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If I begin a similar base phase to the previous poster in december and want to peak in April (late april) - When should I start the 10k specific track workouts? When should I start the harder V02 stuff and the 10k pace repeats with shorter rest?
been there done that am here wrote:
I suggest using matt tegenkamp's training program.
Has he ever run a 10k?
Or are you just suggesting a good base phase program?
Disregard the Tegenkamp comment. It is an old, lame joke.
Unlike "Coach B" I do see a point to early season 400s- to get the legs turning over. I think you never want to stray too far from race pace...and 10k pace isn't all that fast so its not going to be a problem with "burning out" from too much lactic acid exposure too early in the season.
That being said, you can get yourself in really good shape by hammering workouts for about a period of 4 weeks (after several months of pure base work, easy running and some threshold (tempo, LT) runs.
However, after a period of easy and slow base work you step on the track and all of a sudden running 70 sec 400s or whatever your 5k/10k pace is not smooth...it feels almost uncomfortable.
Well, I'd transition into that be including repeat 400s, lots of strides, maybe some fartleks and even repeat 1000s earlier in the season.
So to answer your question directly: you can do 10k specific workouts pretty much all season, BUT those harder V02max workouts and workouts were you feel some of that lactic acid and hit over 95% of max heart rate should be saved for March (if you look for a peak in late April)...so the last 6 weeks or so of your preparation- those workouts should be more of the focus.
Some easy 400s and tempo effort 1000s a couple months before that even though shouldn't hurt you- but rather help with the transition to faster reps and improve muscle memory.
is a 5k race a good substitute for a v02 workout? I plan to do 4-5 5k's (pretty much one every saturday starting mid march). I usually do 2 workouts a week during those last 6 weeks of the season. if the race is one workout, what should be the second? 10k goal pace repeats or a tempo run?
thanks
okay, I responded with mainly peaking for a couple important 10k races in mind...not a season worth of 5k's.
To answer your question: yes, 5k races are a good V02max stimulus. However, racing every weekend for a month is ill-advised. Also keep in mind that on you have to rest up a little before each race and this takes away from your training. The final point is that in V02max workouts you can actually do more volume and perhaps even at a higher velocity (since you get rest)..so in the long run 8 by 1000m at 5k pace is better training. However a race is the most specific workout you can have so they are good every now and then.
If you are racing on the weekend, you could still do 2 other workouts that week (if you are in a "hard" phase of training and want to be able to peak and rest up for more imporant races a month out). However, every other week alternate the workouts a bit:
i.e.
one week:
12-20 by 400m at 3k race pace w/1:30 rest between
30min tempo run
5k race
next week:
Long Run- medium hard
4 by 2k at half marathon race pace w/3min rest between
Race
of course with easy days between workouts.
last 3 weeks out from goal week you could rest up more by taking out a workout (or race) here and there.
sounds good (and logical). With your advice I'll cut back to 2-3 5ks (one every other weekend starting march) and then peak for 1-2 10k's in april.
And the last 3 weeks I think I'll only do 1 workout a week to make sure my best efforts are saved for races.
Also, should I cut back the long run when I start doing the harder workouts in march? (i usually do 2 hours or roughly 18 miles during base phase). You say long run at medium hard effort, how long is long? is 15 better during the harder training cycle?
should I cut back mileage a little as well when the workouts pick up in intesity? Lets say I do 90sh during base and just go with how my body is feeling 85, 100, 90, 85, etc. Should I cut back 10-15 miles a week?
Great advice - thanks
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This is turning into a really useful thread. It would be a shame to lose it to the stupid Letsrun search function. Is there some way it can be bookmarked, along with other past threads on 10K training? Not being able to find this stuff drives me crazy
yeah, cut the long run back to 15 miles or 90min or so during the racing season...the last two weeks you don't need to do a long run.
You also might want to mix it up with the two 10ks that you race....that is, race a 10k-then 2 weeks later race a 5k and then 2-3 weeks later race your more important 10k.
Running two 10ks back to back would be okay, but I think it would be better to mix it up with a 5k.
Also right, you could def cut back your mileage from 90mpw to around 75mpw when you are doing those harder workouts.
hope that helps.
thanks - helps a lot.
agree with above guy - I can't stand when threads like this get lost in the mix. especially because '10k' can't be searched.
We should start saying TenK so it can be found later.
TenK - lots of good info here bump
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Manchesterpool