Ole Classic - Gray 1'42.80 Solo from '92 Trials

socalcush wrote:

also worth checking out: as far as i know, the only johnny gray 1500m race from modesto relays--pretty cool battle between jgray and doug padilla...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elNGqkEj5Eo

He ran a mile I believe at Kezar

80s? san francisco? how fast? just curious--must've been before my time in the club...

eh ???

there was no threat to him in trials race & ran a solo 1'42.8

err...

you not look at the vid ???

it is when you lead every cm of race

that's nonsense

a pacer to 200 - 400m with same splits for gray wouda been

~ 1'42.45

without any consideration of ridiculous 200 opener & lack of rest

clearly no way in same physical/mental shape in much slower race

very likely

a huge part of modern sport is employing psychologists to reduce stress & focus on target

gray wouda benefited hugely if they were used in his era

you don't know that

to crumble so badly in such a slow race for him indicates not "all the physical stuff was the same" regardless of any mental issues

physics is never the same for any 2 races

i have ignored the physics comparison because that was a small factor

the only relevant factors were changes in physical/mental condition between trials & games final

yes

however the games run was a total shadow of his trials run indicating some serious physical/mental issues at the games

your most cogent comment by far

Bad Wigins wrote:

ventolin^3 wrote:

for your suggested 24-high theoretical, call it 24.75, the ideal splits woud be

24.75 / 50.00 / 75.75 / 1'42.00

ridiculous 24-flat/low & even moreso 23+ starts kill of times run compared to guys' absolute potential with "proper" openers

Well go tell Johnny Gray then, if he finds out this brilliant idea maybe he will tell Duane to start slower

a great suggestion

duane shouda been capable of 1'42-mid perhaps even 1'42-low if he coud have replicated his games shape on the circuit with a sensible 200 opener

Tell David too while you're at it, maybe we'll see a 1:39

certainly a 1'40-mid in his london shape

& if he'd had a pacer & fully rested for it, a serious consideration of 1'40-flat woud be warranted

Who knew you could save stored phosphates for after 200m?

let butch tell you :

21.4 + 10.7 + 11.1

a faster last 100 than average of his 1st 200

ventolin^3 wrote:a faster last 100 than average of his 1st 200

edit :

a 3rd 100m of same average speed as 1st 200 & very little drop-off in last 100m of race

ventolin^3 wrote:

And surely not 1:42.80

err...

you not look at the vid ???

Strong is Vader. Mind what you have learned. Save you it can.

'physics is never the same for any 2 races'

Unless its Wells where you said the only reason for a 10.25 was a poor peformance (in winning Olympic gold)

yup

ran crap in'80 final & edged a photo-finish

a rubbish final, same as in '03wc won in 10.07 sandwiched between '01wc won in 9.82 & '04og won in 9.86

clearly the concept of rubbish races & everyone running rubbish in them is beyond you

ventolin^3 wrote:

21.4 + 10.7 + 11.1

a faster last 100 than average of his 1st 200

2 x 11.1 > 21.4

Oh and guess who is gonna take a shot at the 50-54 400m world record

http://masterstrack.com/2014/12/33204/

He could be the first over 50 under 50.

ventolin^3 wrote:

yup

ran crap in'80 final & edged a photo-finish

a rubbish final, same as in '03wc won in 10.07 sandwiched between '01wc won in 9.82 & '04og won in 9.86

clearly the concept of rubbish races & everyone running rubbish in them is beyond you

Unlikely at that level, is the concept that the wind reading was wrong and it was beinbg cold night beyond you!

I'm still waiting for a reply on the muppet Wiggins on why 800m runners don't out in 21xx

Bad Wigins wrote:2 x 11.1 > 21.4

i see you didn't read the edit after

Please give a breakdown of your reasoning for the 1.17 s difference from the Trials race to the Olympics race.

He lead both from the beginning.

The splits were very similar. In fact his 400m split in the slower race was more conducive to a fast time as it was a bit slower but still sub 50.

Do you think it was a fitness drop off?

Do you think it was 100% mental pressure?

Something else?

I personally do not believe that having a rabbit at the Trials would have helped in run any faster.

Here is his 1:42.65 PR from 1988.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAcpMcUR-1M

There was a rabbit but the rabbit was way ahead for most of the race.

It may have helped to have someone to pass on the backstretch though.

Otherwise, Gray pretty much lead that whole race as well.

ukathleticscoach wrote:Unlikely at that level

what part of '03wc won in 10.07 sandwiched between '01wc & '04og both won in 9.8s did you not comprehend as showing crap global 100m races occur ???

is the concept that the wind reading was wrong

show me the IOC correction of their listed wind of +1.11m/s in their official report of moscow games

and it was beinbg cold night beyond you!

err...

the highest temperature that day was 74F

cold ?!

the prelims the day before were run on hottest day of year with max of 86F

I'm still waiting for a reply on the muppet Wiggins on why 800m runners don't out in 21xx

you occasionally amaze me with your insight !?

reminds me about the aphorism of an encumbered porcine & truffles...

you cannot separate the physical/mental aspects of woeful underperformance without comment from man himself

& that's where similarity ends

no

a much better 24.5 / 49.99 v 24.1 / 49.46

if in trials shape mind/body, he shouda been looking at 400m point in games at

~ 1'42-flat

see above

see 1st comment above

all that can be surmised was that exhibited a catastrophic drop in form from trials/games assuming similar weather at both

that is nonsense

if you wish to ignore physics of drafting then it makes you look inept & not worth bothering to converse with

a race i have linked to many times before & was going to bring up later

the crazy-asssed pacer who looked to be on crack was of no use whatsoever

johnny went thru again in 24.1 but backed off a little to reach bell in ~ 49.7 / 49.8 compared to 49.46 in trials 4 seasons later

he split 75.7 here, identical to split 4y later in trials

the final times of 1'42.65 v 1'42.80 are more than accounted for by difference in 200 - 400 split

it's virtually impossible to say which of the 2 races is better

a total disgrace of wabbit

not when it's an inept wabbit who shouda spent his time better that day by going downtown to "score"

gross understatement

a solo effort in all but name

Solo is solo, alone. Eight guys putting pressure from behind to keep up the pace is not solo. Have you ever run an 800m? You run faster to prevent the guys behind you from overtaking you. It's hugely motivating in a high stakes race. You have a narrow grasp of this sport. It's not a mathematic concept, it's human performance. You are like a robot who can't grasp human emotion.

wtf... i seriously cannot believe that he was able to run a 4 min mile equivalent..... it honestly boggles my mind. his stride is has so much "pop" i would think he'd run outta gas by the 1k mark..... christ

thank you for your

"insight"

i'm sure johnny is assuaged by that for not having :

2 golds

+

1 silver

+

possible wr

Yes, the only things you have to take care of in an 800m race are the pace and drafting (sarcasm).

Ventolin you have a very narrow understanding of 800m running. Have you ever run an 800m?

Gray ran that fast BECAUSE he led the whole way. He had a clear run, was highly motivated, was on top shape, had his family in the stands, and the guys behind him added to the pressure to keep up the pace. There are a hundreds of variables: sleep, food, socks, flights, late night, sex with wife, warm up, ride to track, other guys in the race, etc. You are only able to fathom two. You can't adjust variables after the fact and make absurd statements about what they "could have" run. That's what you don't understand about the sport. They ran what they ran.