2006 called & said, The economy is good!
2006 called & said, The economy is good!
Racket wrote:
L L wrote:
I don't see the Democratic party as fractured, I see it as very large and inclusive.
Vs. a Republican party that may be closer together on issues, but much smaller in overall size.
Here is a summary of the 2018 election:
Democratic House candidates won 58,990,609 votes while their Republican counterparts pulled in 50,304,975. That means that Democrats won 53.1 percent of all votes counted while Republicans earned 45.2 percent.
Dems got 8 million more votes an an 8% margin over Republicans.
Numbers for the 2018 senate (mostly blue states up for election, I admit):
Repub 34,723,013 38.80%
Dems 52,260,651 58.40%
Any fractured Democrats will not vote Republican in 2020.
You are not exactly wooing new comers.
You keep using 1 midterm election as evidence for some grand narrative you've concocted.
All I see is literally what happens in every midterm : the other party turns out more and wins.
I believe 2018 was the best Dems have done at midterms in something like 60 years. I'd have to check that but I think it's true. Or true-ish anyway. Saying 2018 was just another midterm is not accurate.
agip wrote:
Racket wrote:
You keep using 1 midterm election as evidence for some grand narrative you've concocted.
All I see is literally what happens in every midterm : the other party turns out more and wins.
I believe 2018 was the best Dems have done at midterms in something like 60 years. I'd have to check that but I think it's true. Or true-ish anyway. Saying 2018 was just another midterm is not accurate.
Big deal. Tea party elections in the 2010 midterm where probably off the charts as well. Unless you convince me this isn't just a natural escalation of business as usual (which it probably is but it's gonna take more than 1 midterm to convince me) then I'm not about to join the "thiS TImE its diFfERENT" squad
Racket wrote:
agip wrote:
I believe 2018 was the best Dems have done at midterms in something like 60 years. I'd have to check that but I think it's true. Or true-ish anyway. Saying 2018 was just another midterm is not accurate.
Big deal. Tea party elections in the 2010 midterm where probably off the charts as well. Unless you convince me this isn't just a natural escalation of business as usual (which it probably is but it's gonna take more than 1 midterm to convince me) then I'm not about to join the "thiS TImE its diFfERENT" squad
I agree with you that reports of the death of the GOP are exaggerated.
Until texas goes blue. That will be a major moment in the history of the nation and will force the GOP to either quit presidential politics...or change.
2018 was the largest voter turnout since women won the right to vote in 1920. They took fat boy’s advice & pretended he was on the ballot.
single wing wrote:
agip wrote:
yeah, they aren't worth much agreed .Esp since Bernie hasn't seen any negative campaigning from Rs yet and Biden ah has seen some negative news stories about him and his family.
Plus, people are ashamed to tell pollsters they are Trumpists - we see that sense of shame for all the white nationalist parties around the globe.
Sanders also has the highest polling among African Americans now. He also has the highest favorability rating among non college educated white men.
He clearly and obviously has the most diverse coalition.
I expect agip to get on the Sanders train all along.
This three day old article has Biden leading Sanders by 8 points amongst African-Americans.
I am open to data you share that suggests otherwise.
Ciro wrote:
single wing wrote:
Sanders also has the highest polling among African Americans now. He also has the highest favorability rating among non college educated white men.
He clearly and obviously has the most diverse coalition.
I expect agip to get on the Sanders train all along.
This three day old article has Biden leading Sanders by 8 points amongst African-Americans.
I am open to data you share that suggests otherwise.
as I pointed out above, Sanders is leading biden among all non-white voters...that might be what single wing is referring to. Apparently sanders has done a lot of work with hispanic voters and that is paying off.
Sally Vix wrote:
jesseriley wrote:
Guardian already live, expecting another big day for bill barr, and not just when he steps on the scale!
How come not one Dem here has not condemned Jesse for making fun of Barr's weight? You ripped me to shreds for inartfully suggesting that Zoe Lofgren might be a carrying around a few too many pounds. Are you principled enough to criticize Jesse for saying what he said - or you are just political hacks? Zoe is a Dem - so we will protect her? Barr is a Trump crony so it is open season on him? Show some integrity and call out Jesse for making fun of Barr's weight. Do the right thing for once!
I called him a toad, but that was a comment on his character, not his appearance.
agip wrote:
I don't think it's true that Sanders polls best among African Americans.
I do think Sanders might poll best among all non-white voters though.
Maybe you confused those two stats.
Look, I'm going to vote for anyone running against Trump. I think Sanders is winning only because of a split moderate vote and I think he will run weakly against Trump, and have short coattails in other races such as the house and senate. I am not a socialist and I am not a leftist. This country is neither leftist or socialist. I do not support much of what Sanders supports. I think Sanders would be like Corbyn in the UK...just the wrong answer to populist rightism.
But I'd vote for him in a nano-second over trump.
Well, I think I got confused, but not in that way.
The poll linked at the bottom says that African Americans say that Sanders is the most electable candidate. Which isn't quite the same thing. It depends on which poll you look at but clearly nobody has a hammerlock on the African American vote, as it appeared Biden did for so long and Sanders is very competitive.
I hope you and your fellow moderates are going to excoriate other moderates who are stating they weren't vote for Bernie the same way you and your fellow travelers excoriated the so-called Bernie Bros who said they wouldn't vote for H. Clinton or some other moderate (even though, as I have sourced here, Bernie primary voters acted pretty much exactly like other primary voters).
Don’t worry sally, the rare trumpanzee who’s fit is equally loathsome.
Jim Jordan was just called a liar & coward by another OSU wrestler in the Ohio legislature the other day, during hearings about a remedy to the long-running wrestling scandal which Jordan (of course!) knew nothing about.
Veteran who President Trump praised during State of the Union speech for turning his life around thanks to an Opportunity Zone tax break reveals his comeback had nothing to do with the policy http://va.topbuzz.com/s/ebNwxM
I've also given examples of the 2019 governor races in the south.
And there were 2017 special elections that didn't go well for Republicans.
Also, Trump lost Virginia in 2016. I don't know if a Republican president has lost Virginia since Lincoln.
That state has gone from red, to swing, to blue in a pretty short time.
And do Trump fans think he has Florida in the bag in November?
My point was that the "fractured" Democrat party is still large and will vote Democrat in the fall.
Vote blue no matter who. Are you also onboard if Sanders does not get the nomination?
agip wrote:
Look at it this way - if there were one moderate instead of four, and polls were saying
Moderate 60%
Bernie 40%
Would you still be in favor of nominating the 80 year old guy with the radical plans that most people dont' want? Maybe? bernie has support of 1 of dems...he doesn't represent the party.
There just is no evidence that moderates do or would coalesce that way. Among Biden supporters, Bernie is the second choice. Among Warren supporters, Mayor Pete is the second choice. I have no idea how Mayor Mike's entry plays into any of that.
agip wrote:
bernie has the support of 1 of 4 dems that should say.
He has more support than any other candidate.
damn, forgot the poll. Bernie considered most electable candidate among African Americans by 11 points:
thehill.com/homenews/campaign/482969-sanders-builds-double-digit-national-lead-poll
agip wrote:
probably every single one of the Dem frontrunners is running to the left of any previous recent Dem nominee. Isn't that enough?
It might be enough if not for the climate crisis.
A moderate won't do what it takes to save our children from crop failure and starvation.
We are already on the brink of runaway warming. You can't fight physics with moderate half measures.
Ciro wrote:
Vote blue no matter who. Are you also onboard if Sanders does not get the nomination?
You should ask a Sanders supporter that question. I am for Warren.
I also am not a democrat and have never said that any voter is obligated to vote for any candidate. It is a question of whether the moderates who have been wrongly excoriating the "Bernie Bros" for four years are going to be consistent.
Racket wrote:
agip wrote:
I believe 2018 was the best Dems have done at midterms in something like 60 years. I'd have to check that but I think it's true. Or true-ish anyway. Saying 2018 was just another midterm is not accurate.
Big deal. Tea party elections in the 2010 midterm where probably off the charts as well. Unless you convince me this isn't just a natural escalation of business as usual (which it probably is but it's gonna take more than 1 midterm to convince me) then I'm not about to join the "thiS TImE its diFfERENT" squad
I agree with agip - given how much success the fully controlled GOP gov't supposedly had in passing all their priority bills, 2018 was a historic beat down.
single wing wrote:
Ciro wrote:
Vote blue no matter who. Are you also onboard if Sanders does not get the nomination?
You should ask a Sanders supporter that question. I am for Warren.
I also am not a democrat and have never said that any voter is obligated to vote for any candidate. It is a question of whether the moderates who have been wrongly excoriating the "Bernie Bros" for four years are going to be consistent.
Ah my bad, same question to you as a Warren backer?
I’ll back Warren or Sanders in a heartbeat over Trump.
If Buttigieg, Biden or Klobuchar got the nomination would you back any or all of them against Trump?
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