Ryan Hall DNFs at LA. Will he ever run a good marathon again?

Watcher of Feeds wrote:

agc5k wrote:

The men's race started at 655am, the women's race started at 645am....

And?....Did you watch the KTLA feed or not? Hall dropped out around mile 14. According to this story....

http://www.dailynews.com//sports/20150315/la-marathon-2015-ogla-kimaiyo-wins-womens-race

...the lead men passed the lead women at the 10 mile mark (the women were particularly slow today)...thus, it is possible that Sara passed Ryan right before he dropped out (after he passed her around mile 11 or 12). This is what I think I saw happen but since I turned the feed on just before Ryan dropped out I am not sure (... I could be mistaken and they could have been cutting back and forth between the men's and women's leaders). Did anyone actually watch the feed, can anyone confirm what happened? Did Sara pass Ryan right before he dropped out?

I was watching it from 36 min into men's race. The leaders passed the women, then Ryan got close to passing them then he dropped out

Yup. While the top group of men went by the elite women around mile 10, Hall was already way behind them at that point, and he never ended up passing Sara. He dropped out right before he *would've* passed Sara (which, incidentally, was right after he got passed by the top American men), perhaps so she wouldn't be demoralized by his poor performance.

When you have achieved what Ryan has you have opportunities to cash in. So when he runs a spring marathon it is always London or Boston. When he runs a fall marathon it is New York. He needs to go and run a smaller level marathon where 2:15 is the winning time and work on his craft. No agent will let that happen because there isn't enough money. With no real coach to step in he looks to the agent to make these decisions.

Has anyone seen any post-DNF interviews of Hall yet?

I really think Hall needs to come to the conclusion that running in a team environment would work best for him again. How about training with Ben Rosario's Naz Elite? They are close by too...

I also wonder if Hal is having nutritional issues?

CRIPES!!! wrote:

CRIPES YOU PEOPLE! He FINISHED BOSTON last year! DON'T you know how many RUNNERS DREAM OF JUST THAT???

And, HECK!, IT WAS RYAN HALL THAT MADE MEB's WIN POSSIBLE!

Or don't you REMEMBER????!

A lot of Americans dream of finishing Boston, or at least qualifying for Boston. Nobody who ran 3:42 in HS and 13:16 in college dreams of that. They may dream of winning it or running sub-2:10 (which he did once even though it was the most wind-aided race in history). But they don't dream of finishing it.

RunnerSTL wrote:

Has anyone seen any post-DNF interviews of Hall yet?

Well he was going to do some interviews, but he DNS'd.

I have yet to see how Hall is doing as I still haven't seen him tweet or anything.

I'm sure Ryan's nutrition has nothing to do with his recent performances and DNF's. He's probably stuck with the same diet for a while now and knows what's good and bad for his body.

IMHO, I think Hall's last three years filled with DNF's are due to the fact that he has changed coaches too many times. He was running spectacular races with Terrence Mahon and would probably still be where he was between 2007-11. He was probably overthinking every single thing he did and thought he could get better elsewhere.

That's just MY opinion and I think he would have been the old Ryan would he have stayed under Mahon's tutelage (maybe injuries here and there but nothing as dramatic as what's been occurring lately).

It amazes me so many people bash Hall. I should right a column about how it can easily be argued he's the greatest American-born runner in US history.I'm glad a few people are defending him on the DNF stuff. Post s like the following are just wrong:

What are you talking about? What DNFs has he had? I can't think of an besides the Olympics (Which makes sense to me as you are going to try to run that almost no matter what).

Hall has been a true pro. Instead of show up, get paid and DNF he's always been a DNS..

I'm not willing to say he's 100% done but agree with you. I think he can make the team in 2016. The race will be tactical and you just gotta get top 3. He's a victim of his own success. When you run 2:04 and don't come close to winning, you try crazy things. He's had so much success the only thing he wants is a major win which isn't going to happen.

I should get JK to coach him. I approached Hall about that when he left Mahon.

JK as in John Kellogg?

Well, regardless of whether or not he switches coaches, I think he better take a long, hard look @ what he's gonna do and when. He himself clearly said that it takes about 1 year to adapt to a new coach's training methods. And right now Ryan Hall is @ a point where he doesn't have much time.

How will he know his next coach will take him to the next level when it will take 1 year to see the changes?? And if the 1 year passes by and he sees no improvement? Will he switch coaches again and wait another year?

He doesn't have much time now so it's only a matter of time until we find out where Ryan Hall finishes his "elite" running career.

I hope you're right Rojo.

Part of my challenge (as a former huge fan) is this is the 2nd US championship in a row where he's pulled out when he had a reasonable chance to place somewhere in the money (Peachtree 10K and now LA). Awards go 15 deep. It seems like if he won't win, he doesn't finish.... I know 15th place is never going to be his goal, but it seems like a better goal than not finishing (barring injury).

London 2012 - DNF

NYC 2012 - DNS (withdrew before Sandy cancellation)

Boston 2013 - DNS

NYC 2013 - DNS

Boston 2014 - 2:17:50

Boulder Boulder 10K 30:12

Peachtree 10K 2014 -DNF

Napa-To-Sonoma Wine Country Half Marathon 2014 - DNF

RnR AZ 2015 - 1:04:16

LA 2015 - DNF

RyanDNFHall wrote:

IMHO, I think Hall's last three years filled with DNF's are due to the fact that he has changed coaches too many times. He was running spectacular races with Terrence Mahon and would probably still be where he was between 2007-11. He was probably overthinking every single thing he did and thought he could get better elsewhere.

That's just MY opinion and I think he would have been the old Ryan would he have stayed under Mahon's tutelage (maybe injuries here and there but nothing as dramatic as what's been occurring lately).

I can relate to this. I went through a phase like Ryan where I thought I was sub 17 5k shape but kept running 18s, where I kept dropping out of races I wasn't feeling good in. I'm better now and have finally run sub 17.

In the bad patch I kept changing training philosophy every few weeks or months, didn't listen to my coaches, and I over thought every single detail. Every couple weeks I'd read an article about a pro runner or through my log when I used to be running well and have some "epiphany" about how to change my training to the perfect training for the breakthrough.

After 18 months of this I finally got through by simplifying things and going back to the basics. This meant no workouts in base, just mileage. Listening to my coaches and doing exactly what they said exactly how they said to do it and do it as well as I could on the hard days, and adding easy morning runs to keep my weekly mileage up in the season.

Therefore, I think Ryan needs to go back to the basics. No workouts, just run 90-120 min everyday how he feels and do 25-30 races a year. The frequent racing teaches him to race, and the simplicity of just running 60-75 min every morning and 30-45 min every evening and 90-120 min Sunday would be so simple this is nothing to think about. Just run how he feels and race all the time. Simplicity leads to success in my opinion. Complicated only works if you're not the one doing the thinking (i.e. Rupp), and you do exactly what the evil genius (i.e. Salazar) says to do that understands how it works (if its complicated don't understand it, you'll overthink it, just trust the coach).

1:26:54 - Hall has bib in hand, tosses bib on ground.

To catch the whole chain of events, start watching about 1:24... he gets caught by the 3 americans in the chase pack... they pass the women leaders, camera follows them for a while... then cuts back, Hall is running... and then he's stopped. Bib in hand... then he drops it. Just walks over to the side of the road.

I agree. Most of the criticism of Hall is just nuts. The guy blew away the U.S. half-marathon record, then gave ten straight international-caliber marathon performances over the next five years. That's not the history of a complete flake. It's incredible consistency at a high level for a long time.

There were plenty of doubters along the way. I was one of them. In the fall of 2010, where Hall parted ways with Mahon and declared that God was his new coach (or some such thing), the commentary on letsrun.com and elsewhere was similar to what I'm seeing today: Ryan is finished. Ryan doesn't know what he's doing. Ryan needs to have this coach or do that training program. What a wasted talent. Then came Boston 2011. And Chicago 2011. And Houston 2012.

Perhaps Ryan Hall may be faulted for some undue optimism in his racing that occasionally approaches Icarus-like hubris. But for an athlete who aspires to accomplish big things, there are worse qualities.

The American leaders went through 14 in about

1:12:12 per a quick video review.

Thats 5:09 pace/2:15 finish.

1:11:18 we see hall's bib is off, he so he wasn't too far behind them.

Not what he wanted, but still don't see why he quit?

His splits were looking rough. I think he was cracking more than running a comfortable pace towards the end.

EstimatedFinish wrote:

What time do you guys think he would have finished in? He went through the half in about 66' and was already slowing down a lot by that point. Sub 2:20???

Its unfortunate so many people bash him. I have had the opportunity to spend a lot of time with the Halls and not once did they initiate a conversation about religion, telling me i should find it or anything along them lines. I even fell on some hard times and not once did they mention how god could help me and they both knew I didn't go to church. If someone is going to ask him a question about his faith they have to be ready to hear about it.

They are truly two of the most down to earth, sincere, intelligent amazing people I have ever met and not once, ever did I think they had mental issues and I am not a big fan of religion or some of the aspects about the church they attend. People would give anything for his career…he is one of the top American distance runners ever that has also done so much for the human race, to people who are not even runners with their donations and foundation.

People are such POS and seriously need to get a life….

I've been around long enough to see the odds of a comeback are stacked up pretty high against him but I have also seen many surprises over the years. I can still remember DeCastella's win at Rotterdam when I thought his career was over.

I know you guys were laughing about it but I wouldn't be shocked if he jumped in Boston if he felt he was ready to run.

I also don't understand the negativity here but I guess that will never change. Guys like Ritz and Solinsky who have had their share of problems don't receive the same hatred. I'm glad they don't but Hall doesn't deserve the flack either.

Er.....he DNF'd today, for instance.

rojo wrote:

It amazes me so many people bash Hall. I should right a column

and I'll left one :;