Holy Cr!*: This is the most shocking thing about track I've learned in a long time-OJ Simpson was on a 4x1 World Record Team

By the way, does anyone know a reliable site that lists yards world records? Found a few pages but couldn't find mile relay records.

Google seems to be directing "mile relay" and "4 x 440 relay" searches to 4x400 relay results which made it harder to find a good source of records.

Also, the Wikipedia page for 4 x 400 metres relay hasn't been updated from Poland yet in case one of you want to do so:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4_%C3%97_400_metres_relay

wejo wrote:

My apologies for the Rojo type thread but I was reading the thread about USC not getting the world record despite running faster than anyone else ever before with 4 US born runners on the team and there was this nugget of info by poster Ghost of Igloi:

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=8713149#8713350

"That is correct, if memory serves me well USC had the 440 Yard Relay World Record with Fred Kuller, Earl McCullough, OJ Simpson, and Lennox Miller (Jamaica), about 1968."

And a link to this article:

http://articles.latimes.com/1987-06-17/sports/sp-4512_1_years-ago-today

I'm flabbergasted. Can't believe I or no one else with LetsRun knew this.

Was the yards record way slower than the meters record or was this legit?

Well Wejo, it was only on OJ's wikipedia page

Cottonshirt wrote:

NCAA 4 x 110yds Prov, UT 17 Jun 1967

1. Southern California 38.4

Earl McCullouch, Fred Kuller, O.J. Simpson, Lennox Miller

NCAA 100m Provo, UT 16 Jun 1967

6. O.J. Simpson SO Southern California 10.38

(Charlie Green was 1st 9.21, 2nd Lennox Miller 9.32)

NCAA 4 x 110yds Berkeley, CA 15 Jun 1968

1. Southern California 39.3

Earl McCullouch, Fred Kuller, O.J. Simpson, Lennox Miller

cheers.

Why was the relay Provo 1967 in yards but the 100 dash was in meters?

kibitzer wrote:

I believe the whole point is that the relay OJ was on did NOT set a "world record"--they ran a world *best*.

And who knows how fast OJ might have been if his legs had been straight and not shaped like parentheses?

Not ratified as world record because Lennox Miller was not from same nation. Essentially an all-star team.

harry wales wrote:

[quote]wejo wrote:

Well Wejo, it was only on OJ's wikipedia page

Looks like it's on McCullouch's wiki page as well.

Every NFL game OJ played the announcers talked about it....

If you are under the age of 45, no reason you would intuitively know this...

Watch him walk down LaVar Burton in 'Roots'.....

OJ could fly.

In 1984, when both were booth announcers for ABC at the Oly Trials, OJ easily beat Marty Liquori running up the stairs at the Coliseum after a lunch break. Marty was gassed and OJ was laughing. OJ probably weighed at least 50 pounds more than Marty at the time.

harry wales wrote:

Cottonshirt wrote:

NCAA 4 x 110yds Prov, UT 17 Jun 1967

1. Southern California 38.4

Earl McCullouch, Fred Kuller, O.J. Simpson, Lennox Miller

NCAA 100m Provo, UT 16 Jun 1967

6. O.J. Simpson SO Southern California 10.38

(Charlie Green was 1st 9.21, 2nd Lennox Miller 9.32)

NCAA 4 x 110yds Berkeley, CA 15 Jun 1968

1. Southern California 39.3

Earl McCullouch, Fred Kuller, O.J. Simpson, Lennox Miller

cheers.

Why was the relay Provo 1967 in yards but the 100 dash was in meters?

~1968 was when colleges were converting over from running yards to meters. The 100m conversion was easier to do on a 440y track. Ovals had not yet be redone from yards to meters.

1968 wrote:

harry wales wrote:

Why was the relay Provo 1967 in yards but the 100 dash was in meters?

~1968 was when colleges were converting over from running yards to meters. The 100m conversion was easier to do on a 440y track. Ovals had not yet be redone from yards to meters.

It wasn't just a slight conversion from 220yds. to 200m. If you recall, those 440 yd. tracks had very long straightaways. 220 yard straightaway was an event. The 440 yard dash was a one turn stagger race. Also, the 180 yard hurdle race.

The Fokus wrote: I knew Greene and Miller were fast but they were faster than Usain!

this is what it says on the results sheet I found at the USACCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCT&F coaches website.

Finals: Fri 6/16

1 Charlie GREENE SR Nebraska 9.21

2 Lennox MILLER SO Southern California 9.32

3 Bob ROVERE SR ETSU 10.27cA (y100) (1.5)

4 Fred KULLER SO Southern California 10.31cA (y100) (1.5)

5 Jerry BRIGHT SO Arizona State 10.32cA (y100) (1.5)

6 O.J. SIMPSON SO Southern California 10.38cA (y100) (1.5)

7 Jim LEE SR Maryland 10.43cA (y100) (1.5)

8 Jim FREEMAN JR Murray State 10.53cA (y100) (1.5)

make of that what you will.

cheers.

wejo wrote:

My apologies for the Rojo type thread but I was reading the thread about USC not getting the world record despite running faster than anyone else ever before with 4 US born runners on the team and there was this nugget of info by poster Ghost of Igloi:

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=8713149#8713350

"That is correct, if memory serves me well USC had the 440 Yard Relay World Record with Fred Kuller, Earl McCullough, OJ Simpson, and Lennox Miller (Jamaica), about 1968."

And a link to this article:

http://articles.latimes.com/1987-06-17/sports/sp-4512_1_years-ago-today

I'm flabbergasted. Can't believe I or no one else with LetsRun knew this.

Was the yards record way slower than the meters record or was this legit?

Cool story bro.

WDC Runner wrote:

By the way, does anyone know a reliable site that lists yards world records? Found a few pages but couldn't find mile relay records.

Google seems to be directing "mile relay" and "4 x 440 relay" searches to 4x400 relay results which made it harder to find a good source of records.

Also, the Wikipedia page for 4 x 400 metres relay hasn't been updated from Poland yet in case one of you want to do so:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4_%C3%97_400_metres_relay

Use duckduckgo.com instead of google. You'll need to click 'search only for 4x440'

Google biases your search results.

It's literally the reason the world is all fvcked up and polarised right now... right-wingers and left-wingers are both self selecting what they want to hear through social media and custom internet searches. It's why no one understands each other anymore.

Run007xx wrote:

Use duckduckgo.com instead of google. You'll need to click 'search only for 4x440'

Google biases your search results.

It's literally the reason the world is all fvcked up and polarised right now... right-wingers and left-wingers are both self selecting what they want to hear through social media and custom internet searches. It's why no one understands each other anymore.

Thanks. That actually was better. It even listed my posting in this thread. Good point about bias in what different websites and even the same websites show different people.

harry wales wrote:

Cottonshirt wrote:

NCAA 4 x 110yds Prov, UT 17 Jun 1967

1. Southern California 38.4

Earl McCullouch, Fred Kuller, O.J. Simpson, Lennox Miller

NCAA 100m Provo, UT 16 Jun 1967

6. O.J. Simpson SO Southern California 10.38

(Charlie Green was 1st 9.21, 2nd Lennox Miller 9.32)

NCAA 4 x 110yds Berkeley, CA 15 Jun 1968

1. Southern California 39.3

Earl McCullouch, Fred Kuller, O.J. Simpson, Lennox Miller

cheers.

Why was the relay Provo 1967 in yards but the 100 dash was in meters?

They should both be yards. It was 440 yd (quarter mile) track, hence 4x110yd relay was one lap around. For the open, NCAA ran 100 yds until 1976, except in Olympic years which 1967 wasn't. Also winning time of 9.21 clearly shows it has to have been 100 yds.

A confusing time in US wrote:

1968 wrote:

~1968 was when colleges were converting over from running yards to meters. The 100m conversion was easier to do on a 440y track. Ovals had not yet be redone from yards to meters.

It wasn't just a slight conversion from 220yds. to 200m. If you recall, those 440 yd. tracks had very long straightaways. 220 yard straightaway was an event. The 440 yard dash was a one turn stagger race. Also, the 180 yard hurdle race.

What I recall is that all distances that ran on the 440y track curve were kept as yards for most meets. So, 200y and up were all yards. The 100y run was replaced with the 100m run because every 440y track could do it.

I also know that besides the 220y straight run there were some meets that ran 440y with a single turn.

If you are under a certain age, this isn't the sort of thing that's common knowledge. Running down people for being young or not knowing track history is no way to pass on the lore of track.

For younger people, OJ was also famous for how fast he ran through airports-

https://youtu.be/Uqd_XZYkZ70

I was at the LA Coliseum when Simpson participated in his first track meet for USC. It was in the Spring prior to his first football season with the Trojans. He lined up for the 100 yard dash, and everyone was astounded at his size, asking who was he. He was at least 40 pounds heavier than his opponents that included Lennox Miller, Harold Busby (UCLA), and others. He didn't win, but he was close. Very impressive. Rumors circulated that he was a football transfer from San Francisco City College, and was suppose to be pretty good! Later that year he ran 9.4 for a hundred yards.

Conquest wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe OJ's 4x110 relay team STILL holds the world record. Not many chances to break the 440 relay world record these days.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cj7IYSv_BVE&sns=em

A couple things:

It WAS a WR. They were all legitimately on the USC track team. The weird citizenship rule that just surfaced did not exist at the time.

It still is a WR. It has not been broken. You cannot find a faster time listed anywhere. Guiness Book listed it for a long time. They never listed a faster time, they just stopped listing old records of unfashionable events. (HS kids note that they do NOT list either 1600 or 3200m.) 440y is farther than 400m so Bolt had already crossed the line and slowed down before he got to the 440 mark.

Is it age or a curious mind? wrote:

malmo wrote:

1) Yes , we do agree this is a rojoesque thread.

2) Yes, we do believe that no one at Letsrun knew what just about everyone born before 1970 knew.

3) This is what old guys are for. ;-)

I know about OJ's track & field talent/skills, not because I saw him participate in track & field in college, I was curious about the man in general. He isn't physically huge now and he played professional football at only 210 lbs. Every time he goes to court, tv networks show highlights of Simpson running past football competitors in a manner demonstrating superior sprinting speed. Looking up Simpson's sprinting speed is just the act of a curious person, not necessarily an older person.

Do the BroJos seem like intellectually curious people to you?

Have they ever, even accidentally, made a literary reference, or a historcal one with regard to what they read?