budget problems? wrote:
Shouldn't the trials be like a real marathon? Otherwise why not hold the trials on a track?
Do they have the same problems with closing roads there as Portland? Portland just lost their spring half-marathon, partly because they couldn't get a permit to close the roads.
Because it's designed for spectators. Olympic trials qualifiers aren't like hobby joggers who demand a "scenic" course and write bad reviews on marathonguide.com if there are too many turns.
Current LA marathon course drops several hundred feet in elevation p2p from Dodger Stadium to Santa Monica. I doubt USATF wants a downhill course for the Olympic Trials.
If they don't run the LA Marathon course why do they even need to hold it the same weekend as the LA Marathon?
Logistics. Lower cost to run the races.
Fan support. If you've got 25,000 non-elites running a marathon, there's a good chance many of them will come out to watch the Olympic hopefuls the day before.
Boston and New York in 2008 and Houston in 2012 did the same thing hosting the trials on a loop course the day before the big-city race.
2016 USA MT is buildup for 2024 Los Angeles.
Sesamoiditis wrote:
If they don't run the LA Marathon course why do they even need to hold it the same weekend as the LA Marathon?
Isn't this how they ran the trials in Houston? It does present the trials with a 'built-in' audience with all the runners in town for the marathon the following day. Not sure if they had a totally different course or not though.
budget problems? wrote:
Shouldn't the trials be like a real marathon? Otherwise why not hold the trials on a track?
Do they have the same problems with closing roads there as Portland? Portland just lost their spring half-marathon, partly because they couldn't get a permit to close the roads.
Because the Trials have been on a multi-loop course the past few cycles?
http://www.usatf.org/events/2004/OlympicTrials-Marathon-Women/athleteInfo/course.asphttp://www.usatf.org/events/2004/OlympicTrials-Marathon-Men/athleteInfo/course.asphttp://www.usatf.org/events/2008/OlympicTrials-Marathon-Men/athleteInfo/course.asphttp://www.usatf.org/events/2012/OlympicTrials-Marathon/athleteInfo/index.aspcoach d wrote:
1932 1984 ?2024? wrote:USC is close to hosting it's 3rd Summer Olympic games in 2024. L.A. Mayor Garcetti, USATF CEO Siegel, and USATF President Hightower have the course running through USC, Memorial Coliseum, L.A. Live, etc.
And that's all we in the LA area care about--the 2024 Olympics, not the next one. You have to BE SOMEBODY in LA for anyone to pay attention. You need rings, gold medals, or championships like Kobe, Shaq, Kareem, LA Kings, Felix, Mo Greene, USC football, UCLA basketball. Nobody really cares about a bunch of marathon joggers who haven't WON anything.
What have you ever done?
joho wrote:
Sesamoiditis wrote:If they don't run the LA Marathon course why do they even need to hold it the same weekend as the LA Marathon?
Isn't this how they ran the trials in Houston? It does present the trials with a 'built-in' audience with all the runners in town for the marathon the following day. Not sure if they had a totally different course or not though.
I live in Houston, and I spectated the 2012 trials. It was a loop course, and it was different from the Chevron Houston Marathon course (also a loop, but just one loop). If I recall correctly, the athletes did one small loop, then three large loops.
As a spectator, I really enjoyed the opportunity to see the the runners several times over the course of the race. It also kept the spectators downtown longer, so we had more opportunities to see the sponsor displays and eat in the area restaurants.
Short answer: Because LA is the most awful city in the US. It makes no difference where or how the course is structured within LA, it is going to be terrible.
Is the course hilly at least to give it some tactical aspect?
Don't Go STL wrote:
Is the course hilly at least to give it some tactical aspect?
No, but every runner is required to steal a hubcap and paint some graffiti each loop.
Winner has to join a gang.
oh no you didnt wrote:
Don't Go STL wrote:Is the course hilly at least to give it some tactical aspect?
No, but every runner is required to steal a hubcap and paint some graffiti each loop.
Winner has to join a gang.
No! Winner joins one of the many storefront churches on the course. Or, maybe pitch a tent under the freeway.
Lousy??? Have you ever spectated a point to point 26 miler? Now that's lousy. Was in Central Park for those 5 loops in '07, was awesome!
I just ran the course yesterday so I feel I can provide some details missing from this thread.
The first 2mi loop that is only run once has 11 90 degree turns.
The 6mi loop that is repeated 4 times has 20 turns and with the way the side walks shift directions you could call it closer to 24 turns per loop. Conservatively it's 91 turns with those running it probably feeling more like 100+ turns over 26.2 miles.
During the 6mi loop mostly all the turns are condensed over a very span on the USC campus and Exposition Park. This section of the course is also ran on a lot of brick "walkways" that have narrow paths compared to roads and sharp turns since they weren't designed for traffic. There is no doubt that runners practicing on rail trails or other long straightaways aren't going to be prepared for the 2 miles of constant rythm breaking turns. Once you leave the USC campus it's all uphill back to the Staples center on a road that's completely straight (the final loop is going to be interesting with the final miles at a steady uphill) for what seems like close to 2miles.
There are three big turns within the last 400 meters including 1 complete U turn and 2 90 degree turns. I would have liked a better finish set up where the athletes aren't weaving around barriers but it looks like they didn't have a lot of options.
Overall there aren't any steep hills which leaves the main antagonist the 100+ turns over the course. I think the race is going to be slower than the race directors are hoping because of the turns forcing the athletes to speed up and slow down constantly. Id like to see a map of the Rio course and if it has a lot of turns this will be a perfect race course.
Another factor that may contribute to tough conditions is a high sun and warm temps. I ran the course at 10 am and it was already in the 60's which isn't uncommon here and by 11 the sun was well above us heating up the road temps. With just normal conditions I'd expect the race to be run around 60 degrees and having the sun above the runners will make it feel more like 70's.
It's a championship race and it'll be very spectator friendly. The runners are going to be pretty beat up after this race due to the turns and most likely warm temps.
It is easier to ensure that a course with multiple small loops is secure as opposed to a point to point or large loop course. Remember, it is the US Olympic Marathon Trials. Sad to say, but organizers have to spend a significant time, money and planning to ensure the safety of athletes and fans. As a result, somethings we used to take for granted get compromised.
Don't Go STL wrote:
Is the course hilly at least to give it some tactical aspect?
Not really. Here is a good elevation chart.
http://findmymarathon.com/elevation.php?elevation=U.S.%20Olympic%20Marathon%20TrialsThe course does seem tight though with sharp turn arounds - 90/180 degrees.
http://www.usatf.org/events/courses/maps/showMap.asp?courseID=CA15078RSDust wrote:
I live in Houston, and I spectated the 2012 trials. It was a loop course, and it was different from the Chevron Houston Marathon course (also a loop, but just one loop). If I recall correctly, the athletes did one small loop, then three large loops.
As a spectator, I really enjoyed the opportunity to see the the runners several times over the course of the race. It also kept the spectators downtown longer, so we had more opportunities to see the sponsor displays and eat in the area restaurants.
Well, where they are looping is not spectator friendly. At best, there are fast food joints where the hungover USC students will be eating breakfast at 1pm, storefront churches, and body shops. When they run under the freeway, you might get a nice view of a small part of L.A.'s homeless population if McCourt hasn't had them swept up.
L.A. marathon's website does not mention trials at all. I think it's an entirely different organization.
Did you see lots of other Houston marathon runners spectating? It's an honest question.
A multiple loop course is fine because it is good for spectators, easier for organizers and the city where it's held, and you don't have the huge range of running times to deal with in a mass participation marathon where multiple loops would have sub-3 hour marathoners running through mobs of 7-hour marathoners on the 2nd loop, etc. The 2008 trials courses in Central Park (men) and Boston (women) were good courses for all these reasons. They were also scenic.
However, the LA trials course looks less than ideal because it has so many tight and repeated turns. It will slow times down, increase issues with injuries or collisions, and make it harder for runners to see who they are running against. Parts are not going to be very attractive either.
I think the ideal loop course would be shaped like a giant track that 3 to 6 miles around instead of 400 meters, with as gradual turns as possible, preferably in a scenic area with amenities for spectators. Calling it lousy it a bit strong, but the LA course doesn't look that great either.
