Less prestigious education with better running program or other way around?

College Running

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9 years ago 03/19/2015 10:28am EDT

re: education > athletics

I'll go ahead and support the post from "here's the deal" as well. Unless you think you can make a living off of running, I would look into which school is the best fit.

I will go ahead and tell you that you are not going to make a living off of running, so hopefully I just narrowed that down for you. I was lucky in that my first choice of school also offered me an athletic scholarship, so my choice was an easy one.

I know that running is really important. At 36, I still run for an hour or more every day. I race much less often, but it is a big part of my life. I ran low 14s in college for the 5k and sub 30 for the 10k. I didn't study hard enough. If I could go back and add 30 seconds or even a minute to each PR time and spend more time focusing on my education, I would gladly make the trade-off. I am happy in my career, but I could have spent more time focusing on what I really wanted to do. The world is your oyster, man. It's a cliche, but holy smokes is it true.

Because you do not know what you want to do, it is even more important that you find a school with a solid career-counseling program that can help you on that journey. Whatever you do, do NOT pick a major that allows you to focus on running first and foremost.

Good luck and you seem like a smart kid who will make the best decision.

9 years ago 03/19/2015 10:44am EDT

re: KemBOII

You need to consider the cost of the education as well. You can get a good education almost anywhere if the school is accredited. You want to get a degree with as little debt as possible. Really, if you are not going to be pro, why would you want to run for a top tier program and get lost in the mix?

9 years ago 03/19/2015 12:49pm EDT

re: Avocado's Number

Avocado's Number wrote:
This question comes up pretty often. My own view is that, unless it's pretty clear that you're going to be a serious candidate for an Olympic team (or something at that level), the running program should take a back seat. In fact, if you're an academic star, the running program should probably take a back seat even if you're a serious candidate for an Olympic team. Be grateful that your running may have gotten you into a top academic institution, and take advantage of it.
Of course, there can be some tough choices. I'm hesitant to provide any particular comparisons of my own, because I don't want to get enmeshed in one of those threads about which school is better or more prestigious or some such thing. But I will pass on Kenny Moore's anecdote about Bill Bowerman, the legendary coach at the University of Oregon. When Ric Rojas, an outstanding high school runner from New Mexico, was offered admission and a full scholarship to Harvard, Bowerman told him, "You'd be crazy to come to Oregon." Good advice. Rojas went to Harvard. He still managed to become a pretty darn good runner.
Many of us on this site were, at one time or another, obsessed with becoming the best runners we could be. There are circumstances when that's probably fine. But running at your peak is, at best, a fleeting thing, and life can be very long, so be very careful about letting your running ambitions dictate your choice.

^^^ this.

Bottom line: if you can afford it, go to an Ivy. Ideally, Princeton (just because Harvard and Yale's running programs pale in comparison).

If you're good enough to get a large athletic scholarship and $ is an issue, go to one of the great academic D1 schools that also have good to great running programs like Stanford, G'town, UVA, Wisco, Notre Dame.

9 years ago 03/19/2015 12:58pm EDT

re: get used to it..

If it's an Ivy, remember none give athletic scholarships, but they all have very good need based financial aid. For a lot of people who might be generally left our finances wise from other schools, it might be cheaper to attend an Ivy with the aid they provide. Something like all costs are covered at Harvard if the family's combined income is less than $100k (rough numbers, haven't looked at it in awhile, there's more to it than just income such as total assets or something).

So don't let cost dissuade you from an Ivy if there's some perception that it's not affordable.

9 years ago 03/19/2015 1:29pm EDT

re: KemBOII

I'd pick the school that has the most majors you think you'd be interested in, then. Transferring to another school is possible (I did,) but it's harder than changing majors.

9 years ago 03/19/2015 1:40pm EDT

re: KemBOII

Don't worry about prestige and a Bachelors.Anyone in recruiting knows that a Bachelors from an Icy is meaningless and more about the parents financials than intelligence.Worry about prestige when you do a Masters....

KemBOII wrote:
Hey Letsrun. Currently I am a senior in high school coming up upon decision time for where to go to school next year.
I really want to run as fast as I possibly can in college and have been accepted to and recruited to a top tier distance program. But, I also am relatively smart (35 ACT), and have been accepted to some really prestigious academic universities whose programs are not as strong.
I just wanted to get some input from others on this dilemma. I feel that college will be my one big shot at running as fast as I can and I feel like I would regret not doing everything I can to reach my potential. But, I also feel that going to a less prestigious academic school wouldn't set me up as well for the future.
What do you guys think?

9 years ago 03/19/2015 2:35pm EDT

re: Avocado's Number

Avocado's Number wrote:
This question comes up pretty often. My own view is that, unless it's pretty clear that you're going to be a serious candidate for an Olympic team (or something at that level), the running program should take a back seat. In fact, if you're an academic star, the running program should probably take a back seat even if you're a serious candidate for an Olympic team. Be grateful that your running may have gotten you into a top academic institution, and take advantage of it.
Of course, there can be some tough choices. I'm hesitant to provide any particular comparisons of my own, because I don't want to get enmeshed in one of those threads about which school is better or more prestigious or some such thing. But I will pass on Kenny Moore's anecdote about Bill Bowerman, the legendary coach at the University of Oregon. When Ric Rojas, an outstanding high school runner from New Mexico, was offered admission and a full scholarship to Harvard, Bowerman told him, "You'd be crazy to come to Oregon." Good advice. Rojas went to Harvard. He still managed to become a pretty darn good runner.
Many of us on this site were, at one time or another, obsessed with becoming the best runners we could be. There are circumstances when that's probably fine. But running at your peak is, at best, a fleeting thing, and life can be very long, so be very careful about letting your running ambitions dictate your choice.

+100

9 years ago 03/19/2015 3:46pm EDT

re: lol prestige

[quote]lol prestige wrote:

Don't worry about prestige and a Bachelors.

Anyone in recruiting knows that a Bachelors from an Icy is meaningless and more about the parents financials than intelligence.

Worry about prestige when you do a Masters....

[quote]

^^^ this is bad advice.

Sorry, but I've hired dozens of people for white collar jobs--product managers, engineers, program managers, project marketers, financial types, writers, etc.

Where you went to undergrad most definitely matters. Going to an Ivy undergrad is a golden ticket that pays dividends throughout your career.

And, with the cost of college now, a lot of people aren't getting Masters degrees.

By the way, if I got two resumes on my desk that went to the same school and one of them was a D1 athlete, I'm picking the athlete.

I once interviewed a guy basically because he was an accomplished D1 pitcher. Great guy. Made an offer. He didn't take the job :(

9 years ago 03/19/2015 5:21pm EDT

re: In Too

I'm not disillusioned in thinking that I will be an Olympian or even be able to make a living off running. I realize the odds of that are very slim, but there is still something about wanting to run fast despite that that draws me to it. Odds are I will never become a professional runner, but there are a limited few years where I can train at a high level and become as fast as I can, whereas I would have the rest of my life to work and all that.

9 years ago 03/19/2015 5:51pm EDT

re: KemBOII

Go with the better education program. Unless you're good enough to go pro or be an Olympian, (and even that is not a given, no matter how good you are) running will become a hobby after you graduate. Your education will carry you around for the rest of your life and you will have to rely on it to get a job in this economy.

9 years ago 03/22/2015 8:52am EDT

re: KemBOII

Are you going to be a professional runner or professional lawyer, business owner or doctor. My gosh, a 35 ACT! That is incredible! Choose the college that best prepares you for the next 40 years of your life. You do not have to go to Oregon, USC or Texas to have an amazing running experience. In 20 years, know one will be asking you what you ran the 1500M in - my .02

8 years ago 08/15/2015 2:54pm EDT

re: Avocado's Number

HI Avocado,

Are you still around? I saw you post about Bill Bowerman giving me the advice about attending Harvard. Pretty good story - there is more to it, but you got the gest. Is Moore's anecdote documented anywhere? Please let me know if you get this! Thanks.

ric@ricrojasrunning.com

8 years ago 08/15/2015 3:02pm EDT

re: KemBOII

Do you have a legitimate chance to make a living by running? If not, go to the better academic school. Trust me, in 5 years when you're a hobby jogger, no one will care how fast you ran in college. No one.

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