13:21.87 ROFL.
13:21.87 ROFL.
You can beat a time by however many seconds. You can't beat a time my a unit of distance
Yes, so what?
40 year later, that should be expected.
Pre also had about 1/10th of the training knowledge that is around today.
When Pre was in college, you wrote your class papers on a manual typewriter. --No students could afford electrics.
There were no computer labs for general students. A lot of school's didn't even have computer labs. Training knowledge and schedules using computer analyzed data...pretty much nil.
You had a bunch of coaches throwing spit against the wall in training programs, approaches and philosophies to see what got results.
The environments are completely different.
If Pre was just getting started today, and had top support and resources...he'd probably be right up there.
You're dumb.
Making a statement like that is like comparing gas prices. People are paying $3.55 a gallon today. ROFL, it was .69 back in 1974.
We dont take training knowledge, electric typewriters, and other things into consideration when determining winners and losers. Otherwise, my buddy would be the reigning Olympic 5k champ since he ran his 15:45 5k wearing sneakers from walmart, didnt train that season, doesn't have a coach, and does his math homework without a calculator. It was also drizzling earlier that day.
Was Pre very talented and successful? Yes, absolutely! Moreso than Rupp? We will never know. Was he a faster runner than Rupp currently is? By all accounts, no. Talking up Pre and what he could have done with the right resources, less beer, more funding, a typewriter (?) etc etc is a bit paradoxical. Wasn't he sort of all about doing his best and winning as opposed to making excuses? I certainly didn't know him, but what would Pre's reaction be upon hearing that an Oregon-born Oregon-raised 5k/10k runner had run 12:58 and 26:48? I doubt he would make the "coulda shoulda woulda" excuses that many people make concerning how much better the runners of the past really are.
That's my $0.02
Guys,
"Let me handle this [the OP]" (doing the hand gesture that one of the Bobs made to the other Bob in Office Space)...
Pre ran a race with the air so think you couldn't see 300m away. Rupp missed a race because the pollen count was too high that day.
http://www.tracktownusa.com/track.item.25/steve-prefontaine-crusade-against-field-burning.html
40 years ago the sport was primarily Euros (including Australian/NZ) + U.S., despite the African warning shot fired in Mexico City. Pre ran five seconds off the WR which was held by a white guy (Clarke). Rupp just ran about four seconds off the white guy record (controlling for the African factor). So yeah, Rupp is better amongst the same U.S./Euro sample, and he'll likely be the fastest white guy in London, unlike Pre.
Pre had undeniable charisma that Rupp will never have, just like Emma Coburn is way cuter than the women who beat her. Enjoy it all for the entertainment that it is.
PRE beenforgotten wrote: 13:21.87 ROFL.
Bekele: 12:37.35
Rupp:.. 12:58.90
Pre:... 13:21.87
Rupp.. 22.97 Faster than Pre
Bekele 21.55 Faster than Rupp
I can hardly type this message i'm too busy rolling on the floor laughing
: |
yagtash wrote:
Was he a faster runner than Rupp currently is? By all accounts, no.
I'll clarify this. Pre was a little better on the world stage at his prime than Rupp currently is (although that could certainly change in the future). However, had you lined up an in-shape and peaked Prefontaine is his prime against Rupp today at any distance on a 2012 track with 2012 spikes, it seems Rupp would win most of the time and in almost any type of race (fast, slow, uneven, etc).
And if it weren't for Pre Rupp would be an intern at law office somewhere who runs 1430 at the weekend 5k race because there would be no professional running and therefore no full time training with every possible training device at his disposal.
Haywood field wrote:
Guys,
"Let me handle this [the OP]" (doing the hand gesture that one of the Bobs made to the other Bob in Office Space)...
Pre ran a race with the air so think you couldn't see 300m away. Rupp missed a race because the pollen count was too high that day.
http://www.tracktownusa.com/track.item.25/steve-prefontaine-crusade-against-field-burning.html
Yes, and Pre also didn't have the smart counsel that Rupp receives today.
The world was different in a thousand ways.
Pre and Rono both drank too much, and both suffered for it.
Today, Lananna would have thrown Pre off the team for his behavior.
Rupp has had asthma all his life, he has tested positive to just about every single allergen on the skin test.
Without the great medical support he has...you would not have seen your first non African under 26:50 in the 10,000m
This is a way of saying, you cannot compare era's or athletes.
Pre and Rono both drank too much, and both suffered for it.
Read more:
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=4607390#ixzz1wgyeYzvD
Let's not get hasty with the drink accusations.
yagtash wrote:
We dont take training knowledge, electric typewriters, and other things into consideration when determining winners and losers. Otherwise, my buddy would be the reigning Olympic 5k champ since he ran his 15:45 5k wearing sneakers from walmart, didnt train that season, doesn't have a coach, and does his math homework without a calculator. It was also drizzling earlier that day.
Was Pre very talented and successful? Yes, absolutely! Moreso than Rupp? We will never know. Was he a faster runner than Rupp currently is? By all accounts, no. Talking up Pre and what he could have done with the right resources, less beer, more funding, a typewriter (?) etc etc is a bit paradoxical. Wasn't he sort of all about doing his best and winning as opposed to making excuses? I certainly didn't know him, but what would Pre's reaction be upon hearing that an Oregon-born Oregon-raised 5k/10k runner had run 12:58 and 26:48? I doubt he would make the "coulda shoulda woulda" excuses that many people make concerning how much better the runners of the past really are.
That's my $0.02
I was painting a picture of two different worlds, clearly you can see that times are different in every way.
If Pre were alive today, he'd be Salazar's boss. And he'd be 100% in support of The Oregon Project, and 100% proud of Rupp.
And he probably would arrange to have the Brojo's thrown in the lake at Nike Campus. Just a little hazing and a "get your sh*t together boys."
pre was unlucky with that 13'21 when wr was emiel's 13'13.0in '74 he went 7'42.6/27'43.6 & 13'21.877'42.6 / 27'43.6 ->13'16.8however, that 27'43 was solo & windy day at eugene ( according to descriptions )with no wind & some pacing to 5k, i think ~ 27'30 ( which wouda given him shot at bedford's 27'30.8wr )also he went 3'38/3'54 in '74http://www.goducks.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=500&ATCLID=30594&SPID=243&SPSID=4584
1,500 meters 3:38.1 6/28/73, Helsinki
Mile 3:54.6 6/20/73, Eugene
2,000 meters 5:01.4 5/9/75, Coos Bay
3,000 meters 7:42.6 7/2/74, Milan
5,000 meters 13:21.87 6/26/74, Helsinki
10,000 meters 27:43.6 4/27/74, Eugene
i actually think better line of fit for him in '74 was something like
52.0 / 1'50.0 -> 3'36.5 , 3'53.5 , 7'35.5 , 13'06.7 , 27'28.3
that 13'21.8pb of his was a joke
he probably was in shape in '74 to demolish the wr if he'd got "perfect" race
Rupp is also faster than Zatopek by about 300m, and would have lapped him in the 10,000 at least once. Last I checked Zatopek had more Oly medals than Rupp.
When comparing athletes of different era's you need to forget about times and compare how good the person was in relation to the competition at the time.
The WR at the time was 13:13.0 (72) at the time of Pre running 13:21.87. Today the WR sits at 12:37.35, Rupp putting up a 12:45.83 to stay relevant with the current standard is a clear understanding.
PRE beenforgotten wrote:
13:21.87 ROFL.
The Olympic Trials 5000m record is held by whom?
Rupp? not certified
Lagat? nope..
Solinsky? fat chance..
Kennedy? not...
Ritz? ... ditz
Tegenkamp? ... nada
Spivey? ...nay
Whose Olympic Trials record has stood for 40 years? I wonder?
Rupp may have run a faster time, but that doesn't mean he is a better runner. Pre is still (in my opinion) probably one of the greatest American distance runners, ever.