How to stop most school shootings 101 - Banning assault weapons does not solve the problem entirely

^This.

This is the pattern, using every disaster to clamp down on innocent people, which solves nothing and causes more disasters. The odds of anyone shooting up a school are still incredibly small, 1 in many millions, not 1 in 200, and school shootings are not a national crisis. It is just the case that our present society is so irrational (thanks in large part to public education) that millions have nothing better to do than sit around and conjure up bizarre/ridiculous social experiments.

Fgjffgj wrote:

This is the pattern, using every disaster to clamp down on innocent people, which solves nothing and causes more disasters. The odds of anyone shooting up a school are still incredibly small, 1 in many millions, not 1 in 200, and school shootings are not a national crisis. It is just the case that our present society is so irrational (thanks in large part to public education) that millions have nothing better to do than sit around and conjure up bizarre/ridiculous social experiments.

What? Is it irrational to argue that no one needs a semi-automatic weapon, large amounts of ammo, bump stocks, large capacity magazines, or the ability to evade a background check via private / gun show sales? How is that irrational when all of those things would decrease body counts (would not prevent but would mitigate death and carnage) in a mass shooting situation.

Why would any private citizen need any of the above to 1) hunt 2) provide home / property defense 3) shoot for sport when all of those things can be accomplished with a revolver, a bolt action rifle with small capacity magazines, and limited load shotguns?

There is no rational need in society for any of the items listed in my first paragraph outside of law enforcement or the military.

The whole “fighting off a tyrannical government” angle totally falls apart when one thinks critically about how civil wars and revolutions have been fought throughout the world in the modern era. Any group of citizens fighting a well armed force like the US military would need outside arms from international sources to succeed. There is no way a bunch of people armed with AR-15s and bump stocks is going to be able to fend off the US military without outside support. To argue the contrary is to argue that we need to legalize private ownership of fully automatic weapons, tanks, fighter jets, attack helicopters, and heavy artillery right NOW—because those are the weapons needed to fight off a modern military and those are the weapons typically provided from outside sources in true revolutions.

It would take many, many years for all the semi-automatic guns out there to exit private ownership if banned but that is not an argument for not acting right now.

Plus, as stated above people could still be allowed to own weapons (so second amendment still stands) that, by there very nature of needing to be reloaded frequently, would greatly reduce carnage in a mass shooting situation.

Maybe gun safety should be taught in school. Maybe there should be shooting classes in school.

You know who would oppose this? The NRA

Something that doesn't seem to get brought up as much is the media's role in all of this. By shining a spotlight on every shooting and trying to highlight who the perpetrator was, it opens the door for copycats because this idea is always on people's minds. But you know, these stories sell by preying on people's fears, so of course they need to be sensationalized and proclaimed from every outlet ad nauseum. That's what makes money. Stop dominating the news with these stories and I'd wager there'd be fewer shootings. Not none, but probably less.

Lets make murder illegal. Lets ban murder.

a man who knows wrote:

Every school is required to have a watch list of "most likely" to commit this act. Minimum of 5 kids per 1000. These kids are out placed. I'm a coach and have worked at several high schools. EVERYONE knows which kids are most likely to do something like this and the kids that would never do something like this.

The school has a pass key entry system. Nobody is allowed in the vestibule without it. Alarms sound if anyone enters the building unauthorized.

This should be a federal mandate!!!!

Without a surgical approach to this, it will happen again and again.

Agree....Guns can be bought everywhere, regulations are not the answer. Increased security IS.

Strange how so many get hyper emotional and simply blame the NRA or Trump or WHOEVER just to 'feel better'.....

And now the kids have been turned into political tools by the Dems.

Lets use logic and not emotion to solve this problem.

John Utah wrote:

Lets make murder illegal. Lets ban murder.

Why even bother regulating murder? Murder is illegal and people still get murdered all the time! Our murder regulations are ineffective and don’t address the REAL issues underlying our murder problem. We shouldn’t politicize murder, it’s too soon. We should turn to prayer.

vdfbdfbb wrote:

The gun problem extends beyond school shootings.

A good point.

There is no ONE solution to this problem.

It is interesting what the secret service found back in 2002 when it looked at school shootings.

https://scientificamerican.com/article/if-you-want-to-know-how-to-stop-school-shootings-ask-the-secret-service/

A key here is that several people warned the authorities so that part has improved (that is people telling).

The same has been said about airport security. At some point you do what you can. If a person is waiting outside the school, he may be visible. At least in the schools my kids go to or have gone to, if someone is hanging around outside for too long, someone will call the cops.

We should ban school shootings- period end of story. Just flat out make 'em illegal!!

First I think you mean the AR15.

Second, rifles are used in a small percentage of all murders. Yes the AR15 (or its cousins) are involved in mass shootings but then it is also the most popular rifle in the country and even then a tiny percentage are used in the commission of crimes. The vast majority are used lawfully.

Finally, a really good way to turn someone off of listening to your viewpoint is by calling your opponent names whether it be right wing gun nut or bedwetting liberals. You immediately are getting someone to tune you out.

That article about the secret service is really good, but with regard to this last incident the boxes were all checked, it's just that authorities failed at every point where intervention would have warranted.

Go through that list and that kid meets almost all the criteria, but what good does it do to identify these people if nothing get done?

The gun show "loophole" is not really much of a loophole...

http://thefederalist.com/2015/10/07/7-gun-control-myths-that-just-wont-die/

I believe since this article was posted more states have been added to the list of states requiring a background check.

One thing that does need to be addressed is straw buyers, but I do not think that has been an issue with the mass school shootings. The shooter either stole the weapons (Newtown) or purchased them legally. The Texas Church one was a failure by someone to include the shooter in the database and hopefully that has been fixed.

A good point..... wrote:

vdfbdfbb wrote:

The gun problem extends beyond school shootings.

A good point.

How so? Gun crime is down. But suicide is a bigger issue than homicide. Another reason our mental health system needs some work.

I know this is Wikipedia, but it jives with the FBI stats and is presented in a much cleaner format.

not a gun guy wrote:

Maybe gun safety should be taught in school. Maybe there should be shooting classes in school.

You know who would oppose this? The NRA

Ummmmmmmmmmm. No the NRA would not.

I know of only 1 case where a NRA member has been found guilty of murder. Considering 5 million members (and how many millions more in previous years) that seems to be a pretty low percentage.

It's hilarious to watch Americans come up with all these ridiculous an complicated ways of stopping school shootings... The solution is very obvious to anyone living outside the USA.

a man who knows wrote:

doesn't work that way wrote:

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "out placed," but basically it sounds like you're saying that we should punish a significant portion of the population regardless of whether they've committed a crime. Is that what you're saying?

It's time to act. Mainstreaming potential killers is not going to work.

Punished no. Placed in a facility that can help them yes. In the meantime they can not harm anyone. that works for everyone, even them.

This is brilliant. But I do have one question. Once we identify the 5 of out 1000, when does the cycle start over? Do we do this excercise, once a year, once a semester, once a quarter, or once a week? I can see pros and cons of each.