Why people feel Lagat/Abdi/Meb aren't true "Americans"

Yeah, you suck at writing coherent posts alright. You suck hugely. Plus you make assumptions that most of us do not actually share. Bernard, Meb, and Abdi are really good guys and we're lucky to have them racing for the U.S.A.

Summary:

SOMEWHATFAST: "Bernard, Meb, and Abdi are really good guys and we're lucky to have them racing for the U.S.A."

CAMOO: "No, you suck. Bernard, Meb, and Abdi are really good guys and we're lucky to have them racing for the U.S.A."

You still can't ignore the fact that many people on this message board don't think of them as "true Americans". I'm sure somebody soon will say something like "they weren't born here... yadda yadda.

You never even made your point. I hope this thread ends now.

Don't know much about the other two, but from what I know of Meb, he and his family seem to embody the American dream to its fullest. Leave your home country (for him, at a young age), come here, and work your butt off to become successful. It doesn't get any more American than that.

Ashley J. Williams wrote:

You still can't ignore the fact that many people on this message board don't think of them as "true Americans". I'm sure somebody soon will say something like "they weren't born here... yadda yadda.

Try to become a white citizen of Japan and see how you're treated (me). There is actually a black member of "our" national soccer team, you wouldn't believe what people post on message boards about him and all "colored" citizens (including white).

Looks like you are right...everyone is just lining up to say they aren't "true Americans"

I haven't heard an argument on here yet that convinces me it's not because they aren't white. I suspect most of the asterisk-applying folks want elites and record-breakers who look like them, and really, how many people on here aren't white?

And not like they need my help, but those three guys embody, for the most part, the American dream. They came here hoping for a better life, found a trade in which they were skilled, and worked their asses off. Meb and Abdi didn't even start running till after they got here. Meb even ran at Kinney Nationals in high school. It doesn't get any more American than that!

I'm wondering how people would react if, say, Bernard Lagat's son (doesn't he have one? If not, then I hypothetical one), becomes an elite professional runner for the US, born and raised in America, and starts breaking national records and winning medals.

cassio598 wrote:

and really, how many people on here aren't white?

1 for 1 so far. look at your country man, it's not 99% white anymore

It is getting too easy to switch nationalities. Nigerians to Spain & Portugal. Some woman from Tucson trying to Cycle for St. Kitts & Nevis in Olympics....her connection to St. Kitts & Nevis - NONE!

No, it's just about jingoism, nothing more.

First of all, the race argument is ridiculous. Americans are pretty well accustomed to having black athletes represent the country, especially in T&F.

Also, hardly anybody on this board had a problem with Meb or Abdi. Some people were bothered by Meb's thing with the Eritrean flag, but for the most part, there's been very little questioning of their "American" creds.

Lagat is a different case, because he won an Olympic medal for Kenya. He was the second best miler in the world, competing for another country, and then he switched. This is what bothers some people. I do think that after being spurned by his old country, winning double gold, and starting a family in the US, Lagat has finally been accepted by most American track fans.

Khalid is in a similar, but less extreme situation, in that he hasn't had much international success. Nevertheless, he was the best marathoner in the world as a Moroccan. Where Khalid took some flak was because, at one point, he seemed reluctant to represent the US.

When this debate was raging, there seemed to be two main concerns about naturalized runners:

1. If they came up through a foreign system, then their success does not really reflect on the strength of American running. (As a corollary to this, it's easier to support someone who ran Footlocker, just like you did.)

2. Many people seemed to have an aesthetic distaste for the notion of someone setting an AR that was not even their PR.

Although the "jingoist" charge was thrown around a lot, I don't think the argument (for the vast majority of fans) was ever about whether or not these naturalized citizens were real Americans. It was whether they were real "American runners."

Have to agree with the previous poster.

Americans like to have a farm team: Meb, who ran here in high school and escaped a war-torn country, or Lopez Lomong, one of the Lost Boys who made good, represent the American dream. Our stamp is on their development, and we can claim them as our own.

Lagat, on the other hand, was a ringer who switched allegiance at the end of his career. Now, that doesn't mean that we don't accept him as American, it just seems that he became who he is somewhere else, and then joined up with us. This isn't quite true since most of his development as a serious runner has taken place in the U.S. and the much-maligned collegiate system.

It's absurd to say that Americans are racist about their sports stars in a country that has produced Michael Jordan, Michael Johnson, Carl Lewis, Mohammed Ali, LeBron James et al. Maybe we just want them to have struggled against the temptations of a sedentary lifestyle, a poor educational system and trans-fats rather than bone-grinding poverty, famine and civil war.

OP, stop blaming everything on genetics. That's one of the stupidest things to say. Attribute their success to their hard, smart work and the fact that they have just done everything right in their training, not to some self-limiting genetics excuse. If you want to be good, go out and work hard. But if you don't, give up, sit on your butt, and keep blaming your suckiness on other people's genes.

Apparently it is about race, because "foreign" white women are U.S. Olympic marathoners in 2004 and 2008 and no one seems to mind that.

Call it genetics, call it environment, but Africans run faster than Americans. Sure they work hard, but the reason Bekele runs a minute faster than elite Americans in the 10k isn't just because he works harder.

If it was all about being tough, training hard and intelligently, then Adam Goucher should have run 26:15 for the 10k by now. After all, he has about 7 more years of formal training under his belt than Bekele. But you know what? He'll never run 26:15 unless he runs it on the moon.

As for my "suckiness," I fail to see how my acknowledging that Africans are more talented, on average, than Americans, means I am making excuses for myself. It's not like I've lost in a race to any Africans recently. Hell, I don't even race against Africans. The closest I've come is racing against my mulatto teammate in the mile. And you know what? I smoked him with a sick 300 final kick, 4:52 to 4:55. You were right, I do suck:(

I really don't see how anyone could argue with the points above, but if you would like to make another argument, please do so with the use of the following statements.

1. Take Bekele's balls out of your mouth.

2. Go run as fast and Goucher and then tell me how easy it is.

3. You ran 4:52 for the mile? You suck and have no authority to even think about running.

4. You need to get laid.

azn senzation wrote:[/b}

look at your country man, it's not 99% white anymore.

I wasn't claiming the country is mostly white; if it hasn't happened already, white non-hispanics will account for less than half of the population. My point was that most of the people who post on this message board are. In my experience, and ymmv on this one, in my experience distance running has been a overwhelmingly white, middle-class sport.

Apparently It Is wrote:

Apparently it is about race, because "foreign" white women are U.S. Olympic marathoners in 2004 and 2008 and no one seems to mind that.

Again, I have to disagree, but mostly because it seems like most of the posters around here don't pay much attention to women's running, myself included. I'm not sure I can even name the other two qualifiers after Deena, never mind recite their personal histories.

Call it genetics, call it environment, but Africans run faster than Americans. Sure they work hard, but the reason Bekele runs a minute faster than elite Americans in the 10k isn't just because he works harder.

If it was all about being tough, training hard and intelligently, then Adam Goucher should have run 26:15 for the 10k by now. After all, he has about 7 more years of formal training under his belt than Bekele. But you know what? He'll never run 26:15 unless he runs it on the moon.

As for my "suckiness," I fail to see how my acknowledging that Africans are more talented, on average, than Americans, means I am making excuses for myself. It's not like I've lost in a race to any Africans recently. Hell, I don't even race against Africans. The closest I've come is racing against my mulatto teammate in the mile. And you know what? I smoked him with a sick 300 final kick, 4:52 to 4:55. You were right, I do suck:(

I really don't see how anyone could argue with the points above, but if you would like to make another argument, please do so with the use of the following statements.

1. Take Bekele's balls out of your mouth.

2. Go run as fast and Goucher and then tell me how easy it is.

3. You ran 4:52 for the mile? You suck and have no authority to even think about running.

4. You need to get laid

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AAAAhhaaahhaahhhaa!! Damn Straight. Thats what Im sayin.