Sprinter to Distance : My quest to run sub 2

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  • joeguy
    registered
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 3:04pm CDT
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    I am a pure sprinter - that is, I run 100's and 200's. Recently I have become plagued with injuries, uninspired and wanting to give it up. I have not PR'd in a long time and need a new challenges.

    Rather then retire completely I thought I would take a stab at this distance running thing and see what I can do. I have always enjoyed the distance running crowd and community and revel in movies like "without limits" , I have always thought I may have had some talent in distance running but never really explored it as an option and I'll regret it if I don't before I retire.

    My Stats:

    100m - 10.69
    200m - 21.39
    27 years old

    I have never run over 300m in practice except for very slow 400m jog warm ups and once a 500m time trial. I did some long distance running as a kid and was pretty active but rarely go hiking, biking etc nowadays - only sprints and gyms.

    My Goal:

    To break 2 minutes in an 800m next summer and run a mile as fast as I can and not suck at distance running.

    I bought a heart rate monitor (wow those things are expensive) and am ready to take this seriously. My plan is to take 8 weeks to build mileage from 20mpw to 65mpw take a week off easy jogging and then start in on a full program mid august. So be prepared to laugh at the sprinter.. and here..we..go....


    Thursday May 19

    1 mile in morning @ 7:50
    1 mile at night @ 8:00

    Heart rate reached 184 for 2nd run and 182 for first - runs did not feel particularly hard so why was my heart rate so high? I read a little bit and for easy runs apparently you should be in about the 140-150 zone? should I be doing these even slower to start?

    Friday May 20

    2 miles (with 400m walk half way) @7:30 pace . heart rate skied to 188!! But didn't feel all that hard again. tips? Might do another mile or 2 tonight. My plan is 2,3,2,3,2,3 for 15 miles this week to start things off
  • speaking up
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 3:22pm CDT
    re: joeguy
    Forum Index
    Here's the problem - you're too fast. 21.4? Damn. You're probably a 400/800 guy, which actually means you should train more like a long sprinter than a distance runner.

    If you were 1.5 to 2 seconds slower, it might suggest you have the physiology to be a 800/1500 guy, and they train more like distance runners.

    But 400/800? 65 mpw with long runs, doubles, tempos, all that jazz is not for you. You're no Prefontaine. Sorry to burst your distance running bubble. The good news is realistically you could be aiming for sub-1:50 rather than sub-2:00.

    Or you can go ahead and be a distance runner but I think you'll be mediocre. You're too fast twitchy.
  • joeguy
    registered
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 3:48pm CDT
    re: speaking up
    Forum Index
    well I would probably look at training for a 400m however I am done with sprinting. It is either retire completely or do something entirely different to challenge myself.

    And I would tend to perhaps agree with you theoretically with the fast to slow twitch ratio however look at guys like Gary Reed. This guy was pure fast twitch - decathlete and mid 21 200m runner that switched to doing lots of mileage and I would say that turned out pretty well. Not saying I am any Gary Reed but I don't think it is impossible for me to get decently fit.
  • more info needed
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 3:55pm CDT
    re: joeguy
    Forum Index
    1.How old were you when you ran the 10.69 and 21.39?

    2. If you were 18 then you have lost a step or two for sure but i think you can still break 2. If you ran those in college you will break two eventually. Those are fast f***in times. Taking 8 weeks to sky rocket up to 65 will be hard. Hopefully more people post on here to give their input on how you should progress with the mileage.

    joeguy wrote:

    1. I have not PR'd in a long time and need a new challenges.


    2. My Goal:

    To break 2 minutes in an 800m next summer and run a mile as fast as I can and not suck at distance running.
  • steve "red"
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 4:52pm CDT
    re: joeguy
    Forum Index
    You do not need 65 mpw inless you want to run the marathon. Sub 2 on 20-25 mpw is doable. Wariner can run sub 2 and sub 4:30 and your sprint times aren't that muuch slower although your 400 is probably a couple of seconds slower. I will be shocked if you don't run mid 1:50's soon and sub 1:50 next year.
  • A Skeptic
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 5:29pm CDT
    re: steve "red"
    Forum Index
    65 a week? We had kids at my old high school who went 2:00 off of 15-20 a week, and none of them could go 10.69. Just do some intervals two or three days a week, jog 5 miles on easy days and you ought to be able to sneak under two pretty quick, provided you aren't totally and completely out of shape.
  • rerrfgergrge
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 6:01pm CDT
    re: steve "red"
    Forum Index
    steve "red" wrote:

    Wariner can run sub 2 and sub 4:30

    Uh no, I'd give him sub 2 if he had a year to train for it but the guy would not hit sub 430.
  • Limpy McGimpy
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 6:17pm CDT
    re: rerrfgergrge
    Forum Index
    4/10. No true sprinter (not even a 400 time) would have a f***ing clue who Gary Reed was, much less his backround/training, etc..

    Nice set up, no cigar.
  • A Skeptic
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 6:51pm CDT
    re: rerrfgergrge
    Forum Index
    rerrfgergrge wrote:

    steve "red" wrote:

    Wariner can run sub 2 and sub 4:30

    Uh no, I'd give him sub 2 if he had a year to train for it but the guy would not hit sub 430.


    What makes you say that? Wariner may not be able to go 4:30 just at the drop of a hat, but it's hard to believe that he couldn't do it if he trained for it. And he could definitely go sub 2.
  • steve "red"
    8 years ago 05/20/2011 9:44pm CDT
    re: rerrfgergrge
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    Wariner ran 2:25.x for 1000 meters a couple years ago
  • joeguy
    registered
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 12:36am CDT
    re: Limpy McGimpy
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    I'm Canadian so obviously I know who Gary Reed is and I've heard him talk about his background before, plus I hang out with the distance guys I went to uni with and they love him.

    I think Wariner could easily go sub 2 at any time. An Australian 400m runner I know went 1:56 just to see what he could do for fun in an 8 and he is a 45. guy compared to Wariner 44-43 .

    So you say 25 miles a week?? What about in the offseason (right now for me)
  • rOPOPO
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 1:08am CDT
    re: Limpy McGimpy
    Forum Index
    [quote]Limpy McGimpy wrote:

    4/10. No true sprinter (not even a 400 time) would have a f***ing clue who Gary Reed was, much less his backround/training, etc..

    Nice set up, no cigar.[/quot

    1/10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
  • steve "red"
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 7:39am CDT
    re: rOPOPO
    Forum Index
    Gary Reed is somewhat a household name in track and feild, from a few years back. I believe retired, but was a medalist at worlds and anyone who follows track may have heard of him. He was pretty good.
  • kipketer
    registered
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 9:02am CDT
    re: joeguy
    Forum Index
    If you have natural speed, a desire to log 65mph, and are committed to getting better I think you could run a whole range of events and do very well.

    But whatever you decide, don't neglect your speed. Spend a session a week on some shorter repeats and a session on speed development.
  • Limpy McGimpy
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 9:54am CDT
    re: steve "red"
    Forum Index
    Household name- maybe in Kelowna B.C., and that's a stretch.


    steve "red" wrote:

    Gary Reed is somewhat a household name in track and feild, from a few years back. I believe retired, but was a medalist at worlds and anyone who follows track may have heard of him. He was pretty good.
  • Another Option
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 11:34am CDT
    re: joeguy
    Forum Index
    Here's the thing. I don't think you need to run anywhere near 65 mpw to get under 2:00 for 800 if you are still capable of those kind of sprint times. I think your quest is going to come down to motivation to do the extended anaerobic work and the desire to hurt for the entire 2nd lap. Most accomplished sprinters I know have neither of those traits.

    I think there's a big difference between what you really need to run under 2:00 and what might make you happy. If you have friends that are distance runners and like running with them, go do the 65 mpw - it's about an hour of running each day, not really a big deal. It doesn't sound like your goal has anything to do with making the olympics or even the olympic trials, so go do what's going to make you happy and realize that's probably more than what's necessary to achieve your sub 2:00 goal.
  • no one
    registered
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 12:23pm CDT
    re: joeguy
    Forum Index
    35 yrs ago (yikes) there was a guy who was a sprinter (ran 100y in ~ as I recall). He converted to mid distance 400-800 guy, doing quite well (45.xx and 1:44.xx). Training = 35-45 miles.
  • Coach RT
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 1:01pm CDT
    re: joeguy
    Forum Index
    joeguy wrote:

    I am a pure sprinter - that is, I run 100's and 200's. Recently I have become plagued with injuries, uninspired and wanting to give it up. I have not PR'd in a long time and need a new challenges.

    Rather then retire completely I thought I would take a stab at this distance running thing and see what I can do. I have always enjoyed the distance running crowd and community and revel in movies like "without limits" , I have always thought I may have had some talent in distance running but never really explored it as an option and I'll regret it if I don't before I retire.

    My Stats:

    100m - 10.69
    200m - 21.39
    27 years old

    I have never run over 300m in practice except for very slow 400m jog warm ups and once a 500m time trial. I did some long distance running as a kid and was pretty active but rarely go hiking, biking etc nowadays - only sprints and gyms.

    My Goal:

    To break 2 minutes in an 800m next summer and run a mile as fast as I can and not suck at distance running.

    I bought a heart rate monitor (wow those things are expensive) and am ready to take this seriously. My plan is to take 8 weeks to build mileage from 20mpw to 65mpw take a week off easy jogging and then start in on a full program mid august. So be prepared to laugh at the sprinter.. and here..we..go....


    Thursday May 19

    1 mile in morning @ 7:50
    1 mile at night @ 8:00

    Heart rate reached 184 for 2nd run and 182 for first - runs did not feel particularly hard so why was my heart rate so high? I read a little bit and for easy runs apparently you should be in about the 140-150 zone? should I be doing these even slower to start?

    Friday May 20

    2 miles (with 400m walk half way) @7:30 pace . heart rate skied to 188!! But didn't feel all that hard again. tips? Might do another mile or 2 tonight. My plan is 2,3,2,3,2,3 for 15 miles this week to start things off

    I work with guys moving up all the time. If you need help post your e-mail!!
  • joeguy
    registered
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 3:41pm CDT
    re: no one
    Forum Index
    Sat

    Today ran 4 miles! New record - slowed it down to almost 9min mile pace to make it an "easy" run. heart rate was 173-177 throughout. I know that seems very high and my distance running buddy laughed at me but it feels pretty easy this pace, not sure why the heart rate is so high??

    4 miles @ 8:50 (35:16 total time)
  • J.R.
    8 years ago 05/21/2011 7:15pm CDT
    re: joeguy
    Forum Index
    Here are my suggestions, from having done this before, thought I wasn't as blazing fast as you.

    #1- I'd ignore the heart rates, and not use a heart rate monitor at at all;

    #2- Ignore whatever percentage of various fibers. The are highly amenable to different types of training;

    #3- Realize you can run any event that you want to run, and run well;

    I'd start by running a lot of 2, 3 and 4 milers, gradually transitioning to twice a day, or ten or eleven times a week. Also gradually increase your miles. Again, I'd totally forget about using a heart rate monitor! The more important things are your body's adaptions to the training.

    You can do it! I'm interested and will keep watching your progress.