Breaking: Telegraph Exclusive: FBI joins probe into Mo Farah coach Alberto Salazar

fatbuttdisease wrote:

- Why don't NFL fans care about doping?

- Why do runners care so much about it?

The NFL is more about entertainment while T&F is about performance. Think about how often an NFL player has to be at 100% effort. The answer is about 1% of the time. In T&F, it is nearly 100% of the race time.

The Statue of Limitations wrote:

Armstrong learned the hard way that the statute of limitations is out the door when drug cheating is involved. It is eight years to test the last sample collected, but cheating extends the tolling. You should know this if you are going to comment.

No worries! I understand about tolling of statute of limitations and doping. That's why I said there are nuances around tolling that might apply.

I am not sure how the Armstrong or Hellebuyck precedents apply to Salazar. First of all, the USADA did not say "cheating extends the tolling." It said, "fraudulent concealment tolls the statute." In both cases, USADA said lying under oath about doping was fraudulent concealment, and tolled the statute of limitations. As far as I know, Salazar has not testified under oath, so it would seem that this approach does not apply to him.

It seems clear that USADA wants to get Salazar and his friends to testify under oath. I assume this is why USADA tried to depose Dr. Brown under Texas Rule 202.

I agree with your broader point: The Hellebuyck and Armstrong cases show that USADA has some wiggle room for tolling the statute of limitations. I'm just not sure those cases apply to Salazar's situation.

PS As I said before, the WADA rules say nothing about abuse of prescriptions, so I don't see how there could an anti-doping case against Salazar based on the Goucher/Cytomel story. I have no idea about whether he's done anything that could toll the federal or state statute of limitations for any criminal case.

How do you view the investigation of Bonds to be a huge win? He was convicted of one count at trial but that was overturned on appeal.

How do you view the investigation of Clemons to be a huge win? Clemons was found not guilty on all counts.

The feds spent millions of dollars on these investigations. I consider that a huge waste.

How do you call it waste? Bonds and Clemons are both not in the Hall Of Fame and both came very close to going to prison, most likely because they lied under oath. Without the PED scandals both retired earlier, disgraced, under the huge suspicion of doping, earlier than they would have had the PED scandals not happened. Bonds may have played another 3-4 years and ended up with over 900 Home Runs.

Read the books. The Game Of Shadows book, the Jeff Pearlman books on Bonds and Clemons, Victor Conte's book, all the books on Lance, the Tim Elfink book (Blood Sport: A-Rod and the Quest to End Baseball's Steroid Era). It's the same movie script every time. As soon as the Feds get involved it's going down. Sure it costs millions of dollars but that's what it takes to bring down dopers in sports and is not a waste.

Rattlesnakes can kill wrote:

The Statue of Limitations wrote:

Armstrong learned the hard way that the statute of limitations is out the door when drug cheating is involved. It is eight years to test the last sample collected, but cheating extends the tolling. You should know this if you are going to comment.

No worries! I understand about tolling of statute of limitations and doping. That's why I said there are nuances around tolling that might apply.

In Salazar's case he extended the tolling by claiming there was nothing to see in his 12,000 word manifesto (mostly written by a PR firm). Refusing to cooperate is not a tactic to get around any statute of limitations. Those accused and their lawyers cannot stonewall to force enough time to pass to make the booboo go away. At this point it makes no difference how long it takes to conduct a case against Salazar. The process started before any tolling would have applied.

dadadada_thuth wrote:

How do you call it waste? Bonds and Clemons are both not in the Hall Of Fame and both came very close to going to prison, most likely because they lied under oath....

It's the same movie script every time. As soon as the Feds get involved it's going down. Sure it costs millions of dollars but that's what it takes to bring down dopers in sports and is not a waste.

Why is it a good thing that our tax dollars were used to keep Bonds and Clemens out of the HoF? I'm not sure how keeping them out of the HoF serves the goals of federal government, which are to: "establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity."

I'm also not sure how your claim fits with the "rule of law." You know, that bit about how the government can't take your "life, liberty or property" unless they follow "due process of law." Most people think due process includes things like trials. Since Bonds and Clemons were tried but not convicted, it's hard to see how the extra-legal punishments you tout should be seen as a benefit of the legal investigations.

FWIW, I agree that Clemons and Bonds were cheaters and should not get into the HoF. I'm also sure that keeping them out is not the government's job.

It is so clear and has been made so clear that something has been going on for years. It'll be interesting to see what the feds uncover. It's unfortunate that it did not happen prior to the 2016 Rio Olympics. However, if more evidence can be uncovered before Boston, that would be helpful for the sport as a whole.

Verifier wrote:

So all I've learned from this non-story is that there's still no evidence of NOP doping, and the FBI is being called in to make sure nothing was missed.

Ditto.

There's no story here.

Is this 'rojo' character illiterate? Shamefully inept writing aside, he accepts Chavez's citation of "Ben Rumsby of The Telegraph" as a credible sourcing. Seriously, whoever this rojo person is, I'm hoping we can get him to a proper institution that will improve deficiencies in literacy and logic.

The Statue of Limitations wrote:

Refusing to cooperate is not a tactic to get around any statute of limitations. Those accused and their lawyers cannot stonewall to force enough time to pass to make the booboo go away.

What counts as "refusing to cooperate" or "stonewalling"? Taking the 5th? Lying to investigators? Wearing a mask while robbing a bank?

Obstructing an investigation.

You man Salazar is toast.

what happens if al sal is caught?

he's already been caught. duh?

what? are you waiting for some official body to say he's guilty?

really, you really think the IOC, USTAF, or other establishment have any real credibility?

30% of the united states are popping prescription drugs left and right.

then there is hard drugs and alcohol.

then you have your track and field.

you gotta start over, from scratch.

longjack wrote:

what happens if al sal is caught?

he's already been caught. duh?

what? are you waiting for some official body to say he's guilty?

really, you really think the IOC, USTAF, or other establishment have any real credibility?

30% of the united states are popping prescription drugs left and right.

then there is hard drugs and alcohol.

then you have your track and field.

you gotta start over, from scratch.

Their report also alleges that Salazar has sworn by thyroid hormones for years. His substances of choice are called Levoxyl, Thyroxine and Cytomel. Brown is alleged to have prescribed the medications to the athletes even though they didn't suffer from thyroid problems.

The substances became a "kind of THROTTLE" for Salazar. He used it to "try to REV UP the runners, to help them recover from a hard workout or prepare for an important competition."

SALAZAR it appears, is COACH, DOCTOR and PHARMACIST all in one. He also apparently decides when athletes are to take their preparations and WHAT DOSE THEY SHOULD GET.

In a Dec. 20, 2011, email to Rupp, he wrote: "TAKE A FULL EXTRA LEVOXYL TONIGHT AND START ON CYTOMEL RIGHT AWAY. P.S. I'VE GOT CYTOMEL. IF YOU DON'T HAVE IT, CALL ME AND I'LL DRIVE IT OVER."

Alberto's testosterone 'experiments' on his sons broke various federal and state drug laws, since he was administering the schedule III controlled substance and prescription drug AndroGel to two other people who did not have a prescription for AndroGel.

ALBERTO SALAZAR IS NOT A DOCTOR and should not be telling Galen Rupp to take "a full extra Levoxyl" and "start on cytomel (T3) right away".

Then ALBERTO says that HE HAS THE PRESCRIPTION THYROID HORMONE DRUG CYTOMEL!!!... AND CAN DRIVE IT OVER TO GALEN RUPP. IT THAT HAPPENED, IT WOULD MEAN THAT GALEN RUPP WOULD BE TAKING ALBERTO'S PRESCRIPTION DRUG CYTOMEL.

ALBERTO SALAZAR SHOULD NOT ACT AS A PHARMACY AND SHOULD NOT BE DISTRIBUTING THE PRESCRIPTION THYROID HORMONE DRUG CYTOMEL TO ANY OTHER PEOPLE…(including Galen Rupp)…SINCE THAT WOULD BE ILLEGAL.

Questions:

1) Why does Alberto Salazar have the prescription thyroid hormone drug cytomel at his house?

2) Does Alberto Salazar have a prescription from his doctor to take cytomel for his 'hypothyroidism' medical condition?... in addition to having a prescription from his doctor for testosterone gel to treat his 'hypogonadism' medical condition?

SPIEGEL presented Salazar's emails to the professor for comment:

"This trainer is acting as an alchemist, a drug procurer and hormone adulterer to these athletes," he says.

"He should be banned immediately; THERE IS NO REASON FOR DELAY."

Phil Knight Nike Speed Suitâ„¢ for Galen Getaway:

Go Galen!!!

longjack wrote:

what happens if al sal is caught?

he's already been caught. duh?

what? are you waiting for some official body to say he's guilty?

really, you really think the IOC, USTAF, or other establishment have any real credibility?

30% of the united states are popping prescription drugs left and right.

then there is hard drugs and alcohol.

then you have your track and field.

you gotta start over, from scratch.

Have you read any of my posts on this subject? I had said exactly what you posted. I suspect that you are Calculo being a troll.

rojo wrote:

2) Your joking right when you say you need a "reputable investigative reporter"?

His joking right and not left?

rojo wrote:

b) Androgel on sun - Salazar admitted.I thought for sure he'd deny this.

That's pretty amazing. Salazar went all the way to the sun!

I've read those books. If you think keeping Bonds and Clemons out of the Hall of Fame is an appropriate use of millions of government dollars, well, I think our premises are too far different to have any constructive agreement.

Who cares about goals of the federal government and rule of law. There were criminal and doping offenses and MLB wasn't able to self-govern themselves. Nothing happened until the Feds stepped in. I hope they look into the NFL next. People say it's a waste of money that the Feds went after Bonds and Clemons since they weren't found to be guilty but look at the price they payed and how PEDs in MLB has changed. It was worth it.

Mr. Obvious wrote:

I think our premises are too far different to have any constructive agreement.

Well said.

Every time I check in on this thread, I can't help but think Yogi was right: It's deja vu all over again.

Stop Making Sense wrote:

Mr. Obvious wrote:

I think our premises are too far different to have any constructive agreement.

Well said.

Every time I check in on this thread, I can't help but think Yogi was right: It's deja vu all over again.

For example:

"There is NO AUDIT TRAIL of what was going in and out of a comprehensive supply of medical products. British Cycling had NO EXCUSE, just an acknowledgement that there was NO POLICY and NO RECORDS," revealed Sapstead. GAME OVER.

Yet even this paltry excuse failed to stand up to scrutiny. Because the lack of records means that we have NO WAY OF KNOWING what Team Sky doctor Richard Freeman was giving to the team's cyclists. He claims he did have records but they were on a laptop which was stolen in 2014. The poor doctor is a very unlucky man - last week he was due to be questioned by the culture, media and sport committee but pulled out at the last minute due to illness.

Add the Salazar story to Farah's claims about not knowing Jama Aden, the Somali coach arrested for doping offences who ran training groups in which the runner participated, and the fact that he came within one missed drugs test of being suspended from athletics, and a pattern might seem to emerge.

UKA DID NOT DIRECTLY ANSWER REPEATED REQUESTS from the BBC for detail about whether medical protocols on RECORD-KEEPING were followed over the infusion, which was given to Farah before his London Marathon debut in 2014.

The BBC understands, however, that staff failed to centrally log key data into the UKA system, and investigators have therefore been UNABLE TO ESTABLISH beyond doubt what the infusion levels were.

It states: "Oregon Project athlete Mo Farah received an L-carnitine infusion from British physician Robin Chakraverty in April 2014."

SALAZAR HAD SENT INSTRUCTIONS BY EMAIL TO BARRY FUDGE, a UK Athletics physiologist, to assist him in "preparing an L-carnitine infusion for Mo Farah to use prior to Farah's marathon debut, set to occur in the London marathon" on 13 April, 2014.

The Salazar email to Fudge included an infusion protocol used on other, unnamed, NOP athletes.

Usada's investigation revealed its scientists believed that the large increases in L-carnitine levels in several NOP athletes' bodies after infusion would not be possible if the 50ml limit was adhered to.

In Farah's case, according to the report, Usada had not obtained medical evidence of the dosage taken before the race..

...But on Wednesday, UKA declined to deny the allegation that its staff FAILED TO KEEP ADEQUATE MEDICAL RECORDS.

...Dr Chakraverty declined to comment.

The BBC has asked FUDGE for comment.

Salazar faces possible sanction from Usada over the infusions but also his possession of the banned anabolic steroid testosterone, first revealed by Panorama in June 2015. Salazar insists he has a valid prescription for the drug.

The leaked interim report states the American has thus far failed to provide "acceptable justification for possessing testosterone" at his NOP running camp.

The QUANTITY of banned TESTOSTERONE PATCHES received is UNKNOWN, but the Sunday Times reports that UKAD has established that sixty to seventy 40mg vials of triamcinolone were delivered to the Manchester velodrome in 2011, though NO MEDICAL RECORDS have been produced to justify such a quantity.

"I was with a colleague when the order arrived and it was immediately brought to our attention. Dr Freeman, who was responsible for ordering medical supplies, explained that the order had never been placed and so MUST HAVE BEEN SENT IN ERROR," Peters told the Sunday Times.

No worries for Sir Dave or Sir Mo.

It is just another coincidental synchronicity.

Barry Fudge.

Guess who frequently travels to remote parts of the world with Mo?