At how may Miles Per Week do you start to double?

osm wrote:

I'm building up to 70 this summer, and I'll start doing doubles a couple times a week once I reach 65. My previous high is 60, which I did all in singles. Seems like there's a good deal of disagreement among elite coaches on this subject, but at 40-45 mpw, I can't imagine that there's much very use in doubling.

I agree, i've doubled before, but i've managed a couple of 60s in singles. Shoot, for one the long run was only twelve miles. I just did long cool downs after workouts.

The right answer is 70, with a range:

No point in doubling below 60.

A must to double over 80.

My rule of thumb is to never double on a day with less that 10 miles, i.e. no single runs less than 5 miles.

There is not one right answer. It depends on how much time you have, how old you are, how you respond to what type of running, how much you have run in the past and many other things.

In HS, I used doubling to go from 45 mpw the last week of May to 90 mpw the first week of June and stayed at 90 until school started. I didn't know it at the time, but if I had slowly build up to 90 over the summer, each week as the runs got longer they would have gotten, slower and less fun. I have tried it many times over the last 35 years and that is just what happens to me.

I started back after an injury about 10 days ago. The first 7 days I did singles. The last 3 days have been doubles. I did 18 miles that first week. I hope to have 36 miles using doubles this week. Doubles just work for me.

Honestly you got to figure out for yourself what works best for you. Personally, I hate doubling. I run like shit when I double and feel tired all the time. I'd rather do 80 mpw in singles than doubles. But that's just me.

I've always found that when I started introducing doubles as I ramped up a period of higher mileage, the easy morning run felt terrible but at the same time made my second run feel much, much better. I distinctly noticed this - on days I ran once, I felt somewhat sore and sluggish compared to when I had done a very easy run in the AM.

In other words the morning run actually made everything easier in an overall way when upping weekly mileage. So to me, doubles actually reduced chances of breakdown and lingering fatigue.

That being said, I would generally start doubling at about 55-60 miles (2 mornings a week). At 70+ miles I am doubling more days than not.

Start off with very easy short jogs at close to recovery pace - maybe 6km.

If you absolutely don't want to run more than 40 miles a week then don't bother doubling. The advantage of doubling would be that it will allow you to run more miles. I know others will say that there are other benefits, but at 40 miles a week I just don't see those benefits being worth the effort to run twice a day.

The guy that said "it depends" is on the right track. Mostly it depends on how much time you have to spend on your running. For me I'm like most people on here that don't really think about doubling until I'm getting around the 60M for the week.

For me trying to get in that 30 min run before work is a huge pain in the ass, especially if it's the summer or winter and the temps are at their extremes.

If you have a lot of time, doing an easy 30 min run in the am, then a bigger run in the afternoon, fine. I just can't imagine take the time to change clothes, recover, shower, etc.. for a 3M run.

So like everybody has said, obviously training works a little differently for everyone. This is a good reason to try out doubling, to see how it works for you.

But your question was, the reason you've heard for doubling is that it lets you run more mileage. But if you already decided that you'll be running 40-45 miles per week, and you don't have any desire to do more than that, and you can do that in singles, then is there any other reason to double?

I think the answer to that is mostly no. If you already decided how much you're going to run, and can handle that in singles and don't want to do more than that, then there probably isn't much reason for doubles.

However, I don't think that's very realistic. How much you are running should depend on how you are recovering and adapting to your efforts. Maybe 40 is too much for you in singles - you're getting through it, but it's wearing you down. In that case, you could switch to doubles and handle the load while being fresher and getting more benefit out of your training. Alternatively, maybe 40 actually is the perfect distance for you in singles. Still, if you switched to doubles, now maybe you could handle running 50 miles per week in doubles while staying just as fresh as you would have been at 40 in singles. By making that switch you'll end up a stronger runner.

The other thing that's been mentioned is that doubles can help you recover faster and feel better on your primary run of the day. I definitely agree with that from my experience - when I double in the morning, I feel better in the afternoon. And if I do my main workout in the morning, doubling in the afternoon helps me feel more recovered the next day. What I would stress is that on days that you double, one of your runs should be extremely short and easy. Like, if I was doing 45 miles a week, I would recommend like 2 or three easy miles in the morning as many times per week as you have the motivation for.

I understand that doubling is inconvenient and not for everyone. But if you're serious about improving, I think you should definitely at least give it a try, regardless of what mileage you are at.

You ran in the morning. It's 6pm. You feel like running again, do it.

You ran in the morning, it's 6pm, you're sore but you feel like you should run, do it.

You ran in the morning, it's 6pm, you're tired as shit, don't do it.

It's that simple.

Why max out at 45mpw?

How old are you?

Are you planning on being a solid college runner?

If you want to be as good as possible, then run doubles. Just get in the habit. Do a very easy run in the morning. 2 miles to start. Maybe build up to 3. Start doing 2-3 times a week, building up to 5-6. These are easy runs. Just like a warmup for a workout or race without the strides or fast bits.

You should still be able to build up to 40-45 without your afternoon/evening runs.

If you don't plan on being that good, then just do doubles when you feel like it as recovery or warmup.

Please shut up wrote:

The right answer is 70, with a range:

No point in doubling below 60.

A must to double over 80.

No, the answer is there is no right answer.

It is not a must to double over 80, I have run many weeks in the 95-105 range in singles as did most of the guys I ran with and knew, none of those miles were easy. If I was running 150 in a week, I would still run a 100 miles if you counted one run a day and the extra 50 would be from doubles. Would you have to run 3 times a day to run more 140? Why is 10 miles per run average magical? If you go from 60 to 70 and add doubles, why do you get more benefit than adding doubles when going from 30 to 40 and adding doubles or why does the benefit fall off on doing singles after 80? Wouldn't the mileage vary depending on the ability of the runner too, what makes this "right" range you have listed above magical to everyone of every ability?

Answer those questions convincingly and you may have the right answer but until you do, you have just pulled a range out of your a$$.

Thanks for all the replies everyone, this is what this website should be like. I see many positive stories about doubling, and I see many people who do not promote doubling. Summer is the time to experiment, so that's what I think I'll do, experiment. There's always time to recover in the summer and if you mess up you can reset yourself. I'll see how I feel, and maybe at the end of the summer I'll report back. About the part of why max out at 40-45MPW? It just felt like a safe number for me as I have never ran close to that mileage consistently but at the same time I never had any trouble handling lower mileage. If I run this much, I will be running by far the most on my XC team. If I feel good, I will increase my mileage, and perhaps use doubles to get me there. I'm really wanting to make "the jump." Again, I really appreciate the detailed responses.

It's important not to sacrifice your longer runs at the expense of morning runs. If you need to cut back to accommodate morning runs, then cut back on your recovery days.

You really should build up to 2-3 runs of 45 minutes or longer a week, with one being an hour or more. Then your easy days can be a 20-30 minutes easy shake out run.

That's just the beginning. Eventually you should be doing 2-3 runs over 60. Then 3 over 75 with one over 90.

Unless you are a 800/1500/1600 guy.

It's really, really important to back off if you are feeling tired. Especially if it's to the point where you just can't face it....or that the first 10-15 minutes don't snap you out of your funk.

Oh, and make sure your easy days are easy!!

nolodolo wrote:

Eventually you should be doing 2-3 runs over 60. Then 3 over 75 with one over 90.

Unless you are a 800/1500/1600 guy.

Unless you are a marathoner, you don't need 3 runs over 75 minutes. It's better to do 60/30 doubles with one 90 min run a week.

Depends on Things wrote:

To get 40 mpw, it's as simple as averaging 6 miles over 5 runs with a long run of 10 miles, and then a day off. To get above 40, you could just throw in another short run on the 7th day or you could throw in a 3-4 miler in for a double somewhere.

Do this. I start doubling at 70 ish. First I work up to the longest I want to go in my singles (normally 9-10) then to increase mileage from there, add 3-5 mile slow shakeouts.

Sounds good, by the way I am a 400/800/1600 guy who also runs cross country. Cross country is not my strong suit, but I can hold my own, plus I have been training at relatively low mileage for XC. I know nolodolo said that I should be doing his runs unless I am an 800 guy, which I am. However I am training for XC. I guess he was just saying that for an 800/1600 guy that runs that long aren't necessary. I think the concept of a double in the early stages being a shakeout to get you ready for the rest of the day and also running seems smart. I always like feeling loose on my runs, so this may help.

Interesting contribution. I'll definitely keep this in mind as I get older, slower, and race longer distances.

I always dreaded high mileage and usually did singles.

This approach may make the transition more manageable and still allow relatively frequent fast(er) sessions. It's hard to find recovery time doing ~ten miles per day as singles when autopilot starts to accelerate the runs over time.

Since the summer is supposed to prepare your body for the real training in the fall you might as well start doubling now even if it means doing less mileage per run. As you build miles the run distances will increase anyways.

My main focus is marathons and I doubled just one day a week just to get some extra miles in. I'd do a hard session in the morning and an easy one in the evening. That suits me as I run a bit better in the morning.

Now I'm past my target race and I'm down to 40 miles a week I still keep the double in. It's more just to keep my body used to the routine, so that when the next marathon training plan comes along my body is pretty much used to running twice in a day.

I only doubled once as my mileage at about 70 miles was fairly easy to do in singles.

For middle distance running, I know that David Rudisha runs twice a day with one rest day. His long run is 60 - 80 mins. I don't know the exact sessions he does but they did a hard track session in the morning, so imagine the evening runs were easier. He did core work once a week, flexibility once a week and strength once a week. On these days they counted them as a third session even though they were not actually running.