First Marathon - Sub 3:00?

Yes, you could do it if you don't go out to fast. But good luck with that, especially your first one.

3 hours will be no problem.

Run 5x5000 @ MP - 10 seconds (2:55 goal MP for you). The recovery should be 1k at MP + 10 seconds. The total workout is 30k. If you can run this workout then you should be able to hit 2:55. Don't run the 5ks faster than -10. This is a staple workout of Canova marathon athletes. I would substitute this for your long run.

This is specific marathon training. There is no better predictor of potential marathon time then getting comfortable at MP. The -10/+10 will teach your body to use lactate as a fuel source hence extending your fuel supply in the marathon.

3 hours? That will not be a problem for you. If this weren't your first one, I would say that you are probably ready for sub-2:50. Shooting for 2:55 is smart and safe. Go through halfway at 1:27:xx and maintain that pace (6:40/mile) until 23 miles EVEN IF IT IS EASY. As you have heard thousands of times: the first 10+ miles should feel ridiculously easy. You want to be thinking "I should really pick it up" the entire time. Do not do it though. Many people suggest picking it up with 10k to go, but I would wait until 5k if I were you. No use risking it. Good luck and please update.

Thanks guys. Ok, yeah I think I'll aim to go out at 6:40s pace and just try to hold that. mdsj1970, that workout sounds pretty interesting and tough. That's basically 18 mi more or less at marathon pace. I feel like I could do it, but I would worry it would disrupt other workouts, no? I guess if it's a Canova workout, maybe I shouldn't question it, but I always thought I wouldn't go over 12 miles at marathon pace in a given run, especially since my mileage isn't super high.

mdsj1970 wrote:

3 hours will be no problem.

Run 5x5000 @ MP - 10 seconds (2:55 goal MP for you). The recovery should be 1k at MP + 10 seconds. The total workout is 30k. If you can run this workout then you should be able to hit 2:55. Don't run the 5ks faster than -10. This is a staple workout of Canova marathon athletes. I would substitute this for your long run.

This is specific marathon training. There is no better predictor of potential marathon time then getting comfortable at MP. The -10/+10 will teach your body to use lactate as a fuel source hence extending your fuel supply in the marathon.

I like the sound of this, as a workout and a predictor, although the Canova +/-10 workout could be shorted to 4x4000 or 5x4000 for a 3:00 guy on 60mpw. Still epic.

For goddness's sake, Canova's guys are doing those 5Ks in ~14:30!

Just did my last 20 miler. Did the first 10 very comfortably at average of 7:07 pace and last 10 at average of 6:21 pace (last two miles were 6:07 and 5:49). The last mile was hard, but I had more in me if I slowed it down, which surprised me. I didn't really feel like I was pushing it until mile 18.

I'm now confused. I wasn't even going to consider sub 2:50 since it's my first, but I'm starting to think it's possible. Any thoughts? Should I forget about 2:50, just try to keep it under 3:00 on the first one and then go for 2:50 down the road, or just say F it and go for it now?

Go for 2:50 this time, in my opinion.

go for 2:50. even if you bonk, you would probably still sub 3:00.

You're fit and healthy. That might not ever happen again. Lock on to 2:50 and go for it, all the indicators are that you're ready.

Go for sub 2:50. I'm hoping to break 3 next week and you are in MUCH better shape than me and I'm pretty confident that I've got a good shot to break 3 still. Best of luck!

Reg

mdsj1970 wrote:

Run 5x5000 @ MP - 10 seconds (2:55 goal MP for you). The recovery should be 1k at MP + 10 seconds. The total workout is 30k. If you can run this workout then you should be able to hit 2:55. Don't run the 5ks faster than -10. This is a staple workout of Canova marathon athletes. I would substitute this for your long run.

Ridiculous. Don't try that.

You'll spend about 50% more time running hard than a 2:03 runner. Only a moron would advise you that.

Run workouts adapted to your level. 4x5000@MP, 2x10000@mp, hm at MP, 20k easy+10k@MP are all standard workouts for a 3h marathoner.

comfortably hard wrote:

Just did my last 20 miler. Did the first 10 very comfortably at average of 7:07 pace and last 10 at average of 6:21 pace (last two miles were 6:07 and 5:49). The last mile was hard, but I had more in me if I slowed it down, which surprised me. I didn't really feel like I was pushing it until mile 18.

I'm now confused. I wasn't even going to consider sub 2:50 since it's my first, but I'm starting to think it's possible. Any thoughts? Should I forget about 2:50, just try to keep it under 3:00 on the first one and then go for 2:50 down the road, or just say F it and go for it now?

I would try for 2:50. The last ten miles of your workout even as a standalone would be faster than all out race pace for a 3:00 flat marathoner.

Thanks everyone. Appreciate the input. I think I'll go for it assuming taper goes well and decent race day conditions. And yeah, hopefully if it doesn't work, i'll still be able to come home under 3. Reg, good luck next week!

mdsj1970 wrote:

Run 5x5000 @ MP - 10 seconds (2:55 goal MP for you). The recovery should be 1k at MP + 10 seconds. The total workout is 30k. This is a staple workout of Canova marathon athletes.

don't listen to 'net parrots wrote:

Ridiculous. Don't try that.

You'll spend about 50% more time running hard than a 2:03 runner. Only a moron would advise you that.

Run workouts adapted to your level. 4x5000@MP, 2x10000@mp, hm at MP, 20k easy+10k@MP are all standard workouts for a 3h marathoner.

EXACTLY. This is what I was getting at.^^^ Same distance means 1.5x as much time at a given effort for a 3h vs 2h marathoner! Thanks for some more suggested workouts.

Just to follow up - Went for it and got it. 2:48. Started with 6:30 pace, picked it up a little at the half and then again at 20. Splits were 1:25/1:23. Amazing race and first marathon experience. Can't walk today but worth it. Thanks everyone for the advice. Obviously very happy I went for it.

congrats man

Congrats! I ran an almost exact last 20 miler when I ran 248.

comfortably hard wrote:

Just to follow up - Went for it and got it. 2:48. Started with 6:30 pace, picked it up a little at the half and then again at 20. Splits were 1:25/1:23. Amazing race and first marathon experience. Can't walk today but worth it. Thanks everyone for the advice. Obviously very happy I went for it.

Awesome! Thanks for updating.

I didn't see this thread originally but reading through I would have said to go for 2:50.

Congrats. It looks like you nailed the marathon on your very first attempt. That is tough to do.