I'm not afraid to die. My age is not a problem, probably I'm more healthy than you.
But I respect old people such as Young people, when they are active, humble and not arrogant.
I can't respect who is arrogant, presumptuos and verbally violent (probably not only verbally).
With the age, we of course had the opportunity to live different experiences, and can see the future already knowing our mistakes of the past.
You don't have any past, and I fear can't have any future.
My response to this would be not to support any civic events, parades, etc the government wants us to come out and take part in. People can't support a government that treats them like this.
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Renato Canova wrote:
I'm not afraid to die. My age is not a problem, probably I'm more healthy than you.
Bold claim from a 75 year old on a running forum.
But in fairness Renato is not a boomer; he’s a bit too old to be a boomer having been born in ‘44.
yes you are right - and the most probably reason why? Japanese people take care of themselves better than a lot of citizens in other nations. Japan ranks second globally in terms of life expectancy, has a low smoking rate and is 6th lowest in terms of obesity. On top of that they are a very conservative culture where hugging and kissing everybody just for the sake of hugging and kissing isn't a thing
So we think its a coincidence they have this under control without needing drastic measures?
What this whole COVID-19 debacle is really about is a wakeup call to those in the human race that have had a seemingly free-pass to treat their bodies and health with disdain. Made a choice to burn 2 packs of cigarettes a day? - yeah you might not want to get sick. In poor health because you choose to sit inside all day and play video games instead of excercising? Yup, likewise.
So now how great do we all feel about being basically on lock-down in order to spare those people who made choices in their lives that had every opportunity not to? Should my 2 next door neighbors who work in the service industry be now out of work for the foreseeable future and having to rely on unemployment because of the minority of people who treated themselves like crap their lives?
Final thought - so now my behaviors and life has been dramatically impacted in order to spare this group of people, do I now have the ability to dramatically impact their behaviors and life when this is all over? I have friends I can no longer go hang out with because of this. Friends that are losing jobs and going through misery because of this. Can I on the flip walk up to a smoker in the street now and grab their cigarette and toss it or even better a full pack if I see one sitting on a table? I mean we know smoking is a key component in the vulnerability of people to COVID-19 right?
It would only seem extremely fair.
Renato Canova wrote:
I'm not afraid to die. My age is not a problem, probably I'm more healthy than you.
When you try to convince yourself that something doesn't bother you, it usually bothers you more.
runner in italy wrote:
I live in Lombardia (close to beautiful Varese) and would like to give an update of the situation. First, we can workout in our backyard - if we have one. As another poster pointed Italian cities do not have big suburban housing like in the US , a lot of us live in flats so working out on our lawn is not always an option.
It is peaceful and quiet here since Friday. I live just outside Varese and there are almost no cars going as grocery stores have not been open today where I live. Now, in regards to running I do go out on a run still, in fact I just came back from a 9 mile run through the forest. I do this respectfully - in the sense that literally 30 feet from my house I can access a trail network on which I usually encounter 2-3 mountainbikers or runners on a 60min run. Today no one. So I have absolute minimal encounters. Yesterday, I was stopped on the last 1/4 mile of my run because I decided to run through the town and Gendamerie asked me where I live. Since I was just up the road, they told me politely to run home and to avoid running on the roads but DID NOT technically prohibit me from going into the forest. Bear in mind that yesterday I was still technically allowed to run at about a 2km radius/distance (the rule is shady) from my house.
People are generally accepting of the measures, at least the one I chat to or am in contact with. Bear in mind that HARD measures just have been put in place really today/yesterday. Life in the previous two weeks was still relatively normal - we drive to work or work from home, grocery stores where open and people were walking their dogs outside/ going on jogs. Our bars and cafes are closed since 3 -4 weeks now I believe, which we terribly miss.
Now, my personal opinion on general top-down lock downs and curfews : they are necessary temporarily because our hospital have to deal with the reality (people dying) - so I accept and move along. In fact I rather enjoy live working from home and enjoyed the pleasant weather of the last days on my terrace . However, these curfews absolutely must be of temporary nature and must stop eventually. This is because we cannot forget that the problem goes much much deeper: even though we have free health care our hospitals and health institutes for YEARS have been heavily under-financed. The public sector in Italy is HEAVILY in debt. Also, when Lombardia closed 2 weeks ago we had people fleeing to the south to their family (or beach). Then consider that our population has one of the highest % of elderly people AND that we have a lot of multi-generation houses. You see the difficulty.
Secondly, and probably the most important issue is that we DO NOT test enough for the virus. This includes all of Europe and the US. We do hear the general story that in China, SK and Japan Covid-19 was primarily contained because of the hard government measures taken in terms of curfews but if you read deeper into the story you realise this, if at all, only half of the story: South Korea and finally China did way more tests and changed strategy eventually: they immediately isolated people testing positive instead of mass quarantining everyone on a long-term.
So, this is the situation we are in. We try to maintain good spirits basically. Conte cannot keep up lock-down for much longer (admittedly he said to prolong until 15th of April) because of the heavy economic and financial burden on Italy. Lombardia decided to STOP all production as of this weekend. What does need to change , is the strategy of testing. We need to get a much clearer picture as to who is infected and immediately isolate. I hope this will be done.
Great post, totally agree. The shutdown can only be temporary, otherwise the medicine might do more harm than good. But we need to buy time for the health care system. Also, it seems Germany and some other countries like Austria or Norway are doing much better on testing (their death rate is so much lower, cannot be explained by other factors such as population age etc), which is partly due the fact that they were hit later I guess so they had more time to react.
Renato, thanks for your perspective on the Coronavirus in Italy and elsewhere.
As for others, this is really not about cultural differences and/or racial genetics or bad personal choices. The vast majority of infected people were infected because they were in the vicinity of someone else in the normal course of their lives. The vast majority of those suffering badly are doing so not because of bad life decisions but because they are old and have the kinds of ills that old people tend to have. Many of the younger people in bad shape a) got unlucky and b) had some other health condition they did not do anything to create. For instance, the 21 year old Spanish football coach who died only found out that he had the pre-existing condition of leukemia(?) after he was in the hospital for covid-19.
Lombardia is in the midst of basically a one month span of thousands of deaths due to the disease, so sterner measures are certainly needed. I'm no fan of bans on running but I would say that the multiple parties I have witnessed in the neighborhoods between here and work the past couple days are highly inadvisable.
Renato Canova wrote:
We, and you, are not disciplined like Chinese, Japanese or South Korean. We refuse to listen to a very simple word : TO OBEYE.
Nothing personal, but your country invented fascism, and is one of the few besides China to even attempt this sort of extreme response. The Japanese didn't.
Hello Boomer wrote:
Renato Canova wrote:
Maybe you don't understand that themain problem is the very fast spreading of the infection. If somebody is in a house with a garden, nobody prohibit him to do every kind of exercises, these are advised by the government too.
But we had too many cases of runners who joined small groups, of people going around with the dog in a park spending time speaking with somebody else (not respecting the distance of more than 1 meter), and of people standing together waiting the public buses at every stop.
We, and you, are not disciplined like Chinese, Japanese or South Korean. We refuse to listen to a very simple word : TO OBEYE.
If our behavior can be productive, some time, when we live our normal life, in case of specific emergencies, instead, can only provoke anarchy and confusion.
This is what happens in the Western World.
Said an old man afraid of dying.
I know this is LetsRun, but your remark is so out of touch with human decency that you are not worthy any more attention after this.
You're a though guy now, but eventually you'll s h a i t yourself - because you've watched people around you die in thousands each day for weeks, and you finally realize that you yourself are becoming sick and you know that this virus kills many young people and create scar tissue of your precious lungs...
You wait and see... and feel.
Bye
Renato Canova wrote:
I'm not afraid to die....
and I fear can't have any future.
Hi Renato. Whatever happens... If you go, you should know that your knowledge has been helpful to many runners worldwide, and your knowledge will continue to help many. You are a living legend. Please stay safe for as long as you can, and please take great care in protecting yourself. Best of wishes from Norway.
I m in Italy and used to do my run in the forest, a natural park, alone, but since 5 days with the Covid -19 infection spread more and more I dont go out anymore, I m lucky i have a treadmill and so I can run at home..
The problem in Italy and everywhere is to keep SOCIAL DISTANCE, we need to stay alone.
And lot of people didnt understand this so you could see group of youngs training togheter, or group of people walking their dog togheter, or people gather togheter outside , so government has done more restrictions.
But there is still another point, and is ok I m a runner so I have the right to go out and run alone, yes, but as me I have this right , all others citizen have the right to go out for a walk, to take an hour of sun, to walk their dog etc. etc. And in this way EVERYBODY is out to do something and we cant keep the social distance we need . So is something that has to do with respect for yourself and for other people cos Covid-19 asymptomatic are a huge part about 60%, so to not get it thebest thing to do is STAY AT HOME until the events of death have ending.
bye bye boomer wrote:
I know this is LetsRun, but your remark is so out of touch with human decency that you are not worthy any more attention after this.
You're a though guy now, but eventually you'll s h a i t yourself - because you've watched people around you die in thousands each day for weeks, and you finally realize that you yourself are becoming sick and you know that this virus kills many young people and create scar tissue of your precious lungs...
You wait and see... and feel.
Bye
Got any cool stories bro?
I am in France where we are in full confinement but are allowed to go out for 30min max still. And yes its hard as a runner and I have gone for a quick loop but it is absolutely essential to contain the spread.
Without full lockdown people will not be reasonable ever. But when the US will understand that the coffins will already pile up and the desaster will have progressed far beyond the one of any other country. It'll be too late.
"Social" distancing is a super loose term and everyone interprets it differently. Without a full lockdown and police in the street to control nothing will change.
The US is in full exponential growth. Meaning more than 1 MILLION cases by the end of this week. I'll talk to all of you in a week and we will see then.
So the police have said that they won't response to low level crimes, but if I step out side to go for a run they are going to arrest me??
Isn't going for a run the lowest level of "crime" anyone can commit? It's certainly ranks below shoplifting, something that is an actual crime.
runningchick wrote:
I am in France where we are in full confinement but are allowed to go out for 30min max still. And yes its hard as a runner and I have gone for a quick loop but it is absolutely essential to contain the spread.
Without full lockdown people will not be reasonable ever. But when the US will understand that the coffins will already pile up and the desaster will have progressed far beyond the one of any other country. It'll be too late.
"Social" distancing is a super loose term and everyone interprets it differently. Without a full lockdown and police in the street to control nothing will change.
The US is in full exponential growth. Meaning more than 1 MILLION cases by the end of this week. I'll talk to all of you in a week and we will see then.
Well...explain then why the "end of the world" scenario isn't happening in Japan: A little of 1200 cases and a few dozens deaths. No draconian lockdowns and business as usual:
https://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2020/03/21/commentary/japan-commentary/japan-still-coronavirus-outlier/#.Xnb5-jNMHEB"Look around Tokyo now, and you’ll see no such scene has unfolded. Despite the cancellation of sports events, the closure of schools, and the shutting down of some, but not all, larger entertainment venues, much of Japan continues as normal. There is no quarantine and no enforced closures of bars or restaurants. Even clubs (easy places to get sick at the best of times) remain open."
"If you want to eat ramen at 4 a.m., fine. If you get on the subway, you’ll see it slightly emptier, but still heaving. If you want to rent a car and drive from one end of the country and back again, do it — there’s nothing stopping you. Which means there’s very little stopping the spread of the disease either."
A recent video of downtown Tokyo; people out & about, trains filled up, stores open, etc. (starts @ 7 mins in):
https://youtu.be/iNoNEK9UgicToo many people have been raised by a phone and computer instead of by parents. Living in isolation is not living. We all could have chosen that life in order to avoid car accidents or disease or mugging. Insanity will set in quickly for most humans. But maybe that is the real experiment here. Or maybe it is to bring socialism to more countries. But if nobody is working, even socialism fails within a month when there is no food.
We have now become a World consumed in fear.....
Simple, Italy is a nation of extroverts... Did you ever see Italians minding their own business alone? They just can't pass another person without exchanging a few words, giving each other big hugs, kiss on a cheek... Impossible!!! And I mean it as a heartfelt compliment;) Forza Italia!!!
NotPC wrote:
So the police have said that they won't response to low level crimes, but if I step out side to go for a run they are going to arrest me??
Isn't going for a run the lowest level of "crime" anyone can commit? It's certainly ranks below shoplifting, something that is an actual crime.
I also read they were going to release inmates early, because guards are getting sick.
Cops NOT responding to crimes PLUS letting inmates out early, might not be the best combination.