Is it immoral to kiss someone who is in a relationship?

Levon Helm wrote:

I have a good friend who has a boyfriend (who is currently on the other side of the world). I like her and she likes me. For a while I thought I was in the friend zone, but recent events make it clear that that is not the case. Am I obliged to wait until she breaks up with him to make a move? I don't want to make her feel guilty, and also if she cheats on him with me, then a precedent is set and there's a higher chance she'll cheat on me with someone else in the future (This isn't the sort of thing that will just be a casual fling if it happens).

Are my moral standards too high?

Thoughts?

(early 20s btw, if it makes a difference)

It's always immoral to cheat. Do not be a part of it. No, your moral standards aren't too high. In fact, just the fact that you had to ask this question shows me that, in my opinion, your moral standards are far too low.

Tell her to break up with him and be patient, for crying out loud. How would you feel?

I swear. Shit like this is why I'm a partial misanthropist.

Dick Doobey wrote:

My 4 year old son is familiar with 'The Golden Rule'. If you wouldn't mind having some guy kiss your girlfriend, go for it.

Aspire to be the kind of man who can forego a little pleasure for the sake of being honorable.

This is the correct answer. If your conscience is bothering you, you know it is inappropriate on some level. I was in your shoes once, and I didn't take the honorable and moral path. Totally regret it...

What I'm wondering is why you're asking about kissing. You said that you're in your early twenties, not junior high. If you're going to become involved with this girl, try for at least second base.

What I'm wondering is why you're asking about kissing. You said that you're in your early twenties, not junior high. If you're going to become involved with this girl, try for at least second base.

Dick Doobey wrote:

My 4 year old son is familiar with 'The Golden Rule'. If you wouldn't mind having some guy kiss your girlfriend, go for it.

Aspire to be the kind of man who can forego a little pleasure for the sake of being honorable.

This is probably the wisest thing I've read in a while.

Davey Gravy wrote:

What I'm wondering is why you're asking about kissing. You said that you're in your early twenties, not junior high. If you're going to become involved with this girl, try for at least second base.

This is probably the wisest thing I've read in a while.

DragMeister wrote:

Dick Doobey wrote:

My 4 year old son is familiar with 'The Golden Rule'. If you wouldn't mind having some guy kiss your girlfriend, go for it.

Aspire to be the kind of man who can forego a little pleasure for the sake of being honorable.

This is probably the wisest thing I've read in a while.

This is probably the dumbest thing I've read in a while.

Earth to nimrod - girls/women are not property. They are human beings who can make up their own minds about how they want to act. As has been pointed out by others, the two people in the relationship are the ONLY people who are in a position to judge their behavior with respect to said relationship.

The Man & The Legend wrote:

This is probably the dumbest thing I've read in a while.

Earth to nimrod - girls/women are not property. They are human beings who can make up their own minds about how they want to act. As has been pointed out by others, the two people in the relationship are the ONLY people who are in a position to judge their behavior with respect to said relationship.

While I agree with you, I don't understand why you are so vehemently opposed to Dick Doobey's Golden Rule example. Yes, two people in a relationship make the rules for that relationship. That doesn't mean that if you're not in that relationship that you can't, you know, think about the consequences of your actions and act according to how you'd like to be treated if roles were reversed. I just take that for common decency.

In answer to the original question, I would call it inconsiderate, not immoral. If you want something long term with the woman in question, then the best way to find out if she's really serious about you is to see if she will end her relationship. If she cheats, well, she has proof that you'll be available to her even if she remains in her current relationship. I'd say that puts you at a disadvantage if you are really looking for anything more than casual with her.

The way that I see these situations, her relationship is already over, but for whatever reason, she has no taken the step to end the relationship with that guy. As an adult male, many of the women that you connect with will be in relationships. That does not mean they are off limits.

You need to put the seed in her head. The seed probably already is there, it just needs to germinate. Usually, I get them alone and comfortable, get them talking about their feelings about their relationship. I get them to question why they are still in the relationship when they are having such doubts about it.

During all this, I explicitly or implicitly let them know that I am interested in being more than friends. I might make a move to kiss them if the mood is right. But I never want to sneak around for an extended period of time and deceive the boyfriend. I tell them that I do not feel comfortable sneaking around and ask them to break it off if they would like to further. That might be immoral or inconsiderate in the eyes of others, but it works.

If I was the boyfriend in this situation, how would I feel about it? I'd be pissed, but I understand that some relationships were not strong enough to make it around the world. If she did the same to him, would she do the same to me someday? Possibly. But i would attempt to establish open lines of communication in which we could discuss such things.

Some people are polyamorous even in marriage. It works for some.

You also need to understand that this girl wants to be around you. She is intrigued by you. You need to have confidence in your own attractiveness and value. That will pique your interest in you more than anything. A lot of young men do not understand all they have to offer to other young women.

Drag Meister and Dick Doobey are the same person?

How original

Thanks viva for your insight. She knows I'm interested at this stage. With regards what I have to offer, I probably beat the current boyfriend in terms of intelligence and social status (I'm aware that sounds very conceited) but he is objectively better looking than me. But girls don't seem to place that much emphasis on physical appearance which I suppose is a good thing.

I'll nudge her towards breaking it off with him, but I probably won't demand it outright because it's not my place to do so.

Levon Helm wrote:

Thanks viva for your insight. She knows I'm interested at this stage. With regards what I have to offer, I probably beat the current boyfriend in terms of intelligence and social status (I'm aware that sounds very conceited) but he is objectively better looking than me. But girls don't seem to place that much emphasis on physical appearance which I suppose is a good thing.

I'll nudge her towards breaking it off with him, but I probably won't demand it outright because it's not my place to do so.

Ahh, the picture becomes a bit clearer. Bottom line, you are here, he is not. You are showing interest in her, he is not in a position to, at least to her satisfaction. You will be here for her while he is gone, but when Better Looking Johnny returns, you will be pushed aside. All of her feelings for him will come rushing back at first sight. Take the advice of those pushing for restraint and you'll have your answer as to how serious she is about you.

Here Boy wrote:

Most of us were probably in similar situations at some time. I was in a serious relationship when another girl began to flirt with me. Eventually it came to a point where I needed to decide to break up or two-time. I decided on the break-up route and, in hind sight, am glad I did. When I actually tried to break up, it caused an incredible emotional experience that forced me to realize I couldn't follow through with it - and I no longer wanted to date the new girl. Despite temptations, I kept the other girl in the friend zone and eventually married my girl friend. Nice to live with a clear conscience.

Thus, my advice is to tell her she must break up with her boyfriend before starting up with you. If she can't do it, don't date her.

Dumb conclusion. That is not what you did.

well..... wrote:

"Boyfriend" is an extremely vague term. What's the level of commitment they've made to one another? If they haven't actually made a commitment to have an exclusive relationship, then it's not immoral at all. Assumptions don't count for anything.

Don't confuse the "Boyfriend/Girlfriend" relationship with Engagement or Marriage, where the two parties make a promise that they should intend to keep. If you try to make a move on a married or engaged women, you're behaving immorally

I agree with this.

Except for the morality part.

No ring, no foul.

Every relationship before marriage ends for one reason or another. Sometimes it's because a better fit comes along. If you were in a relationship and you met your soul mate what would you do? In fact if you don't make a move her true feelings for this guy won't be tested and ultimately make her relationship stronger ( if she goes that route). If she does cheat with you, it was never meant to be, and at least the boyfriend learns of her lack of commitment to him before he does something he'll regret i.e marry her. I'd say you owe it to both of you, her and him to make a move. If you don't the results could be disastrous.

DragMeister wrote:

Dick Doobey wrote:

My 4 year old son is familiar with 'The Golden Rule'. If you wouldn't mind having some guy kiss your girlfriend, go for it.

Aspire to be the kind of man who can forego a little pleasure for the sake of being honorable.

This is probably the wisest thing I've read in a while.

This.

And if the girl is willing to cheat on her current BF, what would stop her from doing the same to you?

Keep it honest, man.