Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin", or "

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  • hockey player
    10 years ago 08/05/2009 8:38am CDT
    re: albert
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    Hi all, just thought I'd post another update on my rehab.

    I am 4 weeks post-op with Meyers. During the past week I have kept up with the regular rehab protocol exercises and added the following activities:

    • Increased the pace on my 1-mile jogs so that they are now real "runs" and not jogs

    • Began 50-yard sprints (about 8-8.5 pace on the treadmill -- not the absolute fastest I can go, but a pretty good clip) in the middle of my runs (about 3-4 per 1-mile run)

    • Started freestyle-stroke swimming without pain (previously when I tried to swim after doing the pool exercises I had to stop because of RA pain). The first half-lap I did without pain brought a huge smile to my face!

    • Increased the weight on upper-body exercises like tricep extensions, rear delt rows, seated chest flys, standing bicep curls

    • Started regularly lifting heavier objects -- like my 3-year-old daughter (really missed doing that), garbage bags, miscellaneous household cores

    • Felt less pain day-to-day and gained a lot more flexibility. I think this is the result of doing a lot of psoas stretching and pelvic tilts. The psoas and RA were still really tight and tender until only a few days ago. I started doing a psoas stretch that entails bending one knee in front of you (knee over ankle) and touching the other knee to the ground behind you, with the portion of that leg that is below the knee almost entirely touching the floor. Your hands go on the floor on either side of the front foot, like a sprinter in the starting position. These have been a huge help.

    I am more confident than ever that I will make a full recovery and play hockey again. I am going to try some light skating this weekend and will let you all know how it goes.

    I have found that pushing myself, within reason, usually yields benefits in terms of greater flexibility and less pain and stiffness. Also, to JC's point, varying my routine so that I'm not doing the same things (other than stretching, pelvic tilts and adductor massage) every day.

    Congrats to JC, Albert and everyone else making strides in their rehabs and good luck to all in getting well. We will kick this thing, folks!
  • Surf
    registered
    10 years ago 08/05/2009 10:23am CDT
    re: hockey player
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    Hockey Player,

    Your progress is just excellent, and is good news for all of us. And the details are helpful to me and probably everybody as all of us evolve and adjust our ideas about rehab. We needed some good news around here.

    I too am making noticeable progress but not nearly as fast as you. I'm thinking the nature of rehab follows an S-curve, like this:

    S-CURVE
    http://a.imagehost.org/0189/S-Curve.jpg

    In this S-Curve perspective, the flat part of the curve near the beginning is a bitch. The body is so weak and the progress so slow, and the emotions so unrewarded, day after day, week after week.

    If one can persevere into the slightly upward part of the curve, then the progress finally become noticeable, almost every day. That's where I am.

    You, Hockey Player, it seems to me, have successfully gotten into the steep part of the curve, where your new-found strength allows you to gain even more strength. Seeing you do that gives me hope that I can do it, too, without surgery. But if I fail, then at least I can then fall back on surgery as a last resort.

    By the way did you have bilateral repairs?
  • tiff
    registered
    10 years ago 08/05/2009 2:58pm CDT
    re: Surf
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    Hello all -
    I am at week 4 along w/ Hockey Player. Today I had my first visit w/ the FMS personal trainer and am hopeful that will work for me as well as it did for Albert. He is rather cautious b ut promises it will pick up pace fast.

    I tried to get ART done on Monday but the chiroparctor sent me away b/c he said my incision area was still way too hard and I need 4 more weeks. This is so curious to me b/c the rehba protocol Den gave me for the pro hockey team is MUCH more cautious than Meyers' and they suggest ART at 3 weeks. When I asked Meyers when I should get ART - his response was "a while". Not entirely helpful on that one.

    But the chiro did suggest I get ultrasound or electric stim asap to help the healing process. Also - he was specific about using moist heat on the incision area. I was just using a regular old heating pad.

    I appreicate the advice about pushing it - I have gotten so many differeing opinions about how fast to take it. I have been very cautious whenever I feel pain. I think Albert is right in that it is realy hard not to get alarmed. After all we have been thru the idea of undoing the surgeon's work is scary! As I cannot talk to Meyers - I did ask his massage therapist about it - and she said that in 2 years of working w/ him she has never seen one person undo the surgery. Good news!

    At 4 week I am:

    walking 5-6 miles a day

    pool exercises (walking front,back,side/cariocas/scissors (I didn't know what this was so I am just doing it as abduction across the midline in front and back and it seems to really get at my adducotrs, leg swings, jumping jacks,heel raises)

    Swimming - few laps w/ just legs flutter kicks, few freestyle, few breath stroke

    Lower body - hip ab,ad,ext,flex w/weigts/lunges/suats/single leg deadlifts/knee felxion and extension w/ weights/ab and adduction w/ theraband/etc

    Upper body - weights 20-30 minutes as well as dips - have not tried push ups yet

    Abs -I can do crunches (only about 10 a day) but I am trying not to do too much flexion (FMS guy agreed that is not a good idea yet). But I am doing lots of other exercises that mostly work the TA (transverse abdominus)- I learned all of these in Pilates - some ex are pelvic curl, shoulder bridge (both also work hip extendors), side lift (works waist as well as TA and adducotrs)., rolling like a ball, cat stretch, etc

    Biking at least 30 minutes

    Stretching everything (HP is right about the psoas - it helped relieve the stiffness in my abs alot)

    Foam rolling everything

    Massage of adducotrs and abs (started at 3 weeks) 2x a day

    Heat and ice (after workouts)

    I was doing all of this in one day for a while there (I had to quit all my jobs since I cannot dance so I have alot of time on my hands :)But - I do agree that it is better to switch it up like others have suggested to avoid over-working one area.I have been alternating the past couple days.Either way - you really have to be willing to commit alot of time to the rehab.I am almost glad I am not able to work right now.

    I have not really been very sore at all- which is why I want to push it more. And I am starting to gain some of my muscle again (I had lost 8 punds of muxcle in only 3 weeks!)

    SURF - For ab work - check into pilates - I am sure there are tons of demos on youtube. But beware of expert village - they don't have a clue (definitely not experts!)Alot of the repetoire is ab flexion which you want to stay away form - but the rest of it would be great.PS - I have not heard of the movie you mentioned - I'll have to look inot it. Yes - dance is a blood sport :)

    JC - thanks for the info on the supplements! Yes - standing still is still really tough for me too - esp for back pain.

    ALBERT- It is interesting that you mention this stretching technique b/c just to day the FMS guy was telling me to stop static strecthing! Let us know how it works out for you.

    as always - thansk for all the great info and insight
  • Sam in Denver
    10 years ago 08/05/2009 5:24pm CDT
    re: JCsportsman
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    Thanks for the advice, JC. I will mention that to my surgeon before the operation. He mentioned that he would take a look around my groin (on both sides) to see if there were any other injuries that needed to be repaired surgically. The radiologist that looked at my MRI assured me there were no tears. After reading through this forum, that obviously doesn't mean there aren't any tears. I'm frustrated that they didn't tell me this after reviewing my MRI.
  • Surf
    registered
    10 years ago 08/05/2009 9:35pm CDT
    re: Sam in Denver
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    SAM,
    Michael Boyle is a well-known sports physical trainer/therapist. He's been around a lot of athletes and injuries and surgeries. He is very much against the kind of exploratory surgery you're considering.

    Michael Boyle wrote:
    Things to Avoid.

    Avoid the surgeon. Surgeons do surgery. It is their business. Doctors work on what I call the 1-2-3 model or the three I's.

    Ingest- anti-inflammatories
    Inject- more anti-inflammatories
    Incise- we all know what that means.

    We want to avoid the 1-2-3 Model. If you keep going back and saying you are not improving, you will get surgery. Surgery should be the last resort. That means if you have not really committed to proper rehab avoid surgery. As we mentioned in part one some therapists theorize that the forced lay-off and attention to rehab post-surgery rather than pre-surgery is what actually helps. If athletes were willing to take time off and listen to the trainers and therapists, innumerable surgeries could be avoided. I have seen at least three professional athletes who were scheduled for surgery avoid it by committing to a proper rehab program of exercises and soft tissue work.

    Never let a Doctor go in and "take a look around". That means they are unsure but, want to do surgery anyway. Usually this means they will go in, repair any small tear they see and often "release" the adductors. This in my mind only makes more scar tissue.

    My feeling and the feeling of many of many therapist colleagues is that "sports hernia" surgery will be like the lateral release in the patella femoral joint, a surgery that had limited success and thankfully eventually went out of style.

    Here's the link to the article.
    http://www.strengthcoach.com/public/1606.cfm

    Even Dr. Meyer's paper says there is a credible study in [Yugoslavia] the demonstrates that sports hernia tears will heal on their own if given enough time. That study said 60% of the patients healed in 3-5 years. I myself have a tear in my lower abdomen and it is healing on its own, without surgery. After 5 months of slow progress, I'm now starting to see accelerated, solid gains.

    If you're still in college, you probably haven't gotten into the real world, where you'll eventually realize that things often don't go as planned. That's especially true of complex things, and even more true of sports hernia surgery. It would be a good investment of your time to spend roughly 10 - 12 hours reading all 2,785 posts in this huge thread before you talk to any surgeons at all.

    When you read some of the broken hearts of people that had surgery for sports hernia, you'll realize that surgery for sports hernia may, or may not, be the appropriate decision. But in neither case is it a panacea.

    Now is not the time to be in a rush. Take your time, talk it over with some good friends, think it over some more. Invest the time to read all 2,785 posts, of people here going back to 9/9/2004. Don't rush such an important, irreversible decision.

    Hoping you recover solidly and quickly.
  • Albert
    registered
    10 years ago 08/05/2009 9:52pm CDT
    re: Surf
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    Lets be clear instead of clouding the facts for this young man:

    #1 - Boyles does not specify what type of surgery he is for
    #2 - Surf is undiagnosed...he is guessing he has it
    #3 - I would call Dr. Brown on the west coast...he is similar to Meyers
    #4 - Surf is merely guessing when it comes to adductors. I had my released 13 weeks ago and i feel great
    #5 - It is not necessary to go back to 2004 because many docs who are not experts are highlighted and 5 years is a long time to fine tune this surgery.
    #6 -60% in 5 years sucks....
    #7 - Make sure you implicitly trust your physician. If he has not done these and can show you examples...do not walk....run away....Call Brown anyways...
    #8 - If you have a complete tear of the RA you will never heal without surgery (meyers)

    *good luck....If i were you JC, HP, Tiff, Den, Rem among others are great contributors to this thread and their experiences are to be trusted. They have been treated and are under supervised rehab....
  • Albert
    registered
    10 years ago 08/05/2009 10:35pm CDT
    re: tiff
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    tiff-

    Here is my update regarding AIS......PHENOMINAL

    Highlights:

    1) reduced my PF pain from a 9 to a 1....and showed me how
    2) increased my flexibility by 35-45% and showed me how to do it
    3) showed me what muscle was not working and causing my interior leg injuries and why my magnus was seizing up and causing opp side TFL, Glute, Calf, QL tightening... (it was the vaselus medialus (spelling bad?)....
    4) showed me how Closed Chain training will solve my problem...whereas FMS stiff is all open chain.....but still good
    5) showed me why foam rolling can be eliminated and why sometimes it is does not good because the body protects itself
    6) saw the clinical on why static stretching is no good
    7) I was given the best psoas stretch i have ever had
    8) showed me why and how this is great for you...
    9) Isolates each muscle to show you what is strong and what is not
    10) Showed and demonstrated on me the difference with the foot in 3 positions (straight, everted, inverted)...It hits the pelvis entirely different..
    11) gave me strenghtening as well
    12) said I have strong and responsive muscles...just unstable and i would continue to reinjure until i strenghtened them...showed why i felt pain where i do....and why i keep tearing inner leg....not a coincidence
    13) recommends i should be running in 4-8 weeks....amount of time to strenghten the deficient muscles

    **THE BEST THING i have ever done...

    I also met a lead actor on Law and Order...I was cutting into his time and he allowed me to have an extra 1/2 hour.

    Jim Wharton is the founder and treats many world class athletes...Michael Johnson, US Olympic track team, NFL Players..MLB...a ton of dancers...Omeka Okafor...
    He also said my lower body reminded him of Tyrone
    Whealtey..


    Anybody wants info on a AIS therapist near you i can give it to you....I know not all are created equal but they all had to study under the founder Aaron Mattes. My guy Jim Wharton is an accomplished author and his 2 books are in Barnes and Noble. He has 25 years experience and is a kineseologist as well.

    AMAZING

    e-mail me direct if you need info...

    [email protected]

    I can not believe i will be running in 6 weeks...

    Also his lengthening reduced my MCL pain from a 4 to a 0

    Calf tear....6 to a 0


    WOW
  • Den
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 6:04am CDT
    re: tiff
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    Tiff said: I tried to get ART done on Monday but the chiroparctor sent me away b/c he said my incision area was still way too hard and I need 4 more weeks. This is so curious to me b/c the rehba protocol Den gave me for the pro hockey team is MUCH more cautious than Meyers' and they suggest ART at 3 weeks. When I asked Meyers when I should get ART - his response was "a while". Not entirely helpful on that one.



    Tiff,

    I started the ART at 4 weeks, but of course, I did not have RA tears, which makes us a little different. My incision was very hard at that time also. And when he started working in that area, it got very red and inflamed during the second or third treatment. It scared me a little bit because I thought something went wrong. But after about two days, it went away and I loosened up a lot. My chiropractor said it was likely scar tissue breaking up. I don't know when the right time is, but I would listen to your chiro.
  • hockey player
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 7:21am CDT
    re: Surf
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    Thanks, Surf. I did have bilateral RA repair, no adductor release.
  • hockey player
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 8:23am CDT
    re: tiff
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    Tiff, that is quite an impressive routine! Glad to hear you are making such great progress.

    One question -- when did you first try abdominal crunches? I still get a bit of RA pain (strangely, on my left side which was the less torn of the two) when doing pelvic tilts and some other stuff, so I've been reluctant to attempt anything more aggressive with the abs.

    Thanks.
  • Albert
    registered
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 8:32am CDT
    re: hockey player
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    HP-

    Let your body be your guide on these. I only had one side done but i had a full detachment...Pelvic tilts were always real tight and now are fine. I still think your compartment is getting more and more stable and the pain will bounce. Our bodies are always adapting.

    The 2 things that were always scary for me were:

    #1 Swimming which i attempted at 3 & 4 week mark with pain...so i stopped...but was able to do at 6 weeks with no RA pain

    #2 Crunches...I was not able to do them until week 6 or 7 for me. Mainly becuase I was nervous and had a lot of inflammation from reaction to stitches. But when i did them I made sure my feet were elevated on a bench to make sure my pelvis was stable. I did 5 strict....no problem...Now I can do sets of 20 with my feet on the ground. i do not do situps...not because they would hurt...I just do not believe in them for abs.

    I just talked to Meyers today and I told him I still get some higher up RA discomfort in the a.m. or when really trying new stuff. I told him i still get inflammation but not much. He says for my injury that was normal.

    HP-
    You are only 4 weeks out and your surgical sites are still healing. i would not be concerned. I think you are healing amazingly.
    Good luck on the light skate....No slapshots
  • Surf
    registered
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 8:50am CDT
    re: Sam in Denver
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    SAM,

    Here's another interesting thread.

    http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?board=1&id=1669196&thread=1665375

    I just don't know what you should do. Perhaps yours is an easily-fixed situation by your doctor, I just don't know. Please take everything I say with a grain of salt.

    Wishing you a speedy recovery.
  • Sam in Denver
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 3:35pm CDT
    re: Surf
    Forum Index
    Thanks for your help and concern, Surf. I wish I had more time to let this heal on its own, without surgery, or to get another opinion from more qualified doctors. I'm hoping my Dr. can get this fixed, but I'm starting to worry about where I would be if he didn't. I don't have more time to let it heal on its own. I'll be a junior next year and only have 2 years of athletic eligibility left. My only other option would be to wait and go see Dr. Meyers or Dr. UM, paying out of pocket (which I cannot afford). Even if I could, the process would take long and recovery could run into my season and I really don't want to miss games this year.

    The only reason I am confident in my operation tomorrow is that my pain is very bearable. I am still able to play basketball and lift (with the exception of leg lifts) but my groin gets pretty sore towards the end of workouts, especially when I do abdominal exercises. Compared to a lot of cases on this forum, I would say that my case is very mild. I can play through my pain, but basketball season is too long and too much pounding to play through (September - March, 6 month season!).

    I have considered waiting and red shirting this year, but only as a last resort. That would still be a possibility if my surgery tomorrow does not seem to fix my pain after a couple months.

    I'm very frustrated. My coach and parents are pushing me to find the quickest fix for financial reasons. I'm hoping and praying things go well tomorrow, I'll let you know how the operation goes.

    Thanks,
    Sam
  • Surf
    registered
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 5:55pm CDT
    re: Sam in Denver
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    SAM,
    It sounds like you have a good doctor. I think you'll do very well.
  • JCsportsman
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 5:58pm CDT
    re: Sam in Denver
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    Sam good luck tomorrow......the good thing is your surgeon is going to take a look around in there......thats the only surefire way to see if there is any further damage going on.....MRI's do 2 things........they will miss things.....and they will show more then thats really there...Good luck!!!
  • Albert
    registered
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 6:38pm CDT
    re: Sam in Denver
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    Sam-

    You are young and strong. This will be a minor bump in the road for you. Chances are since you are still functional it will be minor. Just listen to your body after surgery and let that be your guide. good luck and God bless
  • JC sportsman
    10 years ago 08/06/2009 8:44pm CDT
    re: albert
    Forum Index
    started doing sprints yesterday and today......not bad...I find slowing down at the end of the sprint to be a bit painful...but pretty good thru the sprint....have some secondary right shin and foot pain that I will have to pay attention too......I bought a few pairs of a more flexable sneaker to see how that works on my walks and runs over the next week

    PAINS: My incisions are still very tender with that burning type of pain...especially to the touch

    Swelling in pubic area is starting to slowly go down...had 2 real good days with hardly any pain Tues and Wed.....today was a more painful day but was better after I did my running

    I could really feel both RA areas from all the rehab I have been doing...kiind of a deep sore...more to the touch...and they get tight...but it all seems postive from all the work Ive been doing...

    Adductors pain and tightness comes and goes and isnt bothersome too much at all

    Right now Im battling a possible stomach Flu so its making rehab/sleeping/eating even harder but not stopping me...hopefully it will resolve soon or it may have to be a trip to the Doc ughh

    MY REHAB:
    AM: Pool
    Walk back and forth 40x
    run back and forth 20x
    side steps back and forth in place 20x
    side steps across pool 20x
    Crossovers 10x
    side stepping/running 10x (like running back for a flyball)
    jumping jacks 2x10
    scissors 20x
    Leg swings (4 way hip stuff) 30x each

    Walking....sometimes Ill do a mile am walk ( all hills and some stairs)

    AFTERNOON:
    Walk 1 mile
    Lite Jog 1/2 mile
    Run Bases both ways 4x (3-4x per week)
    Sprints 30 yards 6-10x

    PM:
    All stretching
    Heel Raises 30x
    Lunges 2 x 10
    Partial Squats 30x
    Pelvic tilts 10-20x
    A few other things from Egoscue and Z health that I throw in

    OTHER:
    Next week I will start:
    Gym 3-4x per week
    Backward jogs/runs
    Dry swings with the bat both ways 3x/week
    Soft Toss a ball 2-3x/week
    May try some upper body stuff

    Like Tiff I dropped weight....about 10lbs.....mostly muscle....I dropped a quick 5 from surgery week....then the rest from burning calories with all the rehab stuff and not being able to do my upper body stuff.....def lost upper body muscle tone .....amazing how quick it goes when you stop working out...this stomach flu thing or whatever I have isnt helping either....guess its probably better to be a little lighter at this point.....Plus I dont need the extra weight or muscle at this time like I usually need to smack the ball around

    So far so good....Im further then I thought I would be at this point....but this is definitly not a steady climb up the ladder of improvement.....Inflamation, swelling and soreness comes and goes to set you back here and there......Just part of the Rehab process
  • alexmelbourne
    10 years ago 08/07/2009 9:54pm CDT
    re: JC sportsman
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    hi guys

    just need some advice if anyone is willing to help me out

    ill just explain my situation then ill ask the questions

    i initially had an inguinal hernia reapir done 5 weeks ago. to this day i would say im doing ok, only pain i have hear and there is in the lower left back and also in my left glut (not sure bout spelling). i havent started doin anything strenious like running or lifting just so i can prolong the recovery. i saw my surgeon last week and he examined me and said that im rite to start normal day activity.

    ok the questions i have are :

    1. how long do you recommend till i start to do strenious activity etc soccer, basketball, gym ???

    2. is my pain in my left glut, lower back part of the hernia or something else ????

    3. should i commence pool, stretching before i start running ???
  • Albert
    registered
    10 years ago 08/07/2009 10:35pm CDT
    re: alexmelbourne
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    Alex-

    I would let pain be your guide. Many times there is an overcompensation from the opposing side and when the surgery is over you are left with an imbalance/overworked and weak side.

    Make sure you do good stretching and core work..

    I am 13 weeks post op and since i was injured for 4.5 years i have my whole kinetic chain on the opposite side that is sore...glute..low back....adductors....knee...all the way down...just takes time...

    You can not go wrong in the pool
  • JCsportsman
    10 years ago 08/07/2009 10:44pm CDT
    re: alexmelbourne
    Forum Index
    Honestly your Doctor should answer those since he knows exaclty what he fixed.....but If I were you I would start off by going to a good Physical therapist,tell them the surgery you had and let them check you out. They will be able to give you the correct exercises for where your body is at. Just call your Doc and tell him you want a perscription for Physical therapy and that is all you need to get started....

    My guesses are you glute and low back pain are from compensation from either pre or post surgery or both.......and I wouldnt jsut go out and start running or playing sports day 1....starting off in the pool is a great start....kind of surprised your Doc didnt give you any guidelines ....good luck