Am i screwed on doing a 5:00 mile? Or will it just take me YEARS?

runfasterbrossss wrote:

I am 160lbs, 5'7ish. 27 years old

Ideal distance runner weight for you is around 125-130.

You can get a lot faster just by losing weight.

Are you muscular? If you're muscular then 160 pounds isn't bad for 5'7" but it would portend poor max potential for your mile time since you'd already be in shape.

If you're a flabby or unconditioned 5'7" 160 pound guy then you have more to work with.

describe mileage of last 2 years

runfasterbrossss wrote:

When i started running 2 years ago i sucked, was at like 10min mile, quickly within about 7 mins i was down to 6:30 mile.. With track work and about 25-50 miles a week sometimes i'm only at a 6:05 mile and i kind of beat myself up because I just want to get in to the mid to low 5's...

Being that i run a lot and can't seem to get into the 5:30 or low 5 range am i just genetically screwed or will it take me a long time to get there?

How many days a week is IDEAL for track work if im specifically looking to PR a mile?

I've been doing 400s'/800s once a week @ around 5:40 pace... I suck at CLOSING the last 2 laps when im actually doing a mile as PR.

trog wrote:

@Longjack

I agree that 600s are good, but what you're suggesting is a little ambitious. 600s and 600s alone won't quite get you there. Needs a little short tempo or something like that. Good thinking on the hill intervals, though.

nah, this guy needs focus. guys like this get lost.

the schedule is made to get him to break through a mental and physical barrier.

he needs to run as much as he can at race pace without killing himself

when you change the recovery time and drop it down from 2 minutes, down to 1 minute, down to 30 or even 20 seconds.

the 600m becomes a very different beast.

Nope wrote:

runfasterbrossss wrote:

I am 160lbs, 5'7ish. 27 years old

Ideal distance runner weight for you is around 125-130.

I agree with this. At least get down to 140.

I think the focus on his weight is fool's gold.

For the average population 5'7 160lbs is not fat.

You're asking this dude to lose 20lbs at 5'7'...that is a ton of weight.

As a comparison when I was running my best I was 5'5.5", 143lbs. Ran 4:27, 9:32, 15:47, 1:09:40, 2:32:40. Did skinnier runners beat me? Sure. Did I beat skinnier runners? Yes. Was weight the reason? Not at all.

Without seeing what this guy actually looks like we can not make the determination that he needs to lose weight.

What he needs to do is train. Train TRAIN.

20-25 miles is nothing. He's been "running" for 2+ years and only putting in 20-25 miles.

I stick with my key points in order of IMPORTANCE.

#1: Train. Put in miles. Hit the pavement or trails. Run more. Run more farther. Run more faster. Take 1 day of complete recovery...you're 27 not 17.

#2: Run fast. A mile is short by distance standards. You need some interval based speed training.

#3: Endurance. Tempo runs. It's easy to run long. It's easy to run fast. It's harder to run moderately fast for a moderate distance.

#4: Overall conditioning and strength. Strength will keep you in it longer without getting hurt. Strength, without added muscle, will ensure you get the most out of every muscle contraction.

Alan

I agree with Alan, except with more emphasis on the speed. High schoolers have speed coming out of their nostrils, but if you're 27 and have only been jogging for a few years you have to learn to run fast. It will improve your technique as well. Do most of it up hills, and you'll get that muscular benefit with less weight pounding on your legs. And of course increase your mileage.

Weight will take care of itself.

Runningart2004 wrote:

I think the focus on his weight is fool's gold.

Your times were good but not exceptional, and your story proves that weight is important.

The more weight you gained the slower you got.

You're a lot slower now than you were at 143 pounds.

5'7" 160 is a little hefty and without superior genes (which is evident), improvement will be slower absent weight loss.

I'm 6' 165 and not at all emaciated.If I were what? 190? Yeesh I hate to think what I might run.

Sub 5 is not realistic, imo, sorry.

Sub 5:15 is probably not realistic.

Sub 5:30 may be possible and plenty of good advice has been given on training.

I'd say aim for sub 6 as a realistic goal. Get your 5k to sub 20 or even 20:30 and sub 6 should be doable. Measure your 5k progress (fitness) on fast, flat courses. Disregard times for hilly courses, very hot days etc.

Try to run 6 days a week also, imo. Days off are no bueno. Even if its just a couple of easy miles, I feel more ready to run hard on workout days if I'm not taking days off.

Proves the point wrote:

You're a lot slower now than you were at 143 pounds.

Let me guess, he also runs a lot less.

Proves the point wrote:

Runningart2004 wrote:

I think the focus on his weight is fool's gold.

Your times were good but not exceptional, and your story proves that weight is important.

The more weight you gained the slower you got.

You're a lot slower now than you were at 143 pounds.

I also don't run 100 miles a week and put on about 20lbs of muscle. I also don't race anymore.

If you train then weight will take care of itself. Your weight is a function of your training, not the other way around.

I also ran my third fastest 5k at a heavier weight than normal (+5lbs) back in the day.

Alan

Is OP male or female? I don't recall seeing it mentioned. Seems like that would make a difference.

I only ask because they said they started out at a 10 min mile. My brain has a hard time with a 5'7" 160 man at 27 years old running a mile all out and not getting under the 10 min mark.

Greased Lightning wrote:

Is OP male or female? I don't recall seeing it mentioned. Seems like that would make a difference.

I only ask because they said they started out at a 10 min mile. My brain has a hard time with a 5'7" 160 man at 27 years old running a mile all out and not getting under the 10 min mark.

He also never said what he weighed when he started. He started at 10:00 mile...he currently weighs 160lb. 2+ years ago he could have easily been 200lbs.

Alan

Runningart2004 wrote:

He also never said what he weighed when he started. He started at 10:00 mile...he currently weighs 160lb. 2+ years ago he could have easily been 200lbs.

That should have made him much faster.

Maybe he's slow now (though faster) because he lost too much weight, and should gain it all back. With the extra 50 pounds of muscles (or fat or whatever), then he'll be much faster again, i.e. back to 10 minute pace.

If you want to improve, you've got to put in more workouts. AND, change them up. Not always 400's and 800's, different rests, ladders, etc... Change the workouts. I would do 3 workouts a week. For a few weeks do longer reps, like 5-6x 1000m (2 min rest), 2x2000 (3 min) 1x1000 (2min), and also my favorite 3x (1000, (2min), 600, (3min)). After a few weeks of longer intervals and some 15-25 min tempos, slowly shorten the intervals while keeping your rest days at atleast 40 min. I love 500's mixed with 300's for mile training, and a sample workout of 5-6x (500, (1min) 300, (3min)) 2 weeks out of the race try doiing 16-20x 200m with 1 min rest, and 3 min after each set of 4. This is purely me using my past successes to put out a way for you ro EASILY get into the low 5's.....But only if you're very focused and you embrace hard work.

For the record i'm not overweight. I'm 160 lbs stocky 12%. Now 12% BF isn't skinny as shit but i have an athletic build.

#1: One day, run long. How long? Longer than you are currently running. Increase 1 mile per week until you are running 8-10 miles in a single run.

#2: Twice per week run fast. How Fast? I don't care. One day make it really fast. 400s, 800s plus some short 50-100m all out sprints at the end. How many? I don't care. 2 miles worth is a good number to start with. So 8 x 400m or 4 x 800m. One day make it hard sustained run. How long? I don't care, at least a mile. How fast? Faster than a normal run. Slower than a sprint.

#3: Run more often. How often? I don't care. More than you are now. 5 days week. 6 days a week. At least take one day completely off. Drink beer. Rest. Do other recreational activities.

good advice

you need the genetics to run that fast. No matter how hard you train, if you don't have the genes, sub 5 is not likely. I ran sub five as a 15-year old, but genetics played a huge role, I will admit.

Be patient like nik wilis

J.R. wrote:

Nope wrote:

Ideal distance runner weight for you is around 125-130.

I agree with this. At least get down to 140.

Correct. That will raise his crucial V02 max number. Looks like you are starting to get it.