Strongest American distance record

Todd Williams 15K 42:22 March 1995.

Men's mile. Just because the mile is just not run much any more and never as a time trial more as a curiosity event. I can see Lagat's 3:29 being broken. Maybe Lagat's 12:53 ahead of the mile as there is really nobody on the horizon that can threaten that. Johnny Gray's 1:42.60 is 34 years old but I think Brazier can threaten that.

Don't think Webb could have done any damage as a 5/10k track runner. At the end of his career he was training with Schumacher to transition to the 5k but couldn't handle the mileage.

Devil Dog wrote:

I see 1:42, 3:27, 3:46, 7:29, 12:53, and 26:44 being unbreakable by any living American.

You don't think Brazier can run a second faster?

I think I like Jager in the Steeple but that 2k at 4:52 seems pretty solid to me even though it is not often raced.

29’ 4 1/4”, the DISTANCE Mike Powell long jumped in 1991. The WR for this event has only changed once in the past 51 years after changing 9 times in 8 years between 1960 and 1968.

Les wrote:

I can see Lagat's 3:29 being broken.

The 1500m NR is 3:27.40, not 3:29.

westsouthrunner wrote:

Our current fastest milers are

Gregorek:

3:49

1:47

14:12

Engels :

3:51

1:44

14:20

blankenship

1:47

3:52

13:33

Centro-we know he is a championship racer

I can't think of anyone else honestly that is a a citizen. CLayton murphy and Brazier dont have the strength.

The only way this record gets broken soon is if Cheserek becomes a citizen in my opinion. I know he is worth more than the 1:49 and he has been proven to run 3:49 indoors and has run faster than webb in the 5000.

Kinda incredible that you just automatically discount Centro on the basis of being a "championship racer, despite him having run faster than Big Ben's mile pb FIVE times, faster than his 1500m best NINE times and SIX times under 3:33 (equiv to Johnny's 3:49.98). Centro has always seemed akin to Willis in ability and style. I don't doubt that he still has the ability to go 3:30 in the right race.

Let's be honest about your hypothetical three (despite my hope that one of them could break some records):

- Gregorek being relatively inconsistent. His 3:49 was great, but an outlier compared to the rest of his races and is only worth 3:32.9. He's only two years younger than Centro.

- Engles still has not broken through with a real 1500m. 3:35 and 3:52y are basically Murphy's PRs, whom you discount as not having "strength" ??? 1:42 and a Bronze don't show strength??? Anyways, I love the Craig, and he seems to have the most upside, but he's a long ways out right now.

- Big Ben is a bit long in the tooth - he's a year older than Centro fwiw. Dude has guts, but reminds me of Ben True - always waiting to break through.

- King Ches. Probably? Maybe? Not sure if he's going to become a sub-3:30 roller or just going to run some 5000m at Chelimo's limit, then move up.

Wrong.

Lagat kept his US citizenship a secret because revealing it would have made him ineligible to compete in the 2004 Olympics because of the rules regarding changing the country your represent in competition.

Bad Wigins wrote:

8 flat is not even close to the strongest! That is beaten by at least a couple runners worldwide most years.

Even if Lagat counts, both his 3:27 and his 12:53 have been beaten since he ran them.

But 26:44 has not been bettered in the 5 years since Rupp ran it! Even the Ethiopians can't touch it, and they've been trying. He's the only US distance runner to have done this recently.

You know nothing about the sport.

There are many opportunities for elites to run a fast 1500 or 5000 every year, and yet 12:53 is still rare. 3:27 is incredibly rare.

There are very, very few opportunities to run a fast 10,000, and most of "the Ethiopians" can't be bothered. Running a world-leading 10,000 in 2019 is like running a world-leading 10-miler. Literally nobody cares. There are many half marathons every year more impressive than a 26:44.

Rick Wohlhuter’s 1000m?? Longest standing. 1000m isn’t raced often but people have tried. Murphy tried a couple years ago and didn’t come close.

Deena’s 2:19 thon is probably second to Wilson’s 1:55 on the women’s side. No American woman has come within a minute and there’s been Flanagan, goucher, hasay, huddle, cragg and linden. WC medalists, majors winners, AR holders at other distances, in superior footwear

The 3:27 by Lagat is such a BS record. I know the rule, but I think it’s stupid. He ran for Kenya at the Olympics. He couldn’t run for the US but he gets the record. Makes no sense.

Doesn’t Kenya not allow dual citizenship? He should get either the Olympic medal or the AR but not both.

Angel's Pulse wrote:

[quote]westsouthrunner wrote:

Our current fastest milers are

Gregorek:

3:49

1:47

14:12

Engels :

3:51

1:44

14:20

blankenship

1:47

3:52

13:33

Centro-we know he is a championship racer

I can't think of anyone else honestly that is a a citizen. CLayton murphy and Brazier dont have the strength.

The only way this record gets broken soon is if Cheserek becomes a citizen in my opinion. I know he is worth more than the 1:49 and he has been proven to run 3:49 indoors and has run faster than webb in the 5000.

Kinda incredible that you just automatically discount Centro on the basis of being a "championship racer, despite him having run faster than Big Ben's mile pb FIVE times, faster than his 1500m best NINE times and SIX times under 3:33 (equiv to Johnny's 3:49.98). Centro has always seemed akin to Willis in ability and style. I don't doubt that he still has the ability to go 3:30 in the right race.

Let's be honest about your hypothetical three (despite my hope that one of them could break some records):

- Gregorek being relatively inconsistent. His 3:49 was great, but an outlier compared to the rest of his races and is only worth 3:32.9. He's only two years younger than Centro.

- Engles still has not broken through with a real 1500m. 3:35 and 3:52y are basically Murphy's PRs, whom you discount as not having "strength" ??? 1:42 and a Bronze don't show strength??? Anyways, I love the Craig, and he seems to have the most upside, but he's a long ways out right now.

- Big Ben is a bit long in the tooth - he's a year older than Centro fwiw. Dude has guts, but reminds me of Ben True - always waiting to break through.

- King Ches. Probably? Maybe? Not sure if he's going to become a sub-3:30 roller or just going to run some 5000m at Chelimo's limit, then move up.[/quote

I feel like when Centro runs his fast time he is getting like 10th place(mainly just thinking of Monaco). I know he fast but he doesn't really seem driven by times. After winning a Olympic title I'd be chasing some records. Not much else to do. But I do know he's a threat to the 3:29. He just might get like 7th place when doing it

What if we just split the difference between Lagat's 3:27 and 3:29 and consider 3:28 to be the mark to beat for Americans?

Devil Dog wrote:

Rupp will get the half marathon and the marathon.

Jager could break his 8:00 (but I doubt it). I don't see anyone else breaking it.

I see 1:42, 3:27, 3:46, 7:29, 12:53, and 26:44 being unbreakable by any living American.

Short of another Kenyan re-writing the books, those records are very safe. And even if another great future Kenyan-American attacks them, Lagat is one of the all-time great Kenyan born runners...it would take a generational athlete to break any of those records.

I don't know anything about the women's records to comment.

Rupp won't be getting any PRs from here on out. No chance. However, he went several seconds under Hall's full 'thon time so depending on whether you consider mercenaries become citizens as adults (like all the Lagat discussion here) then he could already have that one. Just saying he ain't going faster in the future.

Jager also ain't breaking his steeple PR. Funny that the poster is pointing at dudes who can maybe walk without crutches as potential record breakers. The half and full records have survived attacks from a host of talent including Rupp and various Kenyan mercenaries. The 2000 record is intriguing though. What percentage slower is it from El G's (probably never broken) record?

Prime Hall>Olympic Rupp??

Assuming Rupp at the olympics was his marathon prime.

I am not the biggest Rupp fan but I could see him going for the record somewhere fast like Berlin. All provided he is 100 percent healthy.

Regarding " I see 1:42, 3:27, 3:46, 7:29, 12:53, and 26:44 being unbreakable by any living American. "

that 7:29 is the one that would go first. Hill was 1 second off and Jager/Chelimo are close as well.

I am not interested in any records set by athletes who switched countries. Lagat competed in two Olympic games for Kenya, so in my book, his records will always count for Kenya. What is the strongest men's US record if you exclude the mercenary athletes?

Hshdhshah wrote:

The 3:27 by Lagat is such a BS record. I know the rule, but I think it’s stupid. He ran for Kenya at the Olympics. He couldn’t run for the US but he gets the record. Makes no sense.

Doesn’t Kenya not allow dual citizenship? He should get either the Olympic medal or the AR but not both.

Yes, Kenya doesn’t allow dual citizenship. Had Lagat revealed his naturalization, he would’ve been forced to compete for the US, triggering the transfer period. He would’ve been excluded from the ‘04 Olympics.

Instead, he ran for Kenya, was allowed to retain his silver medal, and was excluded from the lesser ‘05 WCs. He lied by omission and the rules simply were not enforced.

Lagat’s 3:27.40 is not the AR, that’s still his 3:29.30. There is a difference between a NR (national record) and an AR (area record). Lagat’s 3:27.40 is the rightful NR per USATF rules but he should be retroactively DQed from ‘04 per AK and IAAF rules. He doesn’t have the AR because NACAC and USATF have different rules.