drug-revenues-in-the-us/

TRT is notoriously hard to obtain in the UK. I believe TRT prescriptions are dished out like aspirin by doctors in the USA, however, even to 30 year olds.

Yet despite this, according to World Masters Rankings (which is a US based site), most of the rankings are dominated by Brits and Europeans.

It's also far easier for Masters to take part in track races in the USA.

That's not what this article says:

TRT is the buzzword wrote:

Coevett wrote:

TRT is notoriously hard to obtain in the UK. I believe TRT prescriptions are dished out like aspirin by doctors in the USA, however, even to 30 year olds.

Yet despite this, according to World Masters Rankings (which is a US based site), most of the rankings are dominated by Brits and Europeans.

It's also far easier for Masters to take part in track races in the USA.

That's not what this article says:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/testosterone-prescriptions-nhs-20-million-demand-increasing-trt-erectile-dysfunction-hypogonadism-a7331291.html

$20 million is 1/100th of the the U.S. expenditure on a per capita basis.

Coevett wrote:

YMMV wrote:

$8.5 BILLION in testosterone sales this year.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/320301/predicted-annual-testosterone-drug-revenues-in-the-us/

TRT is notoriously hard to obtain in the UK. I believe TRT prescriptions are dished out like aspirin by doctors in the USA, however, even to 30 year olds.

Yet despite this, according to World Masters Rankings (which is a US based site), most of the rankings are dominated by Brits and Europeans.

It's also far easier for Masters to take part in track races in the USA.

And yet you can't wait to get on it.

Did you forget that you said you though old folks should be allowed to dope? And, no you don't have more muscle than him or you would have not worried about slowing to walking pace in 20 years time.

Coevett wrote:

they're the worst wrote:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXalKNoB8z_/

Oh, stuff it.

The cost benefits of having a muscular frame as a runner are probably a little different as you get older.

Get back to us when you can run 15:53 over 50 while looking anything like this.That is way more than "a little extra muscle". This guy is either a complete genetic freak or doped beyond all recognition. I know where I would place my bet.

Coevett wrote:

So basically any Masters runner with some muscle is a TRT cheat? Has this guy actually been caught? His pic was posted in another thread as alleged proof that doping is rife in Masters, and yet I can't see any info on Google about him being busted.

So basically any African runner with some speed is an EPO cheat? Has this guy actually been caught? His pic was posted in another thread as alleged proof that doping is rife in Africa, and yet I can't see any info on Google about him being busted.

oldfastmen wrote:

Does he get tested for PEDs? Just curious about the elite older guys - not accusing him of anything.

The PEDs are right in plain sight on his feet

Whitlock sure didn't use vaporflys

Yet another age grouper cheating the memory of someone actually talented and high mpw training

oldfastmen wrote:

Does he get tested for PEDs? Just curious about the elite older guys - not accusing him of anything.

"He also said that he’s been tested twice for banned substances—once in competition after a masters track meet and once, about 18 months ago, testers showed up unannounced to his home"

From the RW article announcing the record.

Raddison wrote:

Coevett wrote:

So basically any Masters runner with some muscle is a TRT cheat? Has this guy actually been caught? His pic was posted in another thread as alleged proof that doping is rife in Masters, and yet I can't see any info on Google about him being busted.

So basically any African runner with some speed is an EPO cheat? Has this guy actually been caught? His pic was posted in another thread as alleged proof that doping is rife in Africa, and yet I can't see any info on Google about him being busted.

Anyone who age grades above 90% that didn't break 14 for 5K as an open runner is suspect.

As is anyone with body fat under 10%.

Anyone running faster than 85% age grade in anything othrt than 10 oz trainers is a shoe cheat.

Laugh at you putzez!

NowFindJimmyHoffa wrote:

2:54:23 ...

I'd bet a paycheck that he's using a combo of things... doesn't he have a high level degree in biochem or something similar ?

Sorry EW fans, but as predicted years ago, all Eds records will be gone once the boomers get up there....there's simply a narcissistic win at all costs mindset and culture of PEDS that will rewrite the books as they have all the way up.

The doping old guys (and girls) are worse than the kids - at least when you're young there's possibility of real reward. Only family and friends (maybe) care about masters performance. Disgusting.

Raddison wrote:

Coevett wrote:

So basically any Masters runner with some muscle is a TRT cheat? Has this guy actually been caught? His pic was posted in another thread as alleged proof that doping is rife in Masters, and yet I can't see any info on Google about him being busted.

So basically any African runner with some speed is an EPO cheat? Has this guy actually been caught? His pic was posted in another thread as alleged proof that doping is rife in Africa, and yet I can't see any info on Google about him being busted.

Wake me up when there's proof doping is endemic in master's running. All I'm saying is a bit of muscle on a ripped and aging frame isn't proof.

To anyone but an imbecile I think It's proven beyond doubt that doping is rife in Africa.

Coevett wrote:

Raddison wrote:

So basically any African runner with some speed is an EPO cheat? Has this guy actually been caught? His pic was posted in another thread as alleged proof that doping is rife in Africa, and yet I can't see any info on Google about him being busted.

Wake me up when there's proof doping is endemic in master's running. All I'm saying is a bit of muscle on a ripped and aging frame isn't proof.

To anyone but an imbecile I think It's proven beyond doubt that doping is rife in Africa.

Obviously my comment on your hypocrisy went way over your head. To put it in simple terms you are quite willing to give a white guy the benefit of the doubt and demand clear proof of cheating. But an African is guilty simply by place of birth and no further evidence is required. If you need a specific example look back the the thread you started in July, "Clean 1500m WR(?) is three years old today". Despite the fact that there have been 77 cases of people running faster than Nick Willis by 25 different athletes they can all be disregarded because they were by African born athletes. If we just consider times from 2005 and beyond (Seb Coe suggested scrubbing all records before 2005) you still have 25 better times by 15 different athletes. Yes some have been busted for drug use but that number is less than a fifth. Buy, hey, the're Africans so what the heck, scrub them all.

Before you go off on a tangent and accuse me of being a doping apologist, I am not. I believe there is a doping problem in Africa due to easily available drugs and a history of bureaucratic incompetence. I also believe there is a doping problem in the West due to micro doping and TUE abuse. Basically one is crude, the other sophisticated supported by high price doctors and, if necessary, high priced lawyers. The sport has a drug problem. Taking an attitude of they do but we don't is naive.

You are so obsessed about Africans that if a report came out about how Eliud Kipchoge won a primary school egg and spoon race when he was six years old you would start screaming drug cheat or age cheat.