Struggling with a college descision

Call the coaches. It's different everywhere.

Don't pick a school because of running, if it is significantly inferior in terms of academics. If the distinction is slight, then it's not a big deal. If you're talking about big differences in academic reputation, then I'd sacrifice running in the NCAA.

same boat....slightly faster, but all the top notch schools wouldn't want me to run for them

go for a running club, most of them are great, and you can still be as intense as you want and run with other people and not worry about fitting a coach's mentality

in the long run the school is more important than running is, because it's likely that you won't be pro but will be in the workforce, a degree from W+M is very impressive compared to one from nubtown community college....and you can still run in road races and such, which are often just as fun and intense as team running

If you're a guy and running 18:30 as a Junior, none of those schools will let you walk-on. Now if you happen to improve immensely as a Senior and end up running something in the 16:30, 9:45, 4:30 range, you might have a shot. It's doubtful that you'll run those times though. What are your other PR's? Track? Just saying that you'll work your ass off doesn't mean anything if you do that and only improve to 17:30; you still won't be helping the team. It's just the simple truth. Sorry.

Why do you list those as your favorite colleges? I know plenty of people who had a terrible time at all those schools.

WOW, I have looked at all 4 of those schools as well haha am also a junior. I am in the same type of dilemma. Do I go D1 (better running) or D3 (better academics)? Except my PB's are a little different...

16:40 5k

4:10 1500

9:10 3k

6:25 2k Steeple

Anyone have any advice for someone of my calibre?

I would not dream of turning down superior academic schools just to have a shot at participating in NCAA competition. From what you've said, it's hard to believe that it should be a close question. Besides, how are you so sure that you wouldn't be able to participate in NCAA competition at any of the schools that you mentioned? At least in cross country, a number of schools will let you participate in junior varsity races no matter how bad you are.

Both of you need to understand that running shouldn't be a BIG factor in picking the right school.

Jabroni, you'd be able to walk onto Richmond and Davidson even if you only improve slighty on those PRs.

To the OP, you'd be able to run at Richmond, I'm pretty sure it's non-scholarship though they have a great coach and some tough runners. Davidson might be tougher.

WM usually allows a good number of guys to train during XC but you might have to run some kind of time in preseason just to make that cut. They have a good club, too.

UVA is tough, not sure if they have a club team or not.

All four schools are very tough academically. Running might seem like a good idea to you now, but when the work starts to pile up...

Don't turn down superior academic schools to go somewhere you can run. However, there are some good academic schools where you could probably walk on. Vanderbilt might be a good school for you to look into. They are a non-scholarship program so everyone is a walk on. You'll still be at the back of the pack but they'll let you walk on. This is just one example of a school that I am personally familiar with, I am sure there are few others out there.

I would not for one second consider turning down a clearly superior academic institution just for the sake of your running career. Your degree will stay with you for the rest of your life. You'll likely be done with competative running by 25. If I had the opportunity to attend UVa or William and Mary I would take it (I am not familiar with the other two). Both school will open up a lot of doors for you if you utilizes the resources they offer properly.

Check out the club teams at these schools or the running clubs in the surrounding areas and see if they look like they'll fit your needs. I ran for a club team in college and it was a good experience. For me, it allowed the freedom to schedule track around school, rather than the other way around. It also gave me the chance to have a say in what races I ran and pick meets that were at my level instead of running for my school team (a DI team in a competitive conference) and never having a shot at winning anything.

You could walk on most anywhere. Probably at all the schools you mentioned but UVA.

Call the coaches. Don't sacrifice your academics for running.

Good luck!

I understand your dilemma I went through it too. Here's my two cents based on my personal experience.

1. You don't have to stop running just because you don't think you can't make a college team. You can still enjoy your running and road races are always there as well too.

2. What you ran in high school plays a minimal role in your success in college. Now success doesn't mean winning race but success in the terms of personal success, i.e. running PR's or improving beyond what you thought. Throughout my 5-years in college (yes 5-years haha) I knew at least one guy (sometimes more) every year who was so-so in high school at best but because they loved running they kept at it. There was a total of 9 guys like this and out of those 5 of them ran times you never would've thought looking at what they ran in high school. The other 4 maybe not improved as much but they were happy anyways because they got to experience the college aspect of running and we had a strong team bond which helped a lot. One of the success stories was a 19:02 5k guy in H.S. who ran 14:57 by his senior year in college. There's a lot of factor, a lot of these guys were just passionate and off that alone fueled their improvements, others were simply late bloomers and others were just well under-trained in high school.

In my opinion see it through because when your 4-years is up you don't want to look back wondering what it would've or could've been like.

william and mary ~ 9:30's deuce to walk on

uva 9:20/4:20 to walk on

Why don't you try looking into some D3 schools that are more selective if you really want to run at a fairly competitive school, after all, there are hundreds of them out there.

or just go to the school that academically suits you and if you run club or D1 or D3 w/e

You are getting good advice here guys. School is most important.

However, it is equally important that you visit the school you want to attend, and talk to the director of the program yo want to study (and maybe other professors as well in that department, if possible). Talk to students (upperclassmen only) who are close to graduating in what you want to have as your major.

Don't just fall in love with the name or prestige of your selected school and go in blindly. Try to get the best possible fit for yourself.

I'm also going to add another point that at least one other person has alluded to: Running in college is not the same as running in high school. It will be more like a job. All the crummy runners will be gone and it will be more intense, more competitive, and not as frolicky or whimsical as high school can be. I LOVE running. I'm 47 years old, still running (over 100,000 miles in my lifetime) and I've got four kids myself now to put through college. If I had it to do all over again, I'm not so sure I would run on a team this time (I did before). Maybe I would just run on my own, like I do now. Once or twice a season you can jump into a home college meet in each of XC and track as unattached without being on the team. I actually did that even after I graduated (for a year or two).

Here's another thought I would like to submit for your consideration: You can always run as a grad student. Maybe just go to college that first year and make your adjustment to big-time academics. You could run your senior year, then go on to grad school and run there perhaps. It's something to think about. You'll be older and faster and better able to compete.

You could end up being really good at running in college. High school isn't indicative of any future success. You have to decide how important it is to you to run competitively on a school team, and if it is important, you should try to understand why it's important to you (self examination). You're going to have to dedicate a significant amount of your time to it if you join the team. You won't have the regular college experience. Many of your friends will be other runners. You won't have the time to hang out in the dorm and be as carefree as others will be. You will have to be focused. You will have a lot to do everyday.

I stopped running during my junior year of college. I was a music major. I began performing music in restaurants (for really good money actually), and I got great experience in my major. I remember thinking, "I should have been doing this all along instead of running." Perhaps you'll want to immerse yourself into your major like that and just run on your own. You will have to make that decision yourself.

Just don't expect your college team to be like your high school team except with older kids.

Look at some of the Patriot League schools.

Holy Cross, Lafayette, Colgate, Bucknell and Lehigh all offer very good academics, and you could probably walk on to their teams (assuming you improve senior year).

It seems like this is what your looking for. D1 athletics, and very competitive academically.

I would agree with uh no and also since you're looking at some private schools that will be pricey, make sure you fill out the FAFSA and see the best financial aid package you can get. The disparity between these private schools can be dramatic. Some might say you're getting a $20,000 aid package, but $14K of that is loan. Another one might dish out $20K, and $15K or more might be scholarships and grants. Read the fine print.

I think you should pick your top five schools -- not based on running, based on academics -- see how much money you can get and which one you like the most. By the time you've graduated from high school you'll know whether you want to run in college or not. I like the running club ideas written here.

* I ran for a non-scholarship small college, I enjoyed it for two years. By the third year I tired of it and didn't run my senior year, focusing on a key internship for my major, which set up my career. It would've been tough to do both running and the internship my senior year. My friends on my X-C team? Only one would I consider a friend today. The chemistry was only so-so on the team, some insufferable egos (yes, even at the small college level). We ran tons of miles, took time away from some social life and studying. It's not always worth it. It's probably a lot more fun if you had more talent than I did and were getting paid a nice scholarship for it.

Wow, thank you all so much. I defintley have a new perspective and I also had completely ruled out the option that I would be able to walk on to a D1 school. I am hoping to get down to the low 17's next year. Thank you guys!!