Is everyone prepared for Rupp to win Boston?

The field at Boston is better than Chicago, but it is still soft compared to London. So, a Rupp win would be a big deal, but I do not see it as causing an existential crisis in US distance running. If Rupp won London by beating Kipchoge, Bekele, etc., then it would be time to wring hands over whether to claim Rupp as a legit US champion or wonder whether he is the Lance Armstrong of distance running.

The OP is right in that it’s painfully obvious that Rupp and Salazar have gone far beyond the so-called gray area and have very likely flouted WADA rules.

The gray area talk is a red herring. Disregard the thyroid medication, inhalers, and even the L-carnitine infusions. The primary issue with regard to Rupp is Salazar’s personal Androgel prescription, which would lead to MASSIVE performance gains for Galen. Consider the following:

1. In 2009, Salazar conducted an unsanctioned experiment with Dr. Jeffrey Brown to determine how much topical testosterone it would take to trigger a positive test.

2. Salazar regularly gave Rupp personal massages, especially in advance of big races, despite the fact that the Nike Oregon Project employed a licensed massage therapist (this is all in the USADA report).

3. In addition to his Androgel prescription from a doctor in Oregon, Salazar has also procured untold amounts of T from Dr. Brown.

Anyone who thinks Galen is clean probably thought Lance was clean too. (Speaking of which, who was the first person AlSal informed about the results of the Magness L-Carnitine test?)

Outside the LetsHateRupp.com site the rest of the world is happy for Rupp to win.

I seriously doubt that anyone outside of LRC would even notice, and the "rest of the world" certainly do not care who wins Boston.

Boston was once an important marker for marathon greatness, but those days are long gone. it is today a footnote in the annals of running history, and if you ask any European track fan who they think is going, "to win the marathon in April," they all think you are referring to London.

things change, life moves on. Boston has had its day.

cheers.

So why is Rupp still competing? This is a non-revenue sport if there ever was one!!! In all reality, literally no one cares about distance running - it's like 0.00000000001% of the population that are even aware of the Boston Marathon. Rupp not running would have zero affect on Nike's bottom line - that's the truth.

So again, if Rupp is dirty - why is he out there?

HahaRiiiiiiight wrote:

So again, if Rupp is dirty - why is he out there?

Because of the burden of proof?

I'll answer the dummy wrote:

HahaRiiiiiiight wrote:

So again, if Rupp is dirty - why is he out there?

Because of the burden of proof?

This whole "lets try to prove Rupp is a cheater" sentiment is turning out to be quite the burden, isn't it?

Bullet_Proof wrote:

I'll answer the dummy wrote:

Because of the burden of proof?

This whole "lets try to prove Rupp is a cheater" sentiment is turning out to be quite the burden, isn't it?

You are taking the stance that every runner competing is clean because they haven't been banned. That is plain idiocy.

Of course it will prove that Americans can compete with them, because they are doping too.

Rupp hasn't won yet.

Meb is an American. Racism and xenophobia are reprehensible. I feel sorry for racists and xenophobes. They are being used by unscrupulous forces that prey on those lacking critical thinking skills. The name of the game is divide and conquer - get people to act, think and vote against their own economic best interests. The rich and powerful rulers and oligarchs have manipulated people for centuries like this for their own financial/power gains.

Anyhow, Rupp is a tough competitor and has a good chance to win Boston 2018! I hope he does. But there are some fast dudes in the field who may well beat him. It's going to be a great race.

I'd say Rupp thinks of himself as a guy who uses technology and science as tools to give himself the best chance to win. I don't think of him as a cheater. I guarantee he does not think of himself as a cheater.

There is likely a denial on his part as to what Coach Al brings to the table. I freely admit to being a Rupp supporter.

I kinda feel sorry for Alberto too, a doggedly tough competitor as a runner and a coach, his judgment is clouded by his fierce instinct for the win. I'm of Al's generation and have been inspired by him since he was in high school. I watched his heels pull away from me on the indoor oval at Wayland High School. Some of the most fun I've ever had!

It's tough to see the trajectory that brought us to the present. That being said, I still have admiration and respect for the man and his accomplishments.

MakwalaFan wrote:

Whoever wins I'm just ready to see a fast(er) time in Boston again. Since Mutai's ridiculous 2:03, the winning time has been 2:12, 2:10, 2:08, 2:09, 2:12, and 2:09. Given that there are so many 2:05-2:06 guys nowadays, it seems like even the times in unpaced races on (potentially) harder course should be getting faster too.

Between 1979 and 2002, the winning time in Boston was 2:09 or faster 18 times (out of 24 years) and the WR was 2:08:33 ('69) down to 2:05:38 ('02), so they were usually within 3 minutes (or closer) of the WR.

And the funny part about those times is that the guy who ran the 2:08 was only a few weeks shy of his 39th birthday (Meb). All the young guns should be embarrassed.

I'll answer the dummy wrote:

Bullet_Proof wrote:

This whole "lets try to prove Rupp is a cheater" sentiment is turning out to be quite the burden, isn't it?

You are taking the stance that every runner competing is clean because they haven't been banned. That is plain idiocy.

I agree with you that my claim does require a certain level of faith because we cant 100% know for sure. Your stance also requires a certain level of faith because it is the exact opposite: that every runner who is at the world class level must be cheating.

Why aren't we talking about the women's field??? Just the American entrants alone make it a more compelling story than Rupp's.

anacondarunner wrote:

It's truly unfortunate; I vividly remember skipping class to watch Hall run Boston in 09, 10, and 11, and even though he didn't win, I found his performances to be compelling and inspiring. And I always thought it would be so, so cool if an American-born runner ever somehow managed to win Boston. But for it to be Rupp after all we've learned from the ProPublica and USADA reports ... man, what a bummer.

Vividly remember skipping classes. Do you vividly remember that it's a state holiday in Massachusetts and all schools are closed?

Samuel DeChamplain wrote:

FrenchDawg wrote:

That's how it works on letsrun. Unless the field features bekele, kipchoge, or kipsang, it cannot possibly be A level

not even true haha, they discredit both his Olympic medals which featured two of those guys

Please do not let facts get in the way of letsruns perceived reality.

Cottonshirt wrote:

Outside the LetsHateRupp.com site the rest of the world is happy for Rupp to win.

I seriously doubt that anyone outside of LRC would even notice, and the "rest of the world" certainly do not care who wins Boston.

Boston was once an important marker for marathon greatness, but those days are long gone. it is today a footnote in the annals of running history, and if you ask any European track fan who they think is going, "to win the marathon in April," they all think you are referring to London.

things change, life moves on. Boston has had its day.

cheers.

Nice to see a sensible post.

Bullet_Proof wrote:

I'll answer the dummy wrote:

You are taking the stance that every runner competing is clean because they haven't been banned. That is plain idiocy.

I agree with you that my claim does require a certain level of faith because we cant 100% know for sure. Your stance also requires a certain level of faith because it is the exact opposite: that every runner who is at the world class level must be cheating.

Nowhere did I make the claim. I criticized the statement you made, which was that if a runner is competing they must not be cheating. My criticism equates to saying that there must be a runner out there cheating who hasn’t been caught. That does not require faith - we’ve seen it happen.

Your stance is incredibly naive.

You forgot another but only if used cautiously.

White Maeng Da Kratom.

Do your homework. There's a reason why

it may become a controlled substance, already

it is some states. But it is a grand performance

enchancer if used correctly.

gloria wrote:

You forgot another but only if used cautiously.

White Maeng Da Kratom.

Do your homework. There's a reason why

it may become a controlled substance, already

it is some states. But it is a grand performance

enchancer if used correctly.

Any evidence AlSal or NOP are using this stuff?

Umm. Probably millions of people in the US have Androgel prescriptions. What's to stop any other runner from "borrowing" some from any other Androgel user? Nothing really.

Salazar's test was sketchy for sure. But that's 2009, and for that particular lab. Who's to say that the detection limits are different or can be different for different labs or equipment? As a scientist, I've sent thousands of environmental samples to labs. I can request different detection limits, often for needing to pay a lot more for lower detection limits. It would probably be foolish to rely on that experiment from that long ago and assume that you'd be safe from detection all the time.

Salazar giving massages is fine. Anyone could massage themselves with Androgel that they take from any of the other millions of users in the US, so why would we care about the massages?

Untold amounts of T? Well that could be zero or it could be enough to dope up the entire NFL. Doesn't tell me anything.

The testers test Rupp a whole lot. If they test him soon after he rubs or gets Androgel rubbed in him, he'll test positive... if that's what he does. They test most other runners a whole lot less. They also could be doping or not doping with Androgel. I'm suspicious, but I give him the benefit of the doubt for now.

If Salazar has a legitimate prescription for Androgel, there's no legal reason to deny him that.