Why does Malmo insist upon doubles as much as possible?

meant to say "many" sorry

Is malmo from malmo? just curious...

Studies have shown that increasing the frequency of an activity will make you better at it. For example, running twice is better for your running economy than running once.

Original question: more runs should equal more miles which equals good.

Other question: I think malmo set his 10000 m best in Malmo.

Most important are the recovery benefits I think-dividing the load and being able to rest in between. Also two ten mile runs is easier mentally for most people then one twenty miler every day. Plus you can run at a much faster average pace. I've always found that 13+ mile runs leave a different type of fatigue then two 5-8 mile runs in a day.

i kinda like running wrote:

What is the point of doubling as monay days as you can? I thought it was better to do single runs.

Who says it's better to do singles? All of the best runners in the world do doubles. Case closed.

There's also something to be said for doing a shakeout each and every morning. I'm not a physiologist, but I know I always feel better on my afternoon workouts when I do a few easy miles in the morning. If you're able to make a four mile run a part of your morning routine, that's 20 extra miles a week. For me, they didn't have to be fast. I treated them like mini-progressions (jog pace to 7:30/mile to 7:00/mile to normal run pace by the end).

As far as time issues, in college it was easy for me to get in a double nearly every day. Once I was a sophomore my earliest class was 10am. That left me plenty of time to get in a run and a good breakfast without having to wake up before dawn. Now that I'm working 45 hours a week with a couple rugrats running around it's a bit harder to get out there twice a day. I still try to get in a couple doubles every week, but I value my sleep too much to do them every day. If you're pressed for time, it may be more benefial to get a single quality 10 mile run (plus a bit of extra sleep) in rather than a 5 mile in the morning and 8 in the evening (feeling rushed).

swedey wrote:

Is malmo from malmo? just curious...

No.

mcgato wrote:

I think malmo set his 10000 m best in Malmo.

No.

Steeplechase AR?

fUrCeOsNhN wrote:

Steeplechase AR?

No that was at UCLA.

I beat hometown hero Dan Glans in the featured event at MAI, 1978.

First off, doubles work. Mountains of evidence to support that.

Next, doubles get you more time on your feet without the impact on the body. The point isn't if you can do 8 in 60 minutes that's all you need. If you can do 60 minutes once you can do 30 the morning and do another 45 at night. Now you're doing 75 minutes.

Lastly, if you want to be a lean mean fighting machine you get more lean by doing 2 runs a day than 1. Heck, I'm an old gimp doing half the mileage of even the slackers here and I'm doubling twice a week. Why? Easy. Each time you run you burn for another 15-20 minutes post workout. Two workouts a day means another 15-20 minutes of calorie burn time.

Try it. Leave the rest of your running the same and add 30 minutes EASY 2-3 days a week as a separate run. 4-6 weeks you'll see the difference. If you don't go back to what you were doing and the worst thing that happened was you got some extra miles and 12-16 more showers.

There was actually some research done on this whole topic, quite some years ago now. The finding was that two training sessions were significantly (statistically speaking) better than one. There was no statistically-significant benefit to adding a third session, however.

I've occasionally thought that this all corresponds pretty well to humans' natural history. There's a considerable tradition, in quite a few cultures and in varied climates, of a morning session of labor, followed by a midday rest (generally including food), then work in the afternoon until dusk.

In any case, doubling is beneficial not simply because Malmo says so--but because research shows that what Malmo says is right!

Because it worked for him. Simple as that.

jump the shark alert wrote:

Because it worked for him. Simple as that.

It's as simple as: everyone I know who's competitive runs doubles. This has been that way ever since high school, way back in 1970.

The real question is, if you are serious about running, why are you doing singles?

First to clarify - I changed coaches in March of 1987: Mike Durkin and Ken Popejoy. Ken now has sons competing for Notre Dame and U of Illinois. Mike wrote all the training, and Ken timed me from 1987-1993. The last 4 years, Ken would come to the track about once every two weeks. They were both attorneys, and very busy. I remember in 1993, Ken did over 1000 real estate closings, trained with me, and still traveled to Stuttgard with me for the World Championships where I was 5th in the 1500m.

1987: Week ending / mileage / notable race

May 9 / 73.0

May 16 / 60 3:59.3 Pepsi

May 23 / 70

May 30 / 60 3:37.49 Jenner

June 6 / 66 1:48.4 Pre

June 13 / 63 1:49.0 Boston

June 20 / 40 sick 3 days

June 27 / 52 3:43.66 USATF's, 1st (52.2 last 400)

July 4 / 45 3:51.91 Dream Mile Oslo, 2nd

July 11 / 62

July 18 / 38 3:55.62 Barcelona, 4th

July 25 / 74

Aug 1 / 73

Aug 8 / 66

Aug 15 / 45 3:47.46 1500m - Pan Am Games, 2nd

Aug 22 / 44 3:34.37 Zurich, 3rd

Aug 29 / 53 3:39.0 part of 4x1500m team in Dublin, 2nd fastest time by USA (3:43, 3:39, 3:46, 3:39.0)

Sept 6 / 46 3:38.82, World Champs Bronze medal, Rome

Sept 14 / 36 3:36.8 Brussles, Grand Prix final, 2nd

Sept 19 / 38 4:52.44 2000m Amerian Record, Lausanne

In comparison: 1993

April 3 / 63

April 10 / 49

April 17 / 77

April 24 / 62 13:58 5000m 1st Drake Relays

May 1 / 63 Treadmill test, 85.2 Sustainable max vo2 and highest vo2 of my career, 88.3

May 8 / 64 3:40.31 Indianapolis

May 15 / 57

May 22 / 55

May 29 / 52 3:41.57 Jenner, 3rd

June 5 / 63 13:25.92 5000m Pre, 3rd

June 11 / 54

June 19 / 45 USATF Oregon, 3:42.92 3rd

June 26 / 59 3:54.98 Indianapolis 3rd

July 3 / 50 3:36.45 Lille, 2nd

July 10 / 50 3:52.37 Oslo Dream mile 4th

July 17 / 60

July 24 / 56

July 31 / 56 3:39.38 Luxemburg, 1st

Aug 7 / 52 7:37.07 3000m Colonge, 3rd PR

Aug 14 / 48

Aug 21 / 44 3:37.41 World champs, 5th (Heat, semi and final)

Aug 28 / 40 3:54.78 Berlin

Sept 4 / 57 3:34.91 Reiti

Sept 11 / 46 3:36.28 Grand Prix final, London, 6th

For training, the building phase was from when Indoor track ended (March 1) through June 1. Three months. I would put in workouts three times a week. Either M-R-Sat with a long run on Sunday, or M-W-Sat and a long run on Sunday. Long runs were 80-90 minutes. Pace for the long runs: From my logs: 6:36; 6:45; 6:28; 6:50; 6:48

track workouts were based upon doing a lot of intervals, with short rest, slow. Examples:

3.24.91: 800-600-800, 800, 800-600-800 with 200 rest between intervals, and 400-600 rest between sets. 2:15 pace for the 800's, with a 30 m's morning run, 14.5 miles for the day.

4.20.91: 2x150(50)[400] 1x400 :67(200) 2x200(200) :31 1x400 :66 (400) 6x200(200) 30 [400] 1x250 41 (150) 1x400 :61 (200) 2x250(150) 40

5.14.91: 4x150(50)[400] 4x800(800) 1:58 pace

5.16.91: 6x250(150) :42 [400] 4x400(200) 62[400] 5x250(150) :42 [400] 2x400(200) :61

5.11.87: 5x150(50)[400] 3x400(200) 61 [400] 2x400(200) 60 [400] 3x400(200) 59 [400] 6x1500(50)[400] 3x200(200) :30

Week of 6.26-7.2 of 1988

Saturday - 90 m's (m=minutes)

Sunday - 3.5 am / 2 miles wu,10x100

4x150(50)[400]

6x250(150)35,35, 32, 35, 35, 32 [400]

2x400(200) 56, 56 [600]

7x200(100) 32, 32, 31, 33, 32, 30, 32 [400]

3x150(50)

6x100, mile wd (13.0 miles for the day)

Monday: 3 miles am / 4 miles pm and strides

Tuesday: 3 miles am/ 4.5 miles pm and 10x100

Wednesday: 2 miles warm-up, 10x100

3x150(50)[200]

6x200(100) :34 [400]

2x400(400) 55, 56 [600]

6x200(100) ran :30 on the grass, and jogged :30 slow

jog 300 slow

10x100

mile wd (9 miles for the day)

Thursday: 2 miles am / massage / 4.5 miles, 10x100 pulse 48 AM

Friday: Flight to Oslo, 810am

33 mins with John Walker, New Zealand, 13x100

Saturday: Oslo Dream mile, 3:50.57 6th place

splits 58.2-1:56.7-2:55.0-55.5 last 400

60.5 miles for the week

I think I would say, when I ran on the track, I put in a lot of milage. For my recovery days, I ran 3-4 miles in the morning and 35-45 minutes in the afternoon.

Hoped that answered your question. All of the above info was taken from my logs.

js

here's a variation-on-the-theme question:

my focus is on ultras, topping out at 50 miles on runnable trails (i.e., not on the so-technical-have-to-walk-a-lot courses). i'm a 48-yr-old woman and a typical week is 70-80 miles, all in singles and largely on trails, with one long run of maybe 3:00-3:30 and one tempo run (roads), long-hill workout, or (nonultra) trail race. since my focus is on being able to sustain an effort over 8-ish hours, in what way would doubles help me?

no longer stressed wrote:

since my focus is on being able to sustain an effort over 8-ish hours, in what way would doubles help me?

In the same way they help every other distance runner.

Here's cycling guru Joe Friel's statement about daily doubles (in The Cyclist's Training Bible):

Sleeping and working out have a synergistic effect on fitness: Each can cause the release of a growth hormone from the pituitary gland. Growth hormone speeds recovery, rebuilds muscles, and breaks down body fat. By training twice daily and taking a nap, the dedicated rider gets four hits of growth hormone daily, resulting in higher levels of fitness sooner.

what about the mitochondria and capillary beds, which I've heard see the most training gain after particularly long sessions (over 1 hour). doesn't this provide evidence for singles?

I always understood the advice for a single run to apply only for the long run. That is, you get more benefit from a single long run (2 hours), than by breaking it up into two runs (2x1 hour).But you still benefit with either approach, and the long run is typically only once per week. You can double-up the other days. I even once saw a recommendation to double-up when you do the long run, e.g. a short morning run plus a longer afternoon run (maybe not 2 hours, but then again maybe so).

i kinda like running wrote:

What is the point of doubling as monay days as you can? I thought it was better to do single runs.

explain the significance please?