Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin", or "
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This is a general message. Had surgery last week-Wed.- and walking the 1 mile per day. This is my second bout- Surgery with Dr.Meyers in 2006. Knew their was something wrong shortly after. Had some trauma to the area--sudden abduction with the left side- about 5 weeks after surgery. Irritated the healing process, altered tissue healing/repair? Whatever... If you are are healing, go slow and avoid all sudden movements. Be very deliberate about how you move even after you start to feel more confident. You should all heal well if you follow the protocol and avoid sudden movements. I slowly got stronger over the past three years, but never was comfortable with the trauma shortly after surgery. Felt that after three years I should have been able to move freely if all was OK, and I couldn't. Thus the repeat procedure. I am hoping for the best. Hopefully you have support and thsoe people help you for the time being. Thought I read that someone was working the adductor tissue 10xs per day. Is that correct? Anyone else woking this tissue as frequently
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Hey guys maybe some more help here on healing and what not, try taking l lysine with ur vitamin b complex, L lysine is amino acid that helps rebuild tissue, they give it to burn victims and people with serious tissue issues, vitamin b helps with the absorbtion of lysine.
Also a question, when u guys talk of adductor pain u mean like pain when u push away from your body with ur leg right? Like stepping laterally right? Like a hockey player skates? That kind of pushing off?Pain in ur inner thigh? Like a pulled groin would feel? -
I thought about the b-complex. sounds like a good idea. Lysiene perhaps. don't know too much about it. Is it an Amino Acid? Taking solgar multi and fish oil as well. Adductor irritation for me has always been in the pushing off phase. i guess it is really abduction of the right leg-hip out to the side. Yes, like a hockey skating stride. the pain, sticking, impingement is in the adductor in this case.
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I thought about the b-complex. sounds like a good idea. Lysiene perhaps. don't know too much about it. Is it an Amino Acid? Taking solgar multi and fish oil as well. Adductor irritation for me has always been in the pushing off phase. i guess it is really abduction of the right leg-hip out to the side. Yes, like a hockey skating stride. the pain, sticking, impingement is in the adductor in this case.
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The reason that I've started taking Vitamin B6 is probably the same reason Frengers takes it: Because Dr. Muschaweck recommends it to both those trying to heal without surgery, and also to those who have already had surgery.
http://www.leistenbruch.de/fileadmin/docs/UEFA_engl.pdf
The theory is that the body repairs torn tendons by laying down collagen at the site of the tear, and sometimes this is not being done properly because of insufficient vitamin B6.
If one reads all the posts in this LetsRun thread, one will notice that Dr. Muschaweck almost always recommends the athlete to try to rehab without surgery unless the pain is just too much for practical daily living. Only then does she recommend surgery. -
Im a Supplement nut....best for healing is any high quality Amino Acid Complex on an empty stomach 1 hour before food or 2 hours after.....also grab a seperate bottle of BCAA's...these are amino acids your body can not make...same deal take them on an empty stomach.....Best time to take them is pre workout, post workout and before bedtime
Also:
Protein Powder
L-Glutamine Powder
All this is as close to taking injectable HGH as you can get and will set your body up for the best healing and tissue building possible
Happy Healing -
So, for those who are convinced there is one, and only one school of thought on sports hernia treatment (surgery), let it be known there is another school of thought -- healing sports hernia without surgery.
Successful sports hernia recovery without surgery - Examples
Post by SND
http://g.imagehost.org/0971/SND_Post_84.gif
Post by RunDoctor
http://g.imagehost.org/0422/RunDoctor_59.gif
Post at GoalieStore
http://g.imagehost.org/0591/GoalieStore_01.gif
Posts/email by Tennis player
http://g.imagehost.org/0481/TennisPlayerSuccess.gif -
And this school of thought(healing without surgery) is clearly endorsed by Dr. Muschaweck, not only in the stories posted by her patients in this LetsRun thread, but also here:
http://www.leistenbruch.de/fileadmin/docs/UEFA_engl.pdf
This school of thought (healing sports hernia without surgery) is also endorsed by Dr. Hoadley, as can be seen explicitly at his website:
http://www.sportsherniasouth.com/Sports-Hernia-Surgery.html -
Good tips by both you and JC. I will get the B-complex. i have some quality protein powder. Thanks, and to you as well...
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Surf...all bad examples if you read what they wrote
SND: still feels SH, not sure if he even ever had SH
RUN DOC: never diagnosed
GOALIE STORE: Groin Pull...admits not SH
TENNIS PLAYER: never said who diagnosed her...may be your only case
AGAIN....BAD INFORMATION AND EXAMPLES ON YOUR PART ..........PLUS YOU HAVENT EVEN BEEN TO A DOCTOR YET OT GET A CORRECT DIAGNOSIS...YOU DONT EVEN KNOW WHAT YOU HAVE...PLUS YOUR NEW THING NOW GUESSING YOU HAVE A LABREL TEAR OF COURSE WITHOUT A DIAGNOSIS
I think your just looking for people to tell you what you want to hear OK FINE HERE YA GO........You can absolutely heal your torn and scarred up tendons that are possibly pressing or entrapping a nerve or have possibly become partially or fully detached from the bone....Yes they can magically reattach themselves...and you can also heal your muscles if they have happened to become calcified together with your well thought out Surfboard rehab protocol....IS this what your looking for????
Until see a Doctor and get a definitive Diagnosis you should not be on here misleading people with unfound personal theroies -
Turkdog, I've probably explained my symptoms a few times on previous pages but I don't know the numbers, and don't mind recounting quickly for you here:
I first presented with right-side RA pain the morning after hockey games in April 2007. Started in a small area a few inches above the pubic bone. I kept playing through it and eventually the pain and tightness radiated down to the pubic bone, across the groin, adductors and down into the inner-lower thigh and even my knee. At my worst, I was limping around for a few days. Then I decided to shut it down and see a sports medicine doctor, who prescribed an RA strain/possible sports hernia and sent me to physical therapy.
After 2 rounds (6 months) of PT I felt almost 100% better but when I tried to skate the same pain came right back. Saw Meyers in September. MRI showed bilateral tears and hip labrum tears, even though I had no symptoms on left side or in hips (though left side and hips did begin to give me pain in recent months).
Even then I wanted to do all I could to avoid surgery, so I tried more rest followed by a gradual return to physical activity. Started with elliptical, treadmill, light cycling, then light ab/core work and eventually skating. I had a bit of pain here and there but it was going back to skating that brought the old pain back the same way it was at the beginning. At that point, in April 2009, two years after it all started, I made my appointment for surgery. I think if you're torn badly enough all the PT in the world won't fix you.
Regarding the anesthesia, I ate a huge steak at about 5:30 pm, then an apple at about 9:30 and a glass of water before bed at 10 pm. No nausea at all, though I normally have a pretty strong stomach. -
Tiff, glad to hear you are doing well now. I think I saw you and your husband while I was in the procedural admission area, sitting in that big red chair answering questions. You were already on a gurney about to go into pre-op. At least I think that was you. I think my family talked with your husband in the waiting room and got his business card for me because he has information that might help me appeal my insurance company's denial of coverage.
I agree about the standing/sitting point, BTW. Laying prone on your back is the most comfortable position. And Meyers also called me the day after to check on me. I'm seeing him Tuesday for follow-up.
I feel like today was a pretty big leap forward for me. Getting around a lot better, with less pain. Good luck to you as you continue your rehab! -
Tiff-
Big congrats!! Your incision is like mine (5.5") I think he had to go high to get mine too. i am very glad for you that you caught this before you unravled. You will be healed before me. I am doing well but still have a ways to go in terms of conditioning.
I am very pleased for you and Hockey Player. I have to try the Arnica too. i am still on Indocin for inflammation. Inflammation seems to be my biggest enemy at the moment. I never do anything in moderation so I am pushing the enevelope and am happy to see my core is getting stronger by the week.
I can not emphasize enough....If you have it...get it taken care of sooner than later. -
The reason why your adductors relax in the water is they are not being asked to do anything.
What are the adductors? The adductors are stabilizing muscles.
What happens in AP? The RA tears and this forces the adductors to become primary mover which they are not intended to do. All the stretching in the world will only loosen them temporarily until the RA is repaired. Combine this with the pelvis tilting anteriorly which in turn forces the hip flexors to go into overdrive and many times will completely shut down your largest primary movers (the glutes...called gluteal amnesia)
This is why your adductors do not stand a chance with long term AP.
You can not spend your life in water. It is funny you disappear and now reappear to peddle the same hocus pocus horseshit you were peddling before. It was not enough that Johnny thought you were out to lunch or that you scared Tiff about her surgery. (which was my intitial fear).
You are simply trying to recruit more people into your realm of unscientific thinking when now you are even diagnosing labral tears on yourself when in fact you do not even have a diagnosis of AP or SH.
Anyways...this is my response to your idea that everyone (but you) is wrong on adductors. All the years of kineseology....med school.....PT school.....I suppose they are being taught the wrong thing.
I am sure if every person were asked to trust Meyers or you.....Meyers..hands down...
If you are truly interested in healing your undiagnosed SH get a FMS for $50-70 and they will tell you where you are deficient. Each failure per movement tells them which injury you are susceptible to due to weakness or asymmetry. They then cater a program to correct this. This is the same program endorsed by Mike Boyle which is a link you posted at one time. This has been valuable for me and my rehab.
If you are serious at trying to rehab properly instead of your hocus pocus yellow submarine (surfboard) protocol then do it and report bacK. it is $50 well spent...
My money is that you ignore this post because I am not a newbie who is blowing smoke up your ass.
JMHO -
most epic thread ever... Its cool surf, dont trip, if ive been suffering from this groin thing for months now, its quiet possible there is SH rocking ur world. I feel ur pain. I think the hip problems and back aches come because you stop useing ur stomache to support u while walking. U relax ur stomache to not cause pain, this puts all the weight on ur back and this puts all the weight into ur hips pushing them forward, straining the flexors and such.. But of course as many of u are getting short about this, I'm no doctor. But with so much troubles with doctors and this condition, why are u guys so quick to defend them?? And some of u are so quick to say Go See A Doctor to get diagnosed properly. While others have seen 10 plus doctors whom have all MIS diagnosed!
Yes I know, now u can go see meyers or UM to be sure, but that's difficult for some of to accomplish.
I'm just so thankful we have other options, especially other than cattey. Of brown meyers cattey and UM I would through reading rate them best UM, then Meyers, than Brown, and by defalt cattey as last place. Some would disagree but I think cattey just wants to make money off this while meyers and Muschaweck generally seem like they want to help people.
However this surgery isn't exactly a set procedure, and it sounds like meyers kind of approaches it that way. I love the fact that UM taylors a surgery for every patient, but there prolly could be some down side to this.
But yes surf please keep throwing out ur ideas. The broader pool of input we have on this the better, that's what this thread is about. Like saying stuff about lysine, someone can disagree if they want, but everyone is atleast able to consider. -
I agree that all opinions are valid in the healing process, but this injury, although complicated is gettting more and more attention. In fact there are rehab protocols to follow that are specifically designed for this.
It is highly unusual to rate physicians you have never seen before. UM is more of a hernia specialist. However, when the RA is torn and it is AP Meyers is your man as could well be Brown. I do not know Cattey so I can not really comment on him.
I agree it is hard to get to see a doctor. I went to many before finding Meyers. However, if you are on this site you know your options. It is difficult to get to Philly bit Southwest runs some cheap flights and you can be out of there cheap in 2-3 days.
If i had know about Meyers I would have walked there instead of going 5 years with this mess and allowing it to wreak havoc on my body.
Here it is in a nutshell. To complicate it anymore is ridicu
lous.
1) get a firm diagnosis
2) get your options
3) if it is possible to heal it through therapy do so with the help of a FMS and proper therapist...(instead of just guessing what muscles do...these guys actually know)
4) If therapy does not work get surgery
5) post surgery follow protocol and be diligent/patient -
Nobody disagrees with this...
Show us the site that says rehab without a diagnosis -
The biggest problem with this injury is when it becomes longterm... all of your surrounding muscle groups begin to start working overtime. Which means that your adductors, hamstrings, and hip flexors cannot be synergetic. One of those areas will always be tight. And if you do have a RA tear or otherwise, you have a constant pulling.
Can you heal without surgery? If you don't have a tear, I'm sure it is possible. But for people who have longterm issues, I don't think it is likely. I also think that many people will not heal without manual therapy... Mike Boyle states something similar in one of his articles. Many of us have soft tissue problems in the groin and surrounding muscles groups preventing full function. I have learned this through A.R.T. treatment. The website is posted below.
http://www.activerelease.com/
Surf,
If you want to get better, you need a plan. If you don't have a rehab protocol, your improvement will be minimal at best. With A.R.T., I have discovered weaknesses that I didn't even know existed. Additionally, I have learned a lot of exercises that I wouldn't have otherwise known. These guys are professionals. Since my surgery, I am a lot better. I can't run yet, but I think it will come once I strengthen all the necessary areas. -
JCSportsman - Yes, I was concerned about the other side. Not only was my groin area really tight on that side, but I had developed a lump that I feared was an inguinal hernia. Nothing showed up on the MRI though. I asked Meyers about this and he said to wait and see how it feels after the surgery b/c it is most likely compensatory pain. So far - I have not noticed that side at all. So that is great! Tiff
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Hi Hockey player - yup that was me on the gurney. I am going to be there on tuesday also so hopefully we will meet then. Take care - tiff
