What are the criteria used to decide NXN at-large teams?

runeast22 wrote:

Confused to as why Desert Vista was selected?!?!??? Odd.

Yes. Midwest deserved one, NY deserved one, and CA deserved another before Southwest deserved two.

^

Desert Vista beat Southlake Carroll at Woodbridge. El Paso beat both SLC and Flower Mound in region 1 but Desert Vista beat El Paso at Desert Twilight. That’s all Desert Vista has on their resume.

For the other 3 boys selections, I think it makes sense.

Now Milesplit has summaries on what those teams have on their resume that helps them get the at large bid.

http://www.milesplit.com/articles/227935?page=1

Should we be surprised by the inclusion of Saratoga Springs? They finished in 9th place at Great American. Have they improved drastically since early October?

Bang Bang wrote:

Desert Vista beat Southlake Carroll at Woodbridge. El Paso beat both SLC and Flower Mound in region 1 but Desert Vista beat El Paso at Desert Twilight. That’s all Desert Vista has on their resume.

For the other 3 boys selections, I think it makes sense.

It's stupid that the State Champions aren't going when NXN South is always basically Texas teams. Like, how do you not send The Woodlands because they had a crappy race at Nike South (like a lot of other teams did)?

-The Woodlands beat Flower Mound, El Paso Eastwood, and SLC at state. To FM's credit, they were missing #1 (still would have lost by a good margin).

-They also easily beat Flower Mound at Nike South (another meet, not the NXN regional).

They had a bad race at NXN South. Keller also had a bad race, but they managed to finish 2nd. This makes no sense. Screw the fact that they finished 4th, just give them an invite on grounds of winning the state meet. I want to see the best Texas teams at this national meet, not some that managed to squeeze in on an off day.

Bro, woodlands was trending backwards since October. They destroy everyone at Nike South Invite. By district and regionals they are just beating College Park by less than 20 both times. State they barely beat SLC. NXR they get 4th to teams they had demolished a month and a half earlier and they were't even competitive. They wouldn't be ready to run NXN.

Bruddaman wrote:

Bro, woodlands was trending backwards since October. They destroy everyone at Nike South Invite. By district and regionals they are just beating College Park by less than 20 both times. State they barely beat SLC. NXR they get 4th to teams they had demolished a month and a half earlier and they were't even competitive. They wouldn't be ready to run NXN.

So they had one bad race, and suddenly, they wouldn't be competitive? Two of their top runners had horrible races at NXN South. They still finished 4th, and not by that big of a margin either. So, it took them having two of their scoring runners to have a really bad race, and now you suddenly say they wouldn't be ready to run at NXN? Does that mean Flower Mound and SLC should just stay at home?

What does College Park have to do with the Woodlands? You're using a district meet, where there is basically two teams (Woodlands and College Park) to make this conclusion? Regionals was close, but so what--- one race? Uhhh, even if SLC was close in points, The Woodlands were pretty far ahead of Flower Mound (and College Park). Even if they had Alex, they would have finished 4th with 139 points. Point being, TWL ended up as State Champions.

Green Hope is the first ever A-L for Southeast boys, a region which has steadily improved over the last ten years.

The Woodlands started off the season head and shoulders the best program in the state. They stagnated for about a month and a half, allowing many other teams to catch them and by State, Southlake Carroll, who had looked terrible at regionals, almost beat them. That was the tipping point. Two weeks later several other teams had also passed them. The race was hosted on their home course they train at every day and they still weren't prepared to beat teams they had destroyed earlier in the season.

Hands down the only reason Saratoga got chosen was because Kelsey Chmiel, their number one runner as well as top 5 in the nation, failed to qualify individually at NXR, coming in a rough 15th place after fading the last half. She cruised to an all-time mark at Feds last week behind tuohy and had a strong resume, winning Great American, Ocean State, 2nd behind tuohy countless times, obviously she just had a rough day. She’s placed 4th and 5th at NXN the last two years, so obviously I’m sure the committee felt that it would be a disgrace for her not to go. I wouldn’t be surprised if they looked more at her resume than her team’s when debating if Saratoga would go. Saratoga is only decent this year thanks to the addition of two 7th grade twins who were their 4/5 yesterday, and wouldn’t be surprised, if like many of Saratoga’s runners who were pulled up that early- mysteriously will quit before their senior year.

The last two twins who were pulled up in 7th grade for Saratoga actually ran as seniors yesterday, so I think it is unfair to say that they will mysteriously quit. Puberty makes some runners better and some worse, so why indicate that being on their varsity as a seventh grader has a negative connotation? I would simply be happy for them getting the oppurtunity to race at NXN. I also agree that Chmiel is the main reason they get to go, but also there is a lower depth of girls teams than there has been in years past.

Boys NXR Speed Rating Merge Team Scores

Great Oak 202

Mountain Vista 210

Loudon Valley 255

Roosevelt 267

Manlius 311

Springville 316

DGN 322

St. Francis 328 AL

Wayzata 377

Dana Hills 388 ?

Bolles 413

Middleton 426

LaGrange 433 ?

Flower Mound 440

Central Valley 452

Kamiakin 460

Carmel 460

Dowling Cath. 464 ?

Green Hope 485 AL

Edina 493

St. Xavier 502

Timpanogos 515 AL

Carroll 526

NV 529

Xavier, CT 532

CBA 541

Crater 550

Desert Vista 551 AL

Corning 558

Eastwood 561

Bozeman 658

Woodlands 667

Bishop H 684

Burnt Hills 689

Kingsway 726

Northport 727

VFL wrote:

Green Hope is the first ever A-L for Southeast boys, a region which has steadily improved over the last ten years.

Southeast was fricking stacked this year, its on the rise for sure. We got some good young guys coming up and some programs that are on the rise too.

Other way to get in : Be formerly great. Worry NIKE that you will go back to Footlocker. Kiss committee butts. Welcome to Oregon.

While team depth may be an issue this year for girls, the Saratoga Springs team I saw in early October was in no way a NXN caliber team. Maybe they improved and deserve it. But, if they got it primarily because of Chmiel, then it would seem the committee lost its purpose a bit. Saratoga got absolutely smoked at Great American, mostly by teams that will be sitting at home next weekend.

Saratoga's team time was almost 8:00 behind FM. Clearly favoritism going on here. They simply do not deserve to be there. Many of these wildcard selections are being done in a very emotional way, leaving better teams at home. Using results from September is illogical. This sport is all about "what have you done for me lately?" Penalizing teams that know how to peak well is asinine. One has to wonder how many people on the selection committee are being unduly influenced by mingling with coaches of teams on the bubble. In the southern section, where Rich Gonzalez does rankings that influence who makes it to the post-season, it's well known that if you are buddy-buddy with Rich you are more likely to get a wildcard entry.

BenedictA wrote:

While team depth may be an issue this year for girls, the Saratoga Springs team I saw in early October was in no way a NXN caliber team. Maybe they improved and deserve it. But, if they got it primarily because of Chmiel, then it would seem the committee lost its purpose a bit. Saratoga got absolutely smoked at Great American, mostly by teams that will be sitting at home next weekend.

I have heard that it has to do with prior performances, and more importantly, how close the third/fourth place teams were to second place. Interestingly enough, this year did not seem to follow that format so that may be wrong?

How did California deserve one when Desert Vista got second at Woodbridge which is technically the Cali state meet across all regions?