What kind of college coach doesn't let post-collegiate alumni PROS run on their track?

MadOnTheInternet wrote:

Penn State doesn't allow ANY non varsity runners on the track. The track was resurfaced in the fall for Big 10's and has been under 'construction' as a guise to keep students off it, obviously varsity is out there despite the 'dangerous conditions'...

Let's all be mad at Gondack together, maybe he reads this?

Wow! Considering Harry would have everybody and their dog out on the track for Wednesday night all-comers meets during the summer, this has got to make keeping community relations strong & positive pretty challenging.

Jogger to be wrote:

CU. Wetmore wont let anyone touch his track. When Emma left him and Burroughs., rumor is they tried to ban even her from using the track. Boulder community is not allowed on the track at anytime.

Don’t ask for permission.

It’s a state-owned facility and I can’t think of a good reason to restrict general public use outside of actual team use, of course.

Precious Roy wrote:

When I was in college in the late 80s early 90s, our div I football stadium was open all day. Anyone could come in and use the track or do stadium steps. The only time it was closed was for games and team practices. People would even come and lay out in the sun in the spring time to get a tan.

But with the running boom, a lot of college tracks got filled up with running groups doing workouts. And lots of NCAA stadiums got big upgrades and had to be kept locked up all the time. Then, there were also concerns about campus security. So now it is the norm that tracks are kept under lock and key and only school teams can use them.

Running Boom?

John Utah wrote: I can of course understand not having folks run with the team or at the same time. That's obvious.

Why would this situation be obvious? When I had exhausted my college eligibility (on a D-1 program FWIW) and graduated, my college coach allowed me to continue training on the track AND he invited me to train with his distance crew. I was no stud in college.....never qualified for nationals and received only a partial scholarship. I was just a guy who wanted to keep racing and pick up a little (very little) prize money on the road circuit.

I completely understand the arguments that the school itself may have concerns about liability, but I would like to think a good coach who is also a decent human being would welcome the opportunity to continue assisting his alums as they seek ongoing improvement.

John Utah wrote:

Jogger to be wrote:

CU. Wetmore wont let anyone touch his track. When Emma left him and Burroughs., rumor is they tried to ban even her from using the track. Boulder community is not allowed on the track at anytime.

Don’t ask for permission.

It’s a state-owned facility and I can’t think of a good reason to restrict general public use outside of actual team use, of course.

First, so we should allow people to drop in and use the chemistry lab? How about the university super computers?

The federal government owns the F-22, can I take it for a spin?

Just because something is owned by the state or government does not give us all access to it.

Several reasons:

Additional wear and tear on the track. Who pays for that?

Vandalism or just damage even if not intentional

Liability (this is probably the first reason actually since it is potentially the most expensive)

Running Alum wrote:

John Utah wrote: I can of course understand not having folks run with the team or at the same time. That's obvious.

Why would this situation be obvious? When I had exhausted my college eligibility (on a D-1 program FWIW) and graduated, my college coach allowed me to continue training on the track AND he invited me to train with his distance crew. I was no stud in college.....never qualified for nationals and received only a partial scholarship. I was just a guy who wanted to keep racing and pick up a little (very little) prize money on the road circuit.

I completely understand the arguments that the school itself may have concerns about liability, but I would like to think a good coach who is also a decent human being would welcome the opportunity to continue assisting his alums as they seek ongoing improvement.

I interpreted John Utah to mean having the general public using the track while the team is working out not a couple of former runners who would not be in the way.

Yes, that's what I mean. I'm talking about a person like me, for example, not being allowed to use the track when the team is on the track. It would not be a good idea for me to be out there getting in the way of d1 runners.

I don't know enough about being on a D1 team to understand why a coach would or would not be ok with former team runners running with current team. On the surface seems fine. Why not? But maybe they have a good reason. I have no idea.

Luv2Run wrote:

John Utah wrote:

Don’t ask for permission.

It’s a state-owned facility and I can’t think of a good reason to restrict general public use outside of actual team use, of course.

First, so we should allow people to drop in and use the chemistry lab? How about the university super computers?

The federal government owns the F-22, can I take it for a spin?

Just because something is owned by the state or government does not give us all access to it.

Several reasons:

Additional wear and tear on the track. Who pays for that?

Vandalism or just damage even if not intentional

Liability (this is probably the first reason actually since it is potentially the most expensive)

Look, I'm not saying that just because something is "state-owned" the general public should have access. In fact, the general public has access to very little of what you are talking about. I think everyone knows and recognizes this. One cannot waltz into CIA headquarters or onto an aircraft carrier at will.

That said, I think the reasons you stated (vandalism, wear and tear and lability) are often grossly overstated to keep people off. For example, I can use a most any high school track and the lability issues are no different. Think of every public park and playground. It's not that big of a deal. Schools like CU already have massive liability coverage (or are self-insured) and track use makes no difference, especially when most of the rest of the campus and ground are generally open to the public. Slip and fall BS lawsuits can happen anywhere.

Unless vandalism is a big issue elsewhere on campus grounds , which are generally open to the public, I see no reason why that would be a concern. The demographic using a track is not the demographic typically associated with vandalism. If it actually is a problem, then sure, close it, but not until then.

Wear and tear. That's what a track is for. It's a public institution (funded by the public and alums) there for the betterment of our society. More importantly, I would suggest that track degradation is WAY WAY more of a result of weather, sun, freezing temps vs. actual runners.

I run in south, where we have these...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_silk_orb-weaver

They are big enough to scare a lot of people and they make thick webs at head level across running trails in the woods. If I run in the morning to beat the heat I almost always hit a few (and clear out the webs for everyone else for the rest of the day). Apparently their bite doesn't pose any danger to a human; but it is not a nice feeling to have a web wrapped around your face and in your hair.

I wear a running hat, that sometimes helps.

haha...I just responded to a completely different thread on this board

Considering the running community in Boulder it’s pretty ridiculous how strict the university is about usage of their facilities. Compare that with NAU, who let’s the Flagstaff running community use their tracks, both indoor and outdoor. Point for Flagstaff over Boulder.

John Utah wrote:

Luv2Run wrote:

I interpreted John Utah to mean having the general public using the track while the team is working out not a couple of former runners who would not be in the way.

Yes, that's what I mean. I'm talking about a person like me, for example, not being allowed to use the track when the team is on the track. It would not be a good idea for me to be out there getting in the way of d1 runners.

I don't know enough about being on a D1 team to understand why a coach would or would not be ok with former team runners running with current team. On the surface seems fine. Why not? But maybe they have a good reason. I have no idea.

It is an NCAA violation to allow random people to work out with the team. That is why usually when pro runners stick around to train with the team, officially they are a volunteer assistant coach or something. Sometimes grad assistant spots can be used if theyre also a grad student.

Some coaches choose to quietly break the rule. As long as it is only a small number of alumni wanting to run with the team, they figure it isnt likely they will get caught and isnt an unfair advantage to the NCAA members of the team.

Hnfhnfhbf wrote:

Considering the running community in Boulder it’s pretty ridiculous how strict the university is about usage of their facilities. Compare that with NAU, who let’s the Flagstaff running community use their tracks, both indoor and outdoor. Point for Flagstaff over Boulder.

I think that is the point. You'd have everyone out there using it all the time.

As a former D1 guy who had some questionable alums hanging around after graduation, I think it is better to keep the track closed and limit access to the team during practice time. For every great situation you guys have had, there is always going to be some naysayer who tries to "coach" the team in a different direction. We had a few of these guys and even though I liked them as people, I was glad when they moved on and we could just be a team.

A coach has the right to keep his team and his facility under his control.

I am not really sure why so many of you think you're entitled to use a D1 University track for your personal use. Like others have mentioned, you can't just waltz into Death Valley for a game of flag football with your buddies or take a dip in the UCLA basketball hot tub. Our public high schools keep their tracks locked, but we have a few decent public tracks in town that we can use. Also, oddly enough, a local private university keeps their track open most of the time. While I am probably not allowed to use it, I often do intervals there at night and I have never seen a sign or been told to leave. Bringing it full circle, I think that is a result of living in a city where track use is not a widespread desire (such as in Boulder).

But I do think cities should have decent tracks open for the public. It seems like more are beginning to fund greenways instead, which is good too.

Steve Jones and Frank Shorter in their respective primes aren't rolling into Boulder today. It's a pit of wannabes who have no hope to win anything big plus a slew of Runners World hobby joggers. Those are the people who will bring their snotty kids along to empty the sandpits and generally be an annoyance to CU athletes and coaches. Boulder supports CU in no special way, you won't see any of those hack training groups volunteering for CU meets. Look at how the "running community" in Boulder messed up having free access to the high school tracks. NAU and Flag are majorly different, there's no real comparison with Boulder.

Hnfhnfhbf wrote:

Considering the running community in Boulder it’s pretty ridiculous how strict the university is about usage of their facilities. Compare that with NAU, who let’s the Flagstaff running community use their tracks, both indoor and outdoor. Point for Flagstaff over Boulder.