BYU Football wrote:
I sure don't hear anyone complaining about BYU's football team being older than everyone else. Perhaps that is because the football team at BYU is pretty crappy. Now if they were winning???
We're talking about CROSS COUNTRY. Not football. We're talking about CROSS COUNTRY!
It's CROSS COUNTRY. Not football. We're talking about CROSS COUNTRY season.
You don’t whine when other teams are full of 40 yo Kenyan non qualifiers. How many yrs of Jr college do you get?
FrenchDawg wrote:
Until they start restricting the amount of time missionaries can spend in competition, any victory they achieve will be hollow and meaningless.
If you can't beat them, ban them!
If you don't agree with what another's viewpoint, ban them from talking!
If you don't like what a book says, burn it!
Anyone can take a couple of years to get work experience & train before attending college. The fact 17-18 year old feel the need to go straight to college is on them.
No complaints about the age of the BYU runners until they win the NCAA meet and it is suddenly an issue? They have been competing at the NCAA meet for over 50 years and now you think it is an issue?
Go back to Flagstaff and cry in your soup, at least you won't choke on the soup.
Way to change the subject wrote:
BYU Football wrote:
I sure don't hear anyone complaining about BYU's football team being older than everyone else. Perhaps that is because the football team at BYU is pretty crappy. Now if they were winning???
We're talking about CROSS COUNTRY. Not football. We're talking about CROSS COUNTRY!
It's CROSS COUNTRY. Not football. We're talking about CROSS COUNTRY season.
The point is, nobody cares until they start winning.
Taking 2 years to put on weight and get out of shape is not an advantage, especially when many of their athletes can't even get back into high school shape after a mission. This is their first XC national championship, so clearly the age/maturity advantage hasn't been that beneficial.
How does walking and biking twenty miles a day in third World countries lead to weight gain?
Gwalkerruns wrote:
How does walking and biking twenty miles a day in third World countries lead to weight gain?
I don’t know if a missionary has ever walked 20 miles in a day. Biking 20 miles a day (probably still rare) - an elite runner can absolutely gain weight. It’s easy math. Calories in > calories out = weight gain. However, I biked maybe 10 days of my mission. I drove in a Chevy Malibu for the rest of my days. Besides, weight gain is one variable in delaying ones running success. Not running for 2 years, but coming back the same weight, you’re still gonna take a while to get back in running shape.
Gwalkerruns wrote:
How does walking and biking twenty miles a day in third World countries lead to weight gain?
Low intensity walking and biking will not yield weight loss. They are busy 12-16 hrs a day, eating many fattening foods offered by hosts. All of them put on weight. Most cannot run a single 6 mins mile when they get back weighing 170-220 pounds. Long road back! Verdict -2 year mission, age advantage nullified by losing 2 years of fitness. Naysayers, please recognize this.
Hardloper wrote:
Another numbskull wrote:
No, everyone does NOT have the same choice to do whatever they want to do for two years.
Not everyone wants to be a war monger, a Mormon, or a racist pig. Get a freaking life, loser.
The only thing they're dedicated to is bending the rules in their favor.
Actually yes anyone can graduate high school, run 100 mpw for 2 years (or 5 years), then enroll in college and have 5 full years of eligibility.
You ever go on a mission to a third world country? I don't think that's what they do.
Not everyone serves in a third-world country. I was in the US. A lot of missionaries gain weight. Some, like me, lost weight (I stopped lifting weights during my mission and lost 15 pounds of muscle--my metabolism was too fast at that point of my life to get fat). Anyway, half of my mission, I had a car. And the other half, I was in small geographic areas. I never came close to walking more than a few miles at the most, and I think I used a bike for a grand total of like two days.
what year is it?? wrote:
No complaints about the age of the BYU runners until they win the NCAA meet and it is suddenly an issue?
It's always been an issue, which you would know if you weren't such an idiot.
Hardloper wrote:
Actually yes anyone can graduate high school, run 100 mpw for 2 years (or 5 years), then enroll in college and have 5 full years of eligibility.
Wrong again. Not everyone can graduate FROM high school, go to junior college for 6 months, drop out and work full time for the next two years, then go back and still compete in the NCAA for 6 more years until they're 28 years of age.
No one can do that, unless they're a Mormon at BYU or some other Mormon type institution.
Wrong again. wrote:
Hardloper wrote:
Actually yes anyone can graduate high school, run 100 mpw for 2 years (or 5 years), then enroll in college and have 5 full years of eligibility.
Wrong again. Not everyone can graduate FROM high school, go to junior college for 6 months, drop out and work full time for the next two years, then go back and still compete in the NCAA for 6 more years until they're 28 years of age.
No one can do that, unless they're a Mormon at BYU or some other Mormon type institution.
Wait, which BYU XC guy is 28? Seriously name one. Or name one that EVER was that old? You can’t. Don’t exaggerate if you’re trying to be taken seriously.
And anyone CAN graduate from high school, delay their start to college for 2+ years (while training) and then enter at an older age, without having had to focus on a mission and get out of shape for that period of time. If it’s such an advantage, do it.
Poor at Math? wrote:
Wrong again. wrote:
Wrong again. Not everyone can graduate FROM high school, go to junior college for 6 months, drop out and work full time for the next two years, then go back and still compete in the NCAA for 6 more years until they're 28 years of age.
No one can do that, unless they're a Mormon at BYU or some other Mormon type institution.
Wait, which BYU XC guy is 28? Seriously name one. Or name one that EVER was that old? You can’t. Don’t exaggerate if you’re trying to be taken seriously.
And anyone CAN graduate from high school, delay their start to college for 2+ years (while training) and then enter at an older age, without having had to focus on a mission and get out of shape for that period of time. If it’s such an advantage, do it.
Good idea. I think I would like to start high school at age 18 and finish at 22. That is a tremendous idea. Being a state champion is so very important even if I look ridiculous. It is the most important thing in life. Thank you.
sir_hobbyjog wrote:
Way to change the subject wrote:
We're talking about CROSS COUNTRY. Not football. We're talking about CROSS COUNTRY!
It's CROSS COUNTRY. Not football. We're talking about CROSS COUNTRY season.
The point is, nobody cares until they start winning.
Taking 2 years to put on weight and get out of shape is not an advantage, especially when many of their athletes can't even get back into high school shape after a mission. This is their first XC national championship, so clearly the age/maturity advantage hasn't been that beneficial.
Two things
1) people complain about this every year,. This year their age seems more extreme than is typical though.
2) the whole they come back out of shape and 40lbs Helier is a bunch of crap. I’ve know several guys who have gone on a mission. They came back the same weight and while not in competitive running shape they weren’t horribly out of shape either.
The simple fix is to come up with a new religion so all who desire can take two years off . It won’t be any more made up than any of the others
Anyone can do it for religious purposes or for military service. You don't have to be mormon. The newest made up religion is climate change. The followers are crazy and the religion should be squashed before the followers begin to harm people.
Tee Totatler wrote:
Stopme99 wrote:
BYU runners can buy their own liquor. NAU has to have someone by it for them.
I'm pretty sure that BYU runners did not buy any alcohol last night or any night for that matter.
They may celebrated with some caffeinated beverages, but again, most likely not. They live a very clean lifestyle.
Yeah you can’t go to heaven if you have caffeine so that’s a no
BYU Football wrote:
I sure don't hear anyone complaining about BYU's football team being older than everyone else. Perhaps that is because the football team at BYU is pretty crappy. Now if they were winning???
Oh there are definitely people who complain about any age advantage and it's not limited to BYU.
Air Force Academy's football coach complained about USU football taking advantage of that. I could be wrong, but the few RMs that USU football has seem to have contributed very little.
Fans on the SDSU fan boards were complaining about USU basketball cheating by using the mission exception.
Personally I think that the current rules are reasonable because I think that it is a really big gamble for a program to take on these kids and it's not a rule that only applies to BYU.
Any coach can try to recruit these kids, so while BYU benefits the most there's nothing stopping anyone else from trying to recruit LDS kids.
For one thing I think they're a pain to recruit and to plan for. Many of them change their mindset while on the mission and transfer. If you're a coach looking at these kids you're also going to have to be thinking three or so years into the future.
On the individual level it is a huge gamble.
If things go well then it can be a huge advantage, but too often it just doesn't work out.
Three of my high school teammates served a mission and ran college xc.
One ran as expected after his mission. One struggled for two years before hanging up his spikes. He went from being a teams #4 runner to a non-contributer.
One never ran again.
Of the missionaries I served with that were college athlete one went on to have a normal career (long jumper) and the other got a parasite, lost a hundred pounds and couldn't even walk onto a JC football team.
Two modifications to the rules would be good.
1. The athlete on leave shall only be in contact with his college coach.
BYU is notorious for trying to poach them while on their mission. I really resent that because I believe it to be BYU hypocrisy. It's a reason why many of their own faith dislike them, including myself.
2. It shall cost them one year of eligibility.
They'll get 3 typical years, 1 redshirt, 1 medical redshirt.
If I were the AD at BYU, I'd get in front of this controversy and basically say that working with these recently returned missionaries has its advantages and disadvantages. Any one is free to try it themselves. In fact because we have so much experience with it we'll publish a guide to help you help your athletes navigate coming home and getting ready to compete again.
Honestly I don't think that the mission is BYU's biggest advantage. Their biggest advantage is their club/farm team.
Ghost1 wrote:
FrenchDawg wrote:
Until they start restricting the amount of time missionaries can spend in competition, any victory they achieve will be hollow and meaningless.
The irony is that the 2 year mission is a disadvantage, not a plus. All those missionaries come back to campus 2 years older, but out of shape and 40 pounds heavier. It can take them 6-8 months to get back to their previous level, some never get back to the same level.
Those guys are super humble and modest. If it were really an advantage, those guys would opt out.
What twilight fantasy world do you live in? The only time I have heard of a missionary coming back FAT is if a girl came back married and pregnant. Most missionaries I've known are biking all over the place in their starched shirts, dress slacks and ties and come back plenty fit. The concept that these missionaries are sitting around eating fried chicken and jello salad while not lifting a finger for two years is patently false. If anything, a couple years away from rigorous running specific training with as much mileage as they have kids running in high school nowadays is probably a boon as it eliminates a lot of overuse issues.