Renato, Wejo, Rojo, Etc do you think it's possible for a female to run sub 29 min 10000m clean?

I think it's possible but if someone does do it they will be doping just like most or all of the sub 30 times.

[quote]ukathleticscoach wrote:

I think it's possible clean but if someone does do it they will most likely be doping just like most or all of the sub 30 times.

Nope. Not possible clean. Sub 29 was still an elite time for men in the early 60's. But I also take the view that there will not be a clean world record anywhere in track now. Doping has been the single greatest advance in the sport for well nigh half a century.

Difficult to imagine this happening without considerable help from PEDs. Consider how few women's 5000 are won in a time considerably faster than 14:30 - even at the very elite level.

"Shelby Houlihan- she stay healthty in the next 2 years she will run sub 14:25. Despite her success at 1500m and blazing kick I think the longer the track race the better Shelby performs even in mega fast races. She's definitely the one to take the 5000m and 10000m ARs under 14:23 and 29:30 if she focus on it for 2-3 years totally healthy."

Long way from 29:00, though!!

If women's world records are keeping pace with the improvements in the men's world records then it only shows they are both driven by the same thing: drugs. The human anatomy hasn't evolved in 20,000 years, let alone the last half century. It is ludicrous to see women today - like Ayana and Radcliffe - approaching performances that only the best men could once attain, and they were men who trained hard. Perhaps someone could explain the biological changes that permit this? The Lydiard method transformed middle and long distance running in the late 50's and early 60's; the next step in the revolution was altitude training - a legal form of "blood-doping" - but the rest is almost entirely due to ped's.

Livstrong7 wrote:

The question assumes that Ayana or anyone else in her league is currently clean. To beat 29min they would be at the same level as the great Emil Zatopek. If you believe a top woman runner can equal if not surpass a male athlete who was a multiple Olympic champion and world record holder at these distances, who also trained like a Trojan, then you have had your eyes closed as to what has been happening in this sport for the last half century. But that would be par for the course here.

I do think the sport is completely contaminated by PEDs at the top level today but are we not overlooking that Zatopek was running on sand tracks wearing heavy leather spikes? Looking at photos of him after some of his track races, he looks like he has just come off a heavy-going cross country course. Surely those factors must have impacted his times negatively when compared with someone running on a pristine mondo track with featherweight boost/energy return spikes. Considering this, Ron Clarke's 27-39 10000m on a sand track must be one of the greatest runs of all time.

VIPAM wrote:

Eventually with time it will be possible; however, my real question do you think its possible for a lady to run sun 29 minute track 10000m within the next 10-12 years? If so who do you feel is capable, if no current athlete....what shorter/longer pbs must such a runner need?

What does it take to run sub 14/29 for a lady? Well ..... a week like this would give guaranteed those times:

mo: 10-16 km at 3.55 min/ km

tu: 20 x 400m at 67 sec , rec= 120 bpm

we: 10-16 km at 3.55 min/ km

th: 10- 16 km at 3.55 min/ km

fr: 6-8 x 1600m at 4.52 min , rec= 120 bpm

sa: 16-25 km at 3.55 min / km

su: RESTDAY

.........and I think there is a couple of ladys in the top that quite easy could handle that program today.

@Equipment

You are right that improvements in tracks (they were mainly cinders in Zatopek's era) and shoes will have made a difference. But not as much as you might think. An example might be the 2010 Delhi Commonwealth Games, where despite modern tracks and shoes worn by professional athletes most of the times from the sprints to the distance events were no faster than those recorded on cinder tracks almost half a century earlier at the Tokyo Olympics in 1964. Snell would have won the Delhi 800m, and beaten the top Kenyans at those Games. And his generation were amateurs. I suspect doping control was quite strict at Delhi.

@Superior coach

What better to help your training programme than to dope?

Ever heard of Almaz Ayana wrote:

Ayana can do it. She was in sub 29 shape in Rio and London last year.

Just wanted to point out that the OP used the word 'clean' in the original statement.

Do I think a woman can break 29:00? Of course. Get 1 of the 20 NCAA guys to pull a Caitlyn Jenner and it will happen right now. Short of that, no. 29:00 is equivalent to like 13:50s low for 5000. I called John Kellogg to ask him about this and he said the current 29:17 WR is equivalent to 13:59 (or maybe he said 14:01 I can't remember). Anyways, I asked him if he thought it was possible and he quipped, "I don't think anyone has run under 29:50 clean." Now let me approach on the dumber predictions I've read on here in years.

VIPAM wrote:

3. Shelby Houlihan- she stay healthty in the next 2 years she will run sub 14:25. Despite her success at 1500m and blazing kick I think the longer the track race the better Shelby performs even in mega fast races. She's definitely the one to take the 5000m and 10000m ARs under 14:23 and 29:30 if she focus on it for 2-3 years totally healthy.

NO NO NO NO. You think a former 800 runner is going to run 29:30? That's ridiculous.

By your logic, David Rudisha should be the 10,000 WR holder.

rojo wrote:

... I called John Kellogg to ask him about this and he said the current 29:17 WR is equivalent to 13:59 (or maybe he said 14:01 I can't remember). Anyways, I asked him if he thought it was possible and he quipped, "I don't think anyone has run under 29:50 clean." ...

This. No legitimate female is running 29:17 clean let alone under 29:00 clean.