What happened to barefoot, minimalist, Vibram as the cure for everything that ails the runner?

Really wrote:

Are there any primates that can cover 100 meters faster than say 11-12 seconds? Any that can cover a mile in 5 or 6 minutes?

Maybe our speed came from escape needs, our endurance from foraging, and uprightness from reaching for high fruit , instead of climbing, sort or like the evolution of the giraffes neck. That doesn't preclude persistence hunting at some point necessarily. But maybe persistence hunting potential became a side benefit rather than a cause?

Or maybe they became bipedal in order to be able to prance and dance in the pursuit of a more gender-fluid, antiheteronormative society for all? The patriarchy of white male apes was oppressive and our ancestors were driven to flit out across the open spaces, throwing poopoo back at their fascist-repressive opposition.

Simian Soviet wrote:

Really wrote:

Are there any primates that can cover 100 meters faster than say 11-12 seconds? Any that can cover a mile in 5 or 6 minutes?

Maybe our speed came from escape needs, our endurance from foraging, and uprightness from reaching for high fruit , instead of climbing, sort or like the evolution of the giraffes neck. That doesn't preclude persistence hunting at some point necessarily. But maybe persistence hunting potential became a side benefit rather than a cause?

Or maybe they became bipedal in order to be able to prance and dance in the pursuit of a more gender-fluid, antiheteronormative society for all? The patriarchy of white male apes was oppressive and our ancestors were driven to flit out across the open spaces, throwing poopoo back at their fascist-repressive opposition.

This is stupid^^^but we there must have been a chain of improvement if persistence hunting was part of our evolution. Like we started off with grubs , graduated to reptiles and amphibians( the non-poisonous ones) , and worked our way up through the levels of pace to the gazelle.

I tried it but nowadays I only run minimalist style when spending some time on clean beaches, preferably barefoot, and nice and easy, jogging.

Why does it matter how fast other primates can move? Are you asking about our most recent primate cousin, the ape? They're arboreal and damn good at escaping in trees. We're not arboreal (we've got a vestigial palmaris longus, which only alludes to our arboreal roots). Same saltatorial primates (like lemurs) can move fast over short distances, but they don't eat us so it doesn't matter here. You'd want to know if our predators could run faster than us at short distances and if being in a pack was enough of a deterrent to avoid predation by those big predators. And I agree that early forms of persistence type hunting would've been a benefit of an itinerant lifestyle but once developed could've been a selective pressure to further enhance our endurance capacity and modern physiology.

It matters how fast they move because they don't persistence hunt , and therefore as related species, we could have been relatively fast / good travelers prior to further possible physical and cultural adaptations for persistence hunting. That's all. Helps to decide how influential persistence hunting might or might not have been in our evolution.

That’s all theory on top of speculation on top of guesswork. To think otherwise is foolish and naive.

Similar story here. Flexible shoes help my Achilles.

Yeah, forget that. I've chased pronghorn for over 16 miles on a long run in Utah. Not a chance in hell you are getting one without some long range weapon. They are out of sight in a flash every time you get close. Persistence hunting is just wishful thinking.

Pronghorn is one of the absolute worst animals to attempt to persostence hunt. Target choice is a major part of success in hunting, and pronghorn in their optimal habitat ain't it.

Here is what our ancestors were doing:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=826HMLoiE_o

Anyone who denies this is the essence of our human origins is in the same league with Bible thumpers who insist the Earth is only 7000 years old.

YMMV wrote:

As far as the man v. horse, there is an annual race in wales that pits humans v. horses on a 21 mile xc course. Horses usually win, but British men have won twice. It would be interesting if top African runners were competing this, which woud increase the number of "human wins".

And what if you had the elite of the horse world compete? Again, the 100 mile record for a horse is half of the 100 mile record for a human. Half! Horses are better runners.

So much discussion about the totally understandable micro-evolution of our species reminds me of the problems I've had in my first semester in college. I asked one professor to explain macro-evolution as in the generation of life from non-living elements especially after the big bang which generated temps in the millions of degrees. I asked another prof about the much larger warming and cooling trends before industrialization.

Both academics came to my dorm room, told me I needed to get my mind right, informed me that I had a gender issue and tried to peg me. I did not pay 60k for this. Am I wrong?

elephino wrote:

YMMV wrote:

As far as the man v. horse, there is an annual race in wales that pits humans v. horses on a 21 mile xc course. Horses usually win, but British men have won twice. It would be interesting if top African runners were competing this, which woud increase the number of "human wins".

And what if you had the elite of the horse world compete? Again, the 100 mile record for a horse is half of the 100 mile record for a human. Half! Horses are better runners.

Being fast and covering terrain are two different things. I assure you that this untalented old man, if allowed to pick the course, can beat any horse you should choose for the task ;)

YMMV wrote:

elephino wrote:

And what if you had the elite of the horse world compete? Again, the 100 mile record for a horse is half of the 100 mile record for a human. Half! Horses are better runners.

Being fast and covering terrain are two different things. I assure you that this untalented old man, if allowed to pick the course, can beat any horse you should choose for the task ;)

Horses are much larger and run quite differently. Of course you could pick a course where a human could win. A squirrel could beat a horse if it were allowed to pick the course. How about we let the horse pick?

Had never heard of the Kilkenny. Tried a pair from RW. Sent them back because of the fit (holy narrow toe box, Batman), but still glad to know of another option out there. (It never shows up in search results on RW.)

So, thanks, HRE :-)

Just a dopey college student wrote:

So much discussion about the totally understandable micro-evolution of our species reminds me of the problems I've had in my first semester in college. I asked one professor to explain macro-evolution as in the generation of life from non-living elements especially after the big bang which generated temps in the millions of degrees. I asked another prof about the much larger warming and cooling trends before industrialization.

Both academics came to my dorm room, told me I needed to get my mind right, informed me that I had a gender issue and tried to peg me. I did not pay 60k for this. Am I wrong?

This is perhaps the best post I've ever read.