Hi Hardloper! I hope you have a good weekend.
Hi Hardloper! I hope you have a good weekend.
Anyone calling what we did in the US a "lockdown" is naive. Our "lockdown" involved white collar adults working from home, all colleges sending kids home AFTER Spring Break(further spreading the virus), and schools doing remote learning. Everything else seemed to be business as usual.
With the White House "letting" each state decide what restrictions to place and interstate travel unrestricted, we are where we are.
Anyone who complains about schools needing to be open in the fall should direct all complaints to 1300 Pennsylvania Ave and ask if they could please use the oval office time machine to actually impose a true lockdown from March-June... because we'd be all set to go... across the board... had we a unified leader in all of this cluster.
you must enter a username wrote:
I recently went to stay at my gf's parents house. When I got there (not before we left) her mother told us she had recently developed a cough. But not to worry, it wasn't covid. She had a headache but her other symptoms were mild. That can't be covid, apparently. When we told her to go get a test (which would take her all of 45 mins) she actually felt insulted and said we had ruined her days plans (she had friends coming round...).
Nevertheless she got a test and it was negative. She was smug about it. I told you so. She was also smug about the fact she had performed the self-test poorly (how can they ask you to swab your own tonsils without touching your tongue).
Now, perhaps there's people like that in China too... But I doubt that kind of attitude is anywhere near as prevalent.
Smug? As in, she was absolutely right and you were absolutely wrong? You should be apologizing to her.
It's true. But in any case there to many stupid peoples :)
Read where 21 million cell phone subscribers in China have vanished during COVID. Unsure it true, interesting number to explain. COVID deaths, inprisoned, fled the country, mined for live organs... ?
where did covid go? wrote:
China locked down hard for 3 months but people started going back to work this spring and things reopening. I refuse to believe that they have such low covid case numbers. Are they lying? Not testing?
It is obvious number from China was 100% made up. You can look at data from any other countries and it is clear the number of COVID cases will never go down in that kind of clean curve.
If the Chinese officials had to report to their boss that cases didn't go down despite the lock down, then they will get in deep trouble and plus if Taiwan was controlling the virus much better than China, it doesn't look good on them so there was basically no other option than to fake the numbers.
Precious Roy wrote:
Of course, China's "official" numbers are not accurate. But it is true that China has just about eradicated the virus and is very much in control of new outbreaks. As evil as China can be, the Chinese people have become very adept at using technology to get around China's control over the internet and social media. That is how the stories about the Uighur concentration camps got out.
As a result of their coronavirus response, China's economy has returned to positive growth and exports are up (even with the tariffs and economic turmoil around the world).
It is now clear that the best approach to the virus on both economic and public health grounds is to shut down hard to get transmission to as close to zero as possible and then reopen slowly with significant testing/tracing and isolation to prevent new outbreaks. That allows a return to a near normal. The other option of just trying to use various social distancing measures results in waves of outbreaks that never end. The economy does not rebound because a significant segment of the population is forced to stay home due to age or commodities. And the virus kills tens of thousands and sends hundreds of thousands to the hospital.
In the US, we have opted for the worst outcomes both for health and economy. Our knee jerk notions of "freedom" and "liberty" have resulted in the US being on track to be eclipsed by China as an economic power if this mess continue on for years.
https://apnews.com/eec76265209c36f28e66d7b62669991ahttps://necsi.edu/minimizing-economic-costs-for-covid-19
Man it is disgusting how many people like you actively root for the demise of America. CHINA developed this plague, let it spread across the world without telling anyone and YOU stand up for them. It really is scary how many people have been brainwashed by MSM and higher education to romanticize Marxist totalitarian states. I guess that's why one political party in the US has gone so far left that they really should completely drop their old name and go with some combination of "Socialist Party" or Socialist-Communist Party" or "Marxist Party".
fitz wrote:
Man it is disgusting how many people like you actively root for the demise of America.
i don't see anything in his post rooting for america's demise. and i don't see anything in your post supporting that claim. the guy explained how/why china is in a better place than we are, as a lesson in what we COULD do to climb out of this mess. he, like most people in this country, regardless of party, wants us to get out of this mess. how is that rooting for demise?
i suppose the republican position is often that there is no mess if we don't concede there is a mess--but does that make it anti-american to recognize there is a mess? i'd point out that republicans have been on tje wrong side of that battle historically too many times to count...
Their cremation sites that were setup are still going full time .. easy to spot via satellite imaging.
expatistan wrote:
fitz wrote:
Man it is disgusting how many people like you actively root for the demise of America.
i don't see anything in his post rooting for america's demise. and i don't see anything in your post supporting that claim. the guy explained how/why china is in a better place than we are, as a lesson in what we COULD do to climb out of this mess. he, like most people in this country, regardless of party, wants us to get out of this mess. how is that rooting for demise?
i suppose the republican position is often that there is no mess if we don't concede there is a mess--but does that make it anti-american to recognize there is a mess? i'd point out that republicans have been on tje wrong side of that battle historically too many times to count...
You are so far off base. The Democrat Party creates a problem, then says "Hey, we need more government to fix it". That is always their stance, including now by saying we need massive Federal level government shutdowns and loss of individual freedoms to stop a virus that was developed by people of a like-mind.
Name me once that Republicans have been "on the wrong side" of a battle? Would love to see your examples because at best they'll be opinion based. Civil War? NOPE Voting Rights? NOPE Jim Crow laws? NOPE Abortion/killing of minority children? NOPE
expatistan wrote:
....but it sure makes it easier to ensure the idiots in your country don't murder 160,000 people.
You lost credibility with this statement. Please learn the definition of murder.
expatistan wrote:
....as a lesson in what we COULD do to climb out of this mess. he, like most people in this country, regardless of party, wants us to get out of this mess. how is that rooting for demise?
i suppose the republican position is often that there is no mess if we don't concede there is a mess--but does that make it anti-american to recognize there is a mess? i'd point out that republicans have been on the wrong side of that battle historically too many times to count...
What you fail to address is whether the solution is worse than the cure. You seem to be all in for the cure, the cure, the cure, no matter the cost. But what if the cost fundamentally alters the idea that is America.
From your posts', we already see how you lean, and that is toward the idea, that America is wrong based on a number count, that I am sure even you can agree is not accurately reported or evaluated. And by the way, I am not a supported of the guy in the White House, I didn't vote for him 3.5 years ago.
As far as a mess, once again, you seem to want to make it partisan and not accept the idea that viruses, no matter the name, or type, kill people. This one, just like he one in 2017-18 seems to kill the sick and old, and just like this one, that one too left survivors with permanent lung damage, nerve damage, and a host of other problems that hadn't been seen before.
The mess has been made in trying to find a human solution to dealing with it, without being consistent in our behaviour in dealing with sickness and death from viruses. I agree, this one is pretty bad, but why has the reaction been so knee-jerk and at times irrational? We are acting like this virus makes you bleed from your eyeballs and melts down your internal organs, and we both know it isn't THAT virus.
Precious Roy wrote:
Of course, China's "official" numbers are not accurate. But it is true that China has just about eradicated the virus and is very much in control of new outbreaks. As evil as China can be, the Chinese people have become very adept at using technology to get around China's control over the internet and social media. That is how the stories about the Uighur concentration camps got out.
As a result of their coronavirus response, China's economy has returned to positive growth and exports are up (even with the tariffs and economic turmoil around the world).
It is now clear that the best approach to the virus on both economic and public health grounds is to shut down hard to get transmission to as close to zero as possible and then reopen slowly with significant testing/tracing and isolation to prevent new outbreaks. That allows a return to a near normal. The other option of just trying to use various social distancing measures results in waves of outbreaks that never end. The economy does not rebound because a significant segment of the population is forced to stay home due to age or commodities. And the virus kills tens of thousands and sends hundreds of thousands to the hospital.
In the US, we have opted for the worst outcomes both for health and economy. Our knee jerk notions of "freedom" and "liberty" have resulted in the US being on track to be eclipsed by China as an economic power if this mess continue on for years.
https://apnews.com/eec76265209c36f28e66d7b62669991ahttps://necsi.edu/minimizing-economic-costs-for-covid-19
Ugh, those idiot Americans and their desire not to live in totalitarian states.
not just a flu or common cold wrote:
Are you attempting to minimize the virus in U.S? Are you using the trump line: We test, we have the most cases because we test.
U.S. is suffering excessive deaths far worse than the 160,000 plus official dead from covid-19. If you have evidence any other nation is suffering excessive deaths, demonstrate. Excessive deaths does not require a positive covid-19 test. Excessive deaths looks back at death rate in a nation over past ten years.
The entire second paragraph is completely wrong.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/excess_deaths.htmThe Excess Deaths catalogued fall in line very reasonably with the 160000 official dead from COVID-19. The only period of time where missed deaths likely occurred was in Late May/Early April in New York. Where did you even get this notion?
you must enter a username wrote:
I recently went to stay at my gf's parents house. When I got there (not before we left) her mother told us she had recently developed a cough. But not to worry, it wasn't covid. She had a headache but her other symptoms were mild. That can't be covid, apparently. When we told her to go get a test (which would take her all of 45 mins) she actually felt insulted and said we had ruined her days plans (she had friends coming round...).
Nevertheless she got a test and it was negative. She was smug about it. I told you so. She was also smug about the fact she had performed the self-test poorly (how can they ask you to swab your own tonsils without touching your tongue).
Now, perhaps there's people like that in China too... But I doubt that kind of attitude is anywhere near as prevalent.
Yeah, nobody in China ever told the government to go screw themselves with their lockdown nonsense.
Wowwwdude wrote:
Anyone calling what we did in the US a "lockdown" is naive. Our "lockdown" involved white collar adults working from home, all colleges sending kids home AFTER Spring Break(further spreading the virus), and schools doing remote learning. Everything else seemed to be business as usual.
With the White House "letting" each state decide what restrictions to place and interstate travel unrestricted, we are where we are.
Anyone who complains about schools needing to be open in the fall should direct all complaints to 1300 Pennsylvania Ave and ask if they could please use the oval office time machine to actually impose a true lockdown from March-June... because we'd be all set to go... across the board... had we a unified leader in all of this cluster.
Orrrrrr... use the time machine to go back and say, “dude, we could be over this like H1N1 quick if you just let it ride on Stay Open to win.” Then we could use the time machine to come back to now and see which one worked better. Orrrrr... just use the time machine to go back and transport us all to 2021 and skip the virus completely-your time machine imagination is pretty boring, bro.
Plus, who made the president a King to tell the states what to do? I think that type of nonsense started a war in the 1700s.
holy gadd wrote:
Kvothe wrote:
I don't believe them either. A totalitarian state can make the official record differ from the truth. Its why freedom of the press is so important to a functioning democracy.
Exactly why the US is not a functioning democracy anymore. More like a corporate/banking cartel. Not sure who is more believable, US or China.
0/10
huh what wrote:
Some percentage of those excess deaths are attributable to the lockdown itself. For example, hospital visits for heart attacks, strokes, etc. fell off a cliff.
Wait. So you believe that data but not he excess death data? Boy, you are definitely not a sheep.
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