2:15 Olympic Standard.

I actually think that this is a great idea.

Trials races are problematic because a nation's best runner could just have a horrible day, and it can mess with tapering and training schedules that aren't as conducive to peaking at the Olympics.

Selection committees are obviously subject to favoritism and politics.

267 is by no means too many for the race, although I doubt all 267 with the standard would choose to do the marathon at the Games.

Just designate a time period and a number of courses where the standard can be met, and let the numbers fly.

I agree with Hodgie-San. We can argue at length whether the standard should be 2:12 or 2:14 or 2:15 or whatever; but it's not like a track race where you have a finite number of lanes, or like a 10k where forcing the leader to lap 227 runners would be horrific. I don't think 200-300 runners should be a problem; similar for the women (use, say 2:35 as a cut-off and have at 'em). The real issue is that the Olympics and national teams would probably rather spend the housing and travel money on more gymnasts and swimmers, rather than an extra 200 marathoners.

I think allowing EVERYONE under 2:15 might be a bit extreme, but surely, the three per nation rule can be relaxed considerably. It could be eight, or ten. But you know...not 30 or 40.

Spider say:

>The real issue is that the Olympics and national teams would probably rather spend the housing and travel money on more gymnasts and swimmers, rather than an extra 200 marathoners.<

If I knew of a 2:14 runner living in my area who was qualified to run in the Olympic Games I do not think that it would be much of a problem to get folk's to take up a collection and contribute to his expenses.

Look how excited some folk's get when someone runs 2:22 & goes to the Olympic Trials!

I think they should allow the top 100 Kenyans, and pay the

top 25 positions.

Your idea sounds great, but any country that doesn't meet the standard should stay out.

That wouldnt go over too well politically but any race with over 200 people under 2:15 would be a hell of a dog fight.

No kidding. Heck, if was was able to run sub 2:15, and a trip to the Olympics was at stake, I'd take out a loan to go.

Maybe you could have a limit of how many people get travelling and lodging expenses, and everyone else who meets the standard gets to pay their own way.

There were only 100 runners in the male marathon in the 2000 olympics...now, 280 runners or so is not that many at all for a marathon race, but this is the Olympics, the most prestigious event there is. I think the high standards for the Olympics should remain and not add 180 athletes so easily.

Nope.

2:15 marathoners(with no other credentials) do not belong on an Olympic team.

Note: if you are a 2:15 marathoner who beats 10 guys with PR's near in the 2:10-2:12 range then you clearly are not just a 2:15 marathoner.

The Olympics should be exlusive, the top 3 finishers at the trials is a very good method of picking a team.

All that said, the Olympics should have no time standard.

If Keneisa Bekele is chosen by the Ethiopian fed to run in the OG Marathon, Ala John Treacy, it should be allowed.

Hodgie-San wrote:

". . . If I knew of a 2:14 runner living in my area who was qualified to run in the Olympic Games I do not think that it would be much of a problem to get folk's to take up a collection and contribute to his expenses. . ."

Personally, I agree completely, and I'd be first to contribute. But getting the athletes there is perhaps the easier part. The folks (businessmen and politicians, in the main) who run a given Olympics are looking at housing, feeding and providing security for about 10,000 athletes. They'd probably consider it a better return on investment, or better for their economic margins (TV margins, primarily), if they could restrict the whole games to just female gymnasts and people who have overcome tearful personal obstacles to get to their event (". . . in lane 2, after overcoming a tragic case of hallitosis and the horrific loss of her nose in a freak frisbee accident . . ."). That seems the best way to improve their TV revenue. Keeping a dorm and feeding trough for 200 extra ectomorphs in an event no one will watch is probably not on their radar. But of course, I wish it was. (As soon as they elect me dictator, I'll fix these things).

P.S. Do you still live in Boston? I lived there for several years; now on the west coast.

I can see the pandamonium now. There will be like 1500 Kenyans at the olympic race all capable of doing 2:15 or better. When they can`t win they will just blocade other prospective contenders, cuz Kenyans are renowned for team sprit.

mplatt say:

>2:15 marathoners(with no other credentials) do not belong on an Olympic team.<

With no other credentials?

2:15 was pretty respectable in this race:

Sydney 2000

Men's marathon

Session Final

Date Sunday 1 October

Results 1. Ethiopia

Result: 02h10:11

Competitor: Gezahng Abera

2. Kenya

Result: 02h10:31

Competitor: Eric Wainaina

3. Ethiopia

Result: 02h11:10

Competitor: Tesfaye Tola

4. Great Britain

Result: 02h11:17

Competitor: Jon Brown

5. Italy

Result: 02h12:14

Competitor: Giacomo Leone

6. Spain

Result: 02h13:06

Competitor: Martin Fiz

7. Morocco

Result: 02h13:49

Competitor: Abdelkader Elmouaziz

8. France

Result: 02h14:04

Competitor: Mohamed Ouaadi

9. Zimbabwe

Result: 02h14:19

Competitor: Tendai Chimusasa

10. Australia

Result: 02h14:50

Competitor: Steve Moneghetti

11. Portugal

Result: 02h15:17

Competitor: Antonio Pinto

12. South Africa

Result: 02h16:19

Competitor: Hendrick Ramaala

13. Holland

Result: 02h16:24

Competitor: Kamiel Maase

14. Ecuador

Result: 02h16:27

Competitor: Silvio Guerra

15. Rwanda

Result: 02h16:39

Competitor: Mathias Ntawurikura

16. Lesotho

Result: 02h16:43

Competitor: Paul Moqhali

17. Angola

Result: 02h16:43

Competitor: Joao Ntiamba

18. Portugal

Result: 02h16:52

Competitor: Domingos Castro

19. Great Britain

Result: 02h16:59

Competitor: Keith Cullen

20. South Africa

Result: 02h16:59

Competitor: Josia Thugwane

I'm with platt. The Sydney results don't support your case. Every one of those runners have run much faster than 2:15. Much faster.

I'd be in favor of, let's say, six man teams, with team scoring, regardless of time. Plus, exempt any runner who has already competed on the track to run for the individual title, but not for the team title.

Hodgie-San:

Placing well under competitive circumstances is a better measure of runners than judging them by strictly time.

For instance, winning the Olympic trials in 2:16 is more impressive to me than time trialing 2:14 at Chicago but finishing 25th place.

We should send our best "racers." Running a fast time -on it's own- is not always indicative of racing ability.

I don't like the Olympic time standards that force guys to chase "times" at the expense of racing.

disagree.

The marathon event should have the same number of participants or potentially as all the other events in track and field. If you want to make a laxed standard for the marathon because the event is longer (time) I just don't get it.

At one time we could have sent the top 15 400 meter male runners in the world to the Olympic Games and they could have taken the top 15 spots. Why in the world, especially with how the American marathon athletes compare, would you consider a relaxed standard.

I don't know about letting in below a certain time standard, but I like the idea of relaxing the rules a bit and letting more runners in.

Look at Kenya, there are probably 15+ guys who have a legitimate chance at medaling. Simply put, some of those guys should be allowed in, only they are not because they are running for a powerhouse.

Has Kenya ever lobbied for this? It would certainly be to their benefit.

In terms of the US system, If would like to see dominant athletes be able to opt out of the trials. The marathon is a fickle bitch, it would be a shame for KK to get injured training for the trials and not make the team. He is, after all, several minutes ahead of all other Americans.

It seems you would like to appeal the entire concept of the Olympic Games...let's just have a big track meet, unlimited entries....blah...blah...

Actually, I didn't advocate the 2:15 standard at all. I also didn't advocate unlimited entries.

I advocated letting a few more of the best guys who won't make it because their country is a virtually all-star team of distance running.

In the U.S., I advocated letting a dominate athlete skip the trials.

Reading is fundamental.

mplatt,

Which in your opinion would be a better RACE:

Current system or a race with the top 300 FASTEST runners in the world over the previous 12-18 months?

mplatt say:

>Running a fast time -on it's own- is not always indicative of racing ability.<

It's the best measure we have and anyone is welcome to go for a time whatever legitemate course they choose.