German Fernandez in Texas Relays!

"Dude",The times I listed from Lowe's HS career were set in the spring of 2008from the spring of 2008 to the spring of 2009 is 1 yearfrom the spring of 2009 to spring of 2010 is 2 yearsfrom the spring of 2010 to now is 3 yearsIt's funny that you Smith supporters resort to arguing particulars such as this instead of recognizing the fact that he is a snake oil salesman that doesn't rate to be coaching these talents. Having gotten Fernandez on his team got the other runners on the team. And having them all on the team is what won championships. Not his coaching.

blort wrote:

Dude,

He is IN his 3rd year. That means that right now he has 2.5 years at OK State. When he finishes this year, THEN it is 3 years.

Get it. When you are a freshman, you are IN your first year, but you don't have 1 year yet. When you are a soph you are in your 2nd year, and you have 1 year in the program. When you are a junior??

Get it now. I'm going slow, cuz you are seemingly a bit slow on the uptake.

MichaelMatthews wrote:

It's funny that you Smith supporters resort to arguing particulars such as this instead of recognizing the fact that he is a snake oil salesman that doesn't rate to be coaching these talents. Having gotten Fernandez on his team got the other runners on the team. And having them all on the team is what won championships. Not his coaching.

You do realize that OK State came in 3rd in NCAAs the year BEFORE German joined them, don't you. The all-american/all-world recruits on that team pretty much boiled down to Ryan Vail who, by the accounts of most unbiased observers, progressed remarkably well through his days at OK State.

Hmmmmmm

Ryan Vail ran 1:54, 3:53(1500)and 8:30(3k) in Highschool

after FIVE YEARS at OSU his prs were: 1:54,3:44(1500) 4:06, 7:52(3k) 13:37

based off his HS 1500 time he could have run 14:23 according to the Macmillan calculator

So, about 50 seconds improvement over 5k over 5 years. And essentially no improvement over his 800/mile times and about a 40 second improvement over 3k.

This isn't incredible considering it took 5 years. But the end result of 13:37 for 5k and 7:52 for 3k is a top time for sure, no denying that.

Unfortunately top coaches are taking runners like Ryan Vail in one or two years to the level he reached in 5 years under coach smith.

This was smith's greatest accomplishment and it's not impressive. Certainly not worthy of handling a talent such as Fernandez.

You said this:

"And do you not think Colby Lowe's HS coach could have taken a minute off his 10k with one more year of training? This took him 4 years at OSU to do."

Colby has not been at OSU for 4 year, and not 3 years. He has been there 2.5 years. As soon as he finishes this year, it will be 3 years at OSU. It is simple math.

I'm not a Smith support. Nor am I a detractor. I don't know the man or his methods. Some athletes have done well under him - Vail, Lowe, German in his first year. Some not so well.

It's always hard to tell if it the coach, the athlete, or just bad luck.

Unless you have concrete inside information, it's all rampant speculation.

German has no balls..he is so used to being at the top that when he isn't he just pulls out or avoids competition..D. Smith has had very productive runners thru the years..German is the only one with so many problems..the kid ain't right..he needs to learn that he can't win all the time and he needs to be tough and every race is not easy..I see a DNS/DNF if things go bad..and in the Texas heat, I think they will

MichaelMatthews wrote:

Ryan Vail ran 1:54, 3:53(1500)and 8:30(3k) in Highschool

after FIVE YEARS at OSU his prs were: 1:54,3:44(1500) 4:06, 7:52(3k) 13:37

based off his HS 1500 time he could have run 14:23 according to the Macmillan calculator

So, about 50 seconds improvement over 5k over 5 years. And essentially no improvement over his 800/mile times and about a 40 second improvement over 3k.

This isn't incredible considering it took 5 years. But the end result of 13:37 for 5k and 7:52 for 3k is a top time for sure, no denying that.

Unfortunately top coaches are taking runners like Ryan Vail in one or two years to the level he reached in 5 years under coach smith.

This was smith's greatest accomplishment and it's not impressive. Certainly not worthy of handling a talent such as Fernandez.

All a coach can do is get his athletes to improve. 50 seconds improvement in 5k over 5 years is awesome at that level, I don't know why you seem to think it isn't impressive. These aren't D3 guys who didn't train much in HS and went from 16 to 14:30. These are top athletes who it takes some hard work and good coaching to keep the improvement curve going. Plenty of people in college don't improve and many times it is not at the fault of the coach. You have a limit that you will one day hit, from the way you talk it sounds like you haven't hit yours yet and that is awesome for you. But don't base your unrealistic expectations for others improvement and your judging of college coaches on some idea that improvement comes so easy to all. It doesn't.

blort wrote:

You said this:

"And do you not think Colby Lowe's HS coach could have taken a minute off his 10k with one more year of training? This took him 4 years at OSU to do."

Colby has not been at OSU for 4 year, and not 3 years. He has been there 2.5 years. As soon as he finishes this year, it will be 3 years at OSU. It is simple math.

I'm not a Smith support. Nor am I a detractor. I don't know the man or his methods. Some athletes have done well under him - Vail, Lowe, German in his first year. Some not so well.

It's always hard to tell if it the coach, the athlete, or just bad luck.

Unless you have concrete inside information, it's all rampant speculation.

This ^

8:30 3k (9:05 or so 2M) does not equate to 14:23 for a high school runner on low mileage. Look at the caliber of hs runner going 14:23: more like 8:50s for 2M.

HaHaYom, Blort and jjjjjjjjjjj are all right. Not sure how anyone can disagree with anything those 3 said. Not a Smith supporter or hater... just someone who looks at things objectively.

You are letting your emotions get the best of your discussion. Generally that is a trait common of women and homosexuals.And again you are arguing off-topic to try to stay in the argument for some reason.There are several college coaches in D2 and D3 turning 16 minute 5k runners into 14:30 or better 5k runners very quickly (Less than 2 years)

raise your hand if youre tired of 16-19 year old runners whove spent 6 years around the sport spouting out random stats with no background and thinking they understand whats going on...

this thread has contained nowhere near enough information to make any type of informed statement about smiths job with german or any of his runners...

How do you know about the common traits of homosexuals?

Yes we are tired of you

hmmmmmmmmmmmm wrote:

raise your hand if youre tired of 16-19 year old runners whove spent 6 years around the sport spouting out random stats with no background and thinking they understand whats going on...

this thread has contained nowhere near enough information to make any type of informed statement about smiths job with german or any of his runners...

MichaelMatthews wrote:

You are letting your emotions get the best of your discussion. Generally that is a trait common of women and homosexuals.

And again you are arguing off-topic to try to stay in the argument for some reason.

There are several college coaches in D2 and D3 turning 16 minute 5k runners into 14:30 or better 5k runners very quickly (Less than 2 years)

Emotion did not enter into my reply at all. It was impartial observation and knowledge that I have gained after being around this sport for quite some time. I know there are several college coaches in D2 or D3 getting massive improvement out of their athletes. That doesn't matter when discussing the improvement Dave Smith can get out of Ryan Vail or German Fernandez. I have the feeling that you think it does because you seem to think improvements come so easy. They don't for top athletes like Fernandez and Vail.

You can say that if they had stayed with their high school coach they would have improved the same or better amount had they gone to Smith, you have no proof of this whatsoever. So just stop trying.

PS: After your first line I know you're trolling, I'm just playing along. Loser.

"You are letting your emotions get the best of your discussion. Generally that is a trait common of women and homosexuals."

You were trolling along pretty well until this ^.

If you are to be believed, you have just publicly stated that you are a misogynist, homophobic bigot.

Naaaah! I call troll.

hmmmmmmmmmmmm wrote:

raise your hand if youre tired of 16-19 year old runners whove spent 6 years around the sport spouting out random stats with no background and thinking they understand whats going on...

this thread has contained nowhere near enough information to make any type of informed statement about smiths job with german or any of his runners...

Right on the money. There are 2 people who know the complete situation, Smith and German. The rest of us can only speculate, and it seems many on this board are wildly guessing without having any real knowledge of progression, training, as well as a complete lack of common sense.

I need to quit reading message boards, I sure hope German and others bashed frequently on here aren't reading the boards either.

I don't understand the real meaning of troll or trolling. It appears that everytime a post is made that isn't to someones liking they call them a troll. Or everytime a post is made that is not running related they're called a troll. I don't know?And I absolutely must hate women and have a fear of homosexuals if I pointed out a correlation between someone's behavior and the behavior of women and homosexuals, right?I predict that German will not run equal to or faster than the 3:55 mile he ran indoors as a freshman (which I have stated was a continued product of his HS training under his original coach) at the Texas Relays. That is of course if he even starts/finishes the race.

Nice Trolling wrote:

"You are letting your emotions get the best of your discussion. Generally that is a trait common of women and homosexuals."

You were trolling along pretty well until this ^.

If you are to be believed, you have just publicly stated that you are a misogynist, homophobic bigot.

Naaaah! I call troll.

MichaelMatthews wrote:

(which I have stated was a continued product of his HS training under his original coach)

You can make that judgement because...

"And I absolutely must hate women and have a fear of homosexuals if I pointed out a correlation between someone's behavior and the behavior of women and homosexuals, right?"

Ummmm...No.

You are publicly stating that you are a misogynist, homophobic bigot when you declare: "You are letting your emotions get the best of your discussion. Generally that is a trait common of women and homosexuals."

Is it really too complicated for you? I am not sure how much interpretation you require as you have laid it out so directly: Women and homosexuals commonly let their emotions get the best of them? Ummmm...Ignorantly stereotype much?