12x400m at 800m pace.

Can you actually do that? I'm guessing that most 2 flat half milers, for example, could not do 12x400 at 60 flat without a huge amount of recovery.

It is best to do that never. No one could pull off that workout without 10 minutes or more of rest. Can you imagine Rudish running 12 x 400 @ 51 seconds? That would be a pretty sick workout.

Well I should clarify that I am a Master hoping to run sub 2:18 next year. I think aging Masters is very different from World Class runners, don't you agree?

Lydiardisma! wrote:

Well I should clarify that I am a Master hoping to run sub 2:18 next year. I think aging Masters is very different from World Class runners, don't you agree?

I think you're an idiot. 4x400 @ 800m pace with a long recovery is a pretty tough workout. I would LOVE to see anyone attempt to do 12x400 @ 800m pace even with 10min recovery between reps.

depends on what kind of runner you are.

I've done 10x400 at 60 with 2:00 recovery, and I ran 1:57 when i did that.

at the same point in training, I could do 4x400 at 53 with 4:00 recovery.

but, I think it was a more a matter of not getting a good 800 in, as my 1500 time was MUCH better.

One of the hardest sessions that we do in the specific phase is 4x400m with 5 mins rest, where all reps are based off of goal 800m pace and a 3-sec. differential between the first and second laps. Run the first rep at the pace of the second lap, and work down to the pace of the first lap by the last rep.

For example, a runner whose goal was 1:50 would run 56/55/54/53.

This is a monster of a workout and adding even a fifth rep at that kind of pace would be a tremendously bad idea. Some runners might be able to complete it, but the downstream effects on the rest of the week's training would be serious.

It's a really, really stupid workout, but you can come close to finishing it. Back when I was in 8th grade, I had a really misinformed coach that made me run 8-12x 400 with a couple of 1:55/4:20 type high schoolers every Tuesday. My PR at the time was 2:04 and I was running the 400s at 58-62 till the last 2 or 3. We'd walk a 400 for rest with a vomit break here or there. It was so unbelievably stupid in retrospect. I'd go home sick and I wouldn't run a step till the next workout (we meet at the track 3 times a week).

If you insist on 400s at 800m pace, run 4 w/ ~5mins rest, but I'd advise a comfortable 6x200 w/ ~2-3min rest.

Do 2 X (6 X 400m) @ 800m pace with 4 min rests between reps and 48 hours between sets. If you can run 12 X 400 at 800m pace then your 800m time is not optimal. You need to race better.

I can handle 4000m worth of reps @ 3000m pace, 3200m in 1500m volume and about 2000m in 800m reps. What you are describing is a very tough 3000m workout. BTW I'm a masters runner too, 44.

either it can't be done

OR

you have severely under preformed in your 800 races, making 800 pace seem easy

if you ran 10x400 in 60 w/ 2min rest for a workout.

then ran 4x400 in 53 w/4min rest for a workout.

then ran 1:57 in a race .... you are officially the worst 800m racer to ever live. Or you lie about your workouts on the internet.

Lydiardisma! wrote:

What is a good recovery period for this kind of workout? When is it bst to do? Thanks.

A good recovery would be about 20 minutes between reps.

le major wrote:

if you ran 10x400 in 60 w/ 2min rest for a workout.

then ran 4x400 in 53 w/4min rest for a workout.

then ran 1:57 in a race .... you are officially the worst 800m racer to ever live. Or you lie about your workouts on the internet.

I did run 1:57. I think when I ran it though, I was exhausted and the effects of training hadn't quite caught up. I ran 3:51 in 1500 shortly after. I can always run a decent 400 and 1500, but I seriously can't get in the groove in an 800, but don't know why.

Daniels would say IF you were going to do this workout (not at 800 pace though), your recovery would be long enough so you could finish the workout.

Vigil would say--if you're training for a 5K--to do 12X400 at 5K Race Pace with 3:00 rest.

I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish here.

Huh? wrote:

Vigil would say--if you're training for a 5K--to do 12X400 at 5K Race Pace with 3:00 rest.

What the f*** kind of a workout is 12X400m @5k pace with 3 minutes rest?

12X400m with 1 minutes rest is a good workout...at MILE pace.

Yeah, what would Vigil know about coaching!?! Sheez. Stupid me for reading his book & going to see him lecture. I guess I'll just take your advice--some random poster on a website--and kill myself with your workout.

Huh? wrote:

Yeah, what would Vigil know about coaching!?! Sheez. Stupid me for reading his book & going to see him lecture. I guess I'll just take your advice--some random poster on a website--and kill myself with your workout.

You must have got it wrong. Nobody does 12x400 with 3 rest at 5k pace. That´s a ridiculously easy workout.

I think these are the workouts you're looking for:

12x400m with 1:30 minute rest at 1500 pace

16x400m with 1:00 minute rest at 3k pace

20x400m with 45 seconds rest at 5k pace

I agree with the posters above about 12x400 at 800 pace. That's ridiculous. I'm well under 3:50 for the 1500 and I could never ever do that workout. I once did 6x400 at 800m pace but I took 5 minutes between reps and was sore as hell later.

Med School Runner wrote:

I think these are the workouts you're looking for:

12x400m with 1:30 minute rest at 1500 pace

16x400m with 1:00 minute rest at 3k pace

20x400m with 45 seconds rest at 5k pace

I agree with the posters above about 12x400 at 800 pace. That's ridiculous. I'm well under 3:50 for the 1500 and I could never ever do that workout. I once did 6x400 at 800m pace but I took 5 minutes between reps and was sore as hell later.

Agree. 10 X 400m with equal time rest for 3000m is decent enough, but I prefer 600s-800s instead. I don't even do 400s at 5km pace, way too easy. Try 1000s-1200s with equal time rest.