For the people who actually read the USADA panel reports

Because you would have to believe that Dr. Brown was prescribing those medicines for a legitimate condition when it comes to certain athletes only and not an off-label use as Magness testified to. So there's this sound medical expertise in one area and then the total abandonment of it when it comes to... l-carnitine.

Jack Frost wrote:

Oh, please. If the brojos want to use my IP address and "out" my location you'd see I'm thousands of miles away from Beaverton.

I am currently posting from a server 300 miles away. A bit later today will switch to one 2000 miles away to watch the Doha events from Eastern "Canada".

What are you saying wrote:

Jack Frost wrote:

I will say it is hilarious to watch runners I know to be on synthetic thyroid to feign indignation over the Salazar-Brown connection. Especially the ones who visited and are current patients of Brown. To the masses that must not matter much because some are in the "good" category and the rest are apparently Sith Lords who cannot possibly have nearly 99.9% in common, pharmaceutically, with their athletic peers.

Why do you think that is hilarious? Thyroid medications are not banned substances.

Fake prescriptions for unneeded medications are banned. Spirit of Sport in theWADA Code.

You are IGNORANT wrote:

You cannot read wrote:

L-carnitine is allowed in any amount you want.

Nope.

The WADA code limits IV infusions and/or injections to 50 ml over a 6-hour period.

https://www.letsrun.com/news/2017/05/usada-appears-highly-likely-6-nop-athletes-including-galen-rupp-dathan-ritzenhein-violated-anti-doping-rules/

Well, it is now 100ml over a 12 hour period, but close enough.

The IV infusion or injection is a prohibited method under the WADA code. The presence or absence of L-Carnitine is entirely irrelevant.

There is probably a practical limit of how much L-carnitine you can put in a 50 or 100ml drip, but it is not regulated by WADA.

fake brown wrote:

Fake prescriptions for unneeded medications are banned. Spirit of Sport in theWADA Code.

False. This was argued before the panel and explicitly covered in the decision. According to the panel, applying precedents, they are not going to get into regulating the practice of medicine with substances that are not explicitly prohibited.

you can't read wrote:

You are IGNORANT wrote:

Nope.

The WADA code limits IV infusions and/or injections to 50 ml over a 6-hour period.

https://www.letsrun.com/news/2017/05/usada-appears-highly-likely-6-nop-athletes-including-galen-rupp-dathan-ritzenhein-violated-anti-doping-rules/

Well, it is now 100ml over a 12 hour period, but close enough.

RETARD. IT WAS 50 ml over a 6-hour period when the investigation started.

You are IGNORANT wrote

RETARD. IT WAS 50 ml over a 6-hour period when the investigation started.

I hope you are not a grown man posting like this.

Jack Frost is making a clear point: that l-carnitine is not a banned substance and there is no limit as to how much l-carnitine an athlete can take (probably because it doesn’t work).

There is a limit of how much fluid can be infused over a certain period of time. This probably imposes an indirect limit of l-Carnitine as you can only create so concentrated a solution.

What is interesting is how so many people on the board are calling this “doping” and other pejorative terms. The infusion limit rule was not put into place to prevent higher volumes of vitamin solutions being infused.

I don’t doubt that a number of NOP athletes had higher than allowed infusions of L-Carnitine as Salazar seems obsessed with pseudoscience.

I also don’t have a problem with Salazar being banned. He knowingly broke a rule and went to lengths to cover it up. He is not operating at a high ethical standard and is probably bad for the sport.

What I do have a problem with is the sensationalism on this website and in the message boards posts. There is such extreme vitriol being hurled at NOP when there are SO many other people guilty of similar or worse offences. There are a number of active US athletes who have seen Dr. Brown who has also shown his disregard for a reasonable ethical standard.

Dhdjdjsjdjs wrote:

I hope you are not a grown man posting like this.

You certainly are not a man, Jack Frost and all the temporary names you are posting under.

You are an obvious Nike shill.

Jak Frost wrote:

Dhdjdjsjdjs wrote:

I hope you are not a grown man posting like this.

You certainly are not a man, Jack Frost and all the temporary names you are posting under.

You are an obvious Nike shill.

Thank you for addressing my points. It has really added a lot to the discussion.

ps. Not Jack Frost and not a Nike employee. Not even American.

You are IGNORANT wrote:

RETARD. IT WAS 50 ml over a 6-hour period when the investigation started.

Well, I'm just gonna quote the decision for you:

B. Applicable Rules

1. Lex Mitior

4.7 Lex mitior rests on the principle whereby a criminal law applies as soon as it

comes into force if it is more favorable to the accused. See Advisory Opinion

CAS 94/128, UCI and CONI (Jan. 5, 1995). This principle applies to antidoping regulations in light of the disciplinary nature of the penalties that they

allow to be imposed. Id. By virtue of this principle, the body responsible for

setting the punishment must enable the individual convicted of a doping

violation to benefit from the new provisions, assumed to be less severe, even

when the events in question occurred before they came into force.

The last time Doc Brown was in the news like this he had just turned a DeLorean into a time machine.

Jack Frost wrote:

Does it bother anyone else that the entire doping violation hinges upon Magness, who was employed by Nike in a coaching capacity, meeting the USADA definition of an athlete?

Where did you get that information?

This is what I found:

Following two evidentiary hearings, Salazar’s lasting seven days and Brown’s lasting six days, and a lengthy post-hearing review of all the evidence and testimony, the AAA panel found that Salazar and Brown trafficked testosterone, a banned performance-enhancing

Salazar AAA Decision

Salazar Decision

substance, administered a prohibited IV infusion, and engaged in tampering to attempt to prevent relevant information about their conduct from being learned by USADA.

The panel determined that Salazar committed the following violations of the Code:

Administration of a Prohibited Method (with respect to an infusion in excess of the applicable limit),

Tampering and/or attempted tampering with the doping control process, and

Trafficking of testosterone through involvement in a testosterone testing program in violation of the rules.

There is a bounty of evidence and testimony outside of just Magness that was considered when levying the ban.

Review what is contained in just the interim report that was leaked back in 2017. After having read it in nearly it's entirety (pretty interesting read) It's pretty damning if you ask me.

Everyone here acting like this is some big bombshell (and not 5 years old) should be taking TONS of L-Carnitine!

In your eyes, the stuff must be magic sauce!

Sounds like Magness is butt buddies with Alsal