Why so concerned with retirement?

I'm always amused at the millennial holy grail quest to make a living doing a hobby and avoiding unpleasant/unexciting labor of all kinds.

If you guys figure it out I'm all in!

A lot of people have pursued their passion and succeeded but it is hard - a heck of a lot harder than working a typical 9-5.

John Utah wrote:

I'm always amused at the millennial holy grail quest to make a living doing a hobby and avoiding unpleasant/unexciting labor of all kinds.

If you guys figure it out I'm all in!

trumplove wrote:

A lot of people have pursued their passion and succeeded but it is hard - a heck of a lot harder than working a typical 9-5.

John Utah wrote:

I'm always amused at the millennial holy grail quest to make a living doing a hobby and avoiding unpleasant/unexciting labor of all kinds.

If you guys figure it out I'm all in!

I know probably thousands of people and I don't think any of them make a living engaging their "passion", whatever that might mean.

I don't doubt a few of those people are out there, I just don't personally know any of them.

It also depends of the definition of making a living. It also depends on your choice to have a family. A family can live in a frugal way, but there is a minimum threshold.

trumplove wrote:

A lot of people have pursued their passion and succeeded but it is hard - a heck of a lot harder than working a typical 9-5.

John Utah wrote:

I'm always amused at the millennial holy grail quest to make a living doing a hobby and avoiding unpleasant/unexciting labor of all kinds.

If you guys figure it out I'm all in!

Of course it's hard. That's the whole point. It's the holy grail. It really isn't attainable for 98% of the world's population. That's why work is called work. I admit, it's a brutal and depressing reality. But it is what it is. That said, it's not depressing if you have the right attitude and "understanding" of life. At least, that's how I see it.

I was lucky to be able to take sabbatical like breaks at points in my life. Not strictly every seven years and not for a whole year but breaks of two to six months. That of course is difficult if you are a worker in a role playing job. I was lucky my transition from worker to management had a natural break as my new position at another company would not open for 2 months. I went to Hawaii rented a house on Maui and as they say vegged out. That convinced me work some play some was the way to go. I started Business Consultancy with some partners (fancy name for temp work) and never looked back. Work Some Play Some--- at times all of us working big hours sometimes only two of us on duty with one just drawing a check . . .

business trek wrote:

Will be a combination from a few different sources. Public pension, kids/family, emergency fund, part-time work etc.

I'm counting on other people's tax money the same way anyone else is.

Kids/family? How do you expect to raise kids with that kind of income? Are you counting on the income of your future spouse? And given the amount of money you are contributing to the Social Security, your benefits are likely to be really small.

Finally, those of us who will have seven-figure retirement savings do not "count on" Social Security benefits. It will be nice extra income that we can spend on things like -- travel. But we could live without them if we had to.

Thing is as you get a bit older life hits. Divorce, child support, accidents, sickness, fired from job, politics in the work place. The list goes on and on and sometimes more than one hits. My Dad had cancer when I was 38. He made it 16 years. I had to help financially. At same time wife ran off. I had kids, then she took them etc. Anyway, what saved my butt was dropping my personnel health care. Anyway, my state pension at 20, hit when I was 45. Man I can't stress the gold this has been.

Business trek wrote:

Staying fit is great but if drinking and watching tv are your 2 main interests you are definitely using them as coping mechanisms - take my advice - you need to get out there, explore (places and topics) and find what you like and love.

It sounds like you are a bit directionless and working 40 hours a week on something you only tolerate then drinking and watching tv is your avoidance.

Alright, well I won't bug you any more on this, but I just want to let you know that I didn't find your advice helpful. This is what it felt like from my end:

You: Live your life doing what you love!

Me: How would I do that? My interests A, B, C, D, E, F can't be monetized

You: No, those aren't your real interests. Keep searching.

Me: No for real I like those things. So given that, how do I follow your advice?

You: Those couldn't possibly be your interests. You have to keep searching, because the right interest is out there somewhere and then you can make it your life.

Me: OK, so just vague hypotheticals as I suspected.

Business trek wrote:

Happy to discuss that relationship on another thread - start one and let me know the title.

Roger Murdock wrote:

Hey, you started the meaning of life discussion when you stated that the reason we exist is to travel, experience cultures, and meet people. I in turn asked how you know that to be true.

And if you don't think one's attitude toward retirement, savings, and work are directly related to his or her perception of the meaning of life, well, that's some pretty serious cognitive dissonance going on there.

You brought it up...and I do think meaning of life questions are very relevant to the topic at hand. Doesn't how you spend your time and money (the topic of this thread) say something about your meaning?

Methinks you are avoiding thinking more deeply about the issue, and that directly contradicts your earlier statement about ongoing learning and exploration.

Sounds really cool! And I agree a great way to live. I do a similar thing but likely for much less $.

Same road as Kristofferson wrote:

I was lucky to be able to take sabbatical like breaks at points in my life. Not strictly every seven years and not for a whole year but breaks of two to six months. That of course is difficult if you are a worker in a role playing job. I was lucky my transition from worker to management had a natural break as my new position at another company would not open for 2 months. I went to Hawaii rented a house on Maui and as they say vegged out. That convinced me work some play some was the way to go. I started Business Consultancy with some partners (fancy name for temp work) and never looked back. Work Some Play Some--- at times all of us working big hours sometimes only two of us on duty with one just drawing a check . . .

If it's depressing you can change it! You can reframe the norm for yourself and can certainly pursue your passion.I don't believe for 98% of people it's unattainable but I definitely believe 98% of people think it's unattainable so never try or are too risk averse to try.

John Utah wrote:

trumplove wrote:

A lot of people have pursued their passion and succeeded but it is hard - a heck of a lot harder than working a typical 9-5.

Of course it's hard. That's the whole point. It's the holy grail. It really isn't attainable for 98% of the world's population. That's why work is called work. I admit, it's a brutal and depressing reality. But it is what it is. That said, it's not depressing if you have the right attitude and "understanding" of life. At least, that's how I see it.

Sure but a lot of what you mentioned (divorce , sickness, politics at workplace) stems from a 9-5 job!Would you rather have an awesome, low paying job and be fitter, healthier and mentally better but less emergency buffer or more money but more problems you have to spend it on?Of course we can't predict the future but people should invest in themselves first.

soyoung23 wrote:

Thing is as you get a bit older life hits. Divorce, child support, accidents, sickness, fired from job, politics in the work place. The list goes on and on and sometimes more than one hits. My Dad had cancer when I was 38. He made it 16 years. I had to help financially. At same time wife ran off. I had kids, then she took them etc. Anyway, what saved my butt was dropping my personnel health care. Anyway, my state pension at 20, hit when I was 45. Man I can't stress the gold this has been.

You basically summarized the unhelpful things you heard and ignored my true advice (such as take time off to find your passion as it's much harder when working 40 hours a week)Also you came into this thread negative and skeptical so you already decided I wouldn't be helpful before I even answered.At least you are curious and seem to be looking for a path. You recognize your job isn't the best and listed a couple bad habits (no watching tv and excessive drinking aren't "passions" they are bad habits)quote]Hjj wrote:

Business trek wrote:

Staying fit is great but if drinking and watching tv are your 2 main interests you are definitely using them as coping mechanisms - take my advice - you need to get out there, explore (places and topics) and find what you like and love.

It sounds like you are a bit directionless and working 40 hours a week on something you only tolerate then drinking and watching tv is your avoidance.

Alright, well I won't bug you any more on this, but I just want to let you know that I didn't find your advice helpful. This is what it felt like from my end:

You: Live your life doing what you love!

Me: How would I do that? My interests A, B, C, D, E, F can't be monetized

You: No, those aren't your real interests. Keep searching.

Me: No for real I like those things. So given that, how do I follow your advice?

You: Those couldn't possibly be your interests. You have to keep searching, because the right interest is out there somewhere and then you can make it your life.

Me: OK, so just vague hypotheticals as I suspected.[/quote]

Hjj wrote:

OK, so just vague hypotheticals as I suspected.

Yep, and when asked to defend or at least explain those vague hypotheticals, he refuses to answer the question.

"Pursue your passion" is a great con. The vast majority of work is....work. Other people pay for your labor, and oh by the way, people who pursue their "passion" for a living not-uncommonly wind up hating their "passion" because it becomes work. I've got two right off the top of my head: aviation and firefighting. I've had several friends in each of those fields who were truly passionate until 5-10 years in, when work in those fields becomes like any other, which is to say it's work. If you have to do it to make money, and/or on someone else's schedule, it's all the same folks.

Oh, and to the snowflakes out there who are in their 20s and early 30s and still haven't gotten your shit together and started a career, every year you delay in getting started is another year in your old age during which you'll have to grind away while desperately wishing you could retire. I don't understand people who jerk around in grad school forever, or hang out with Mom and Dad, or just generally think it's cool to wait until they're 30 or older to start making and saving. Do some very basic and very quick math and you'll see that you are setting yourselves up for old-age suffering, dipshits.

Stop being pussies and get a god damned job, fools.

Wrong. Totally happy to engage and answer. Just on a new thread. It's you who refuses to start one.

Roger Murdock wrote:

Hjj wrote:

OK, so just vague hypotheticals as I suspected.

Yep, and when asked to defend or at least explain those vague hypotheticals, he refuses to answer the question.

What a negative and derogatory post. You're actually helping my point as you seem pretty miserable and jaded. Name calling and hate...looks like your 9-5 really turned you into a poor human being. But at least you can be an unhappy, miserable rich old guy!

Business trek wrote:

Start your tax policy thread elsewhere and I'll debate you. Your logic is completely flawed. By that logic paying tax is the only source of value and the less you make the more of a mooch you are. Ie. an aeronautical engineer making 150k is a mooch compared to a Wall Street broker.

How do you look at yourself? wrote:

Except that unlike most of us, you will have paid virtually nothing into the tax system. So basically you have chosen to mooch off people who have chosen to do something productive with their lives.

Actually, someone who makes 150k/yr pays exactly the same amount into social security as someone who makes 1.5 million/year.

But whatever you have to tell yourself to prevent your brain from having to confront the fact that your goal is to skate through life while leeching off people who use their talents productively!

God. Some of you appear to have sad, depressing lives and have settled on the fact that it is just how it is.

Take control of life.