marriage is hell. why haven't we figured out an alternative?

cracking toast wrote:

I'm happy and married 20+ years. We have 4 kids, jobs, mortgage, etc. We have had problems and successes and still love each other. Love is choice and action, not exclusively feelings and orgasms - you can get those on Hallmark and Pornhub. Marriage is commitment and work, but not much work. Its like spinning a bicycle wheel, once it is up to speed and functioning it doesn't take much to keep it going

Post of the year?

It’s really centered around having children bro..,otherwise it’s just an expensive contract bro

Why are you solely blaming the man here when marriage is supposed to be a partnership? Especially in the current environment of online dating where women can find another dude in 5 seconds with a swipe to come over whenever shes upset. See this is the problem. Its always the man's fault if things go wrong. Its always "happy wife, happy life" but god forbid someone if actually gives a cares about the man and how he feels. The man is supposed to be a work horse and atm machine who gets blamed if something bad happens. Why is it that the wife is never held accountable if marriages dont work out too? This is exactly why most men opt out of marriage now

so it goes wrote:

You need to get over your hate of women.

I’m in a happy marriage. I’m a 35F and my husband is 40.

We do not have children.

My salary is $240k and his is $70k.

Our marriage is predicated upon our love and commitment to one another and that is that. I have no ulterior motives or financial skin in the game....although I deeply respect parenting and those who choose to have kids.

Anyway, yeah, happy marriages exist.

Oh, come one. You don't like the money part. Not even a teensy, lil bit?

bigopera wrote:

I don't know a single person in a happy marriage.

Married since 1992, very happy. I have achieved pretty much everything I wanted in life. That it doesn't work for you, or your friends, that's another story. It requires lots of love, fortitude, character and to a certain degree...discipline. Does that say anything about your acquaintances or...you?

no point duh wrote:

Why are you solely blaming the man here when marriage is supposed to be a partnership? Especially in the current environment of online dating where women can find another dude in 5 seconds with a swipe to come over whenever shes upset. See this is the problem. Its always the man's fault if things go wrong. Its always "happy wife, happy life" but god forbid someone if actually gives a cares about the man and how he feels. The man is supposed to be a work horse and atm machine who gets blamed if something bad happens. Why is it that the wife is never held accountable if marriages dont work out too? This is exactly why most men opt out of marriage now

I wasn't blaming anyone I was speaking to the male side of the equation since I'm assuming you are male based on your comments.

Marriage is a partnership and both sides have an equal responsibility in keeping the other happy.

Most "men" don't opt out of marriage... 96% of men will be married at least once in their lives. By age 31 over 50% of men have been or are currently married.

If you find the right woman all of this anger and resentment will vanish.

Social media is a cesspit. If you're looking for a life partner amongst the selfie obsessed duck lipped wh*res online you're probably going to be unhappy forever.

Marriage (and having kids) is the single best way to learn that life isn't about you and your selfish pursuits. If your sole goal in life is to do whatever you want when you want then don't get married, and please, don't have kids. Go forth...

bigopera wrote:

I don't know a single person in a happy marriage.

There is an alternative---don't get married.

WHTaft wrote:

Marriage (and having kids) is the single best way to learn that life isn't about you and your selfish pursuits. If your sole goal in life is to do whatever you want when you want then don't get married, and please, don't have kids. Go forth...

The thing is, people do these things--get married, have kids to try to make their own life better/more meaningful first and foremost. Being a good wife/husband and a good parent should be a requirement, rather than an accomplishment. By having a kid, you're bringing a person into the world without their consent. You sure as hell better do a good job raising that child if you have one. By getting married, you're vowing to be a good spouse to your partner. You'd better fulfill those promises. And almost lastly, if you can in fact do these things with a selfless disposition and fulfill their lives too, you've been successful and deserve credit. But in the case of failure to be a good parent or incurring divorce, others' lives are potentially sabotaged. That matters.

This thread is beyond toxic but I think the unrealistic expectations placed on married couples lead to a lot of strain in relationships. My parents & their friends all have super long/healthy marriages. I already know people who got divorced after less than 5 years.

You're told to get married, have kids, buy a car, buy a house, etc. My parents are always pressing me on those types of things. Those expectations are heightened by social media & what we're told happiness looks like. The reality is that wages are down in the US & cost of living is as high as ever. Wealth is controlled by the few while most of us work for poverty wages no matter how badly we don't want to admit it. Even if you make $100k/year, you have nothing. You're told to front on the person making $50k/year even though you have so much more in common with them than a Bezos. My dad was able to pay for college with an on campus job. Now an on campus jobs barely get you beer. So people buy things they shouldn't and have kids that they honestly shouldn't (child care costs are astronomical). & this is happening when 1 or both in a couple have a ton of debt already. Unless you're a true 1%er your relationship is going to be stressed by economic factors unless you're committed to your partner, are ok renting & buying used cars, and are ok waiting to have children until you're ready.

Obviously projecting some of that stuff but I really believe economic stability is behind a lot of problems.

Grindr

Looks to me like she is the primary financial contributor

In many West African tribes, marriage is polyamorous. In fact, I'm a journalist and I did a take on a polyamorous community in Washington DC.

The episode mmonogamy from the Netflix series Explained is pretty enlightening.

bigopera wrote:

I don't know a single person in a happy marriage.

You must live in a strange world. I've been married for 11 years, and it's awesome. I was very picky with who I married, and it's paid massive dividends.

I can't think of a single close friend that isn't happy in their marriage.

But I did dodge some bullets. There are several girls I was very serious with that would have ended in disaster. They were incredible women, just would have been a major clash in personality.

mount in wrote:

Honest response:

The wisdom of marriage is lost on the self-centered. In a world focused on "me time" and "self care" it doesn't compute well. It's an institution designed to compel individuals to consider the well-being of others (especially when kids enter the picture) above one's self. The lesson kicks in when you discover, ironically, that your selfless sacrifices generate a significantly more fulfilling and joyful existence for yourself.

This. I had to learn the hard way what marriage is. I’m on my 2nd marriage and the hard work is nothing compared to anything else in life but it is worth it!

Ok7272 wrote:

In many West African tribes, marriage is polyamorous. In fact, I'm a journalist and I did a take on a polyamorous community in Washington DC.

The episode mmonogamy from the Netflix series Explained is pretty enlightening.

Polyamorous societies generally result in a small number of men getting most of the women, and a larger number of men getting no women than in typical Western societies. Exclusive relationships actually work well for Western men because most of them would be single otherwise and their genes die out.

Precious Roy wrote:

Been with my wife for over 20 years. I couldn't imagine being back in the dating scene. I can 100% be myself with my wife and don't have to pretend to like movies, restaurants, bands, etc. just to have a chance at getting some action. Being in a perpetual state of dating is a horrible way to live. Why in the world would anyone want to spend all their time trying to compete for a woman's attention when you can get married and be done with that? Long term relationships do require sacrifices, but that is just a part of growing up. You don't get what you want whenever you want it. That is for little kids, not adults.

We both know the majority on here will never grow up, but you are 100% correct.

55YO wrote:

Precious Roy wrote:

Been with my wife for over 20 years. I couldn't imagine being back in the dating scene. I can 100% be myself with my wife and don't have to pretend to like movies, restaurants, bands, etc. just to have a chance at getting some action. Being in a perpetual state of dating is a horrible way to live. Why in the world would anyone want to spend all their time trying to compete for a woman's attention when you can get married and be done with that? Long term relationships do require sacrifices, but that is just a part of growing up. You don't get what you want whenever you want it. That is for little kids, not adults.

We both know the majority on here will never grow up, but you are 100% correct.

While they make a good point, they are not 100% correct. There is an option besides marriage and perpetual dating for mature people who aren't brainwashed.

Precious Roy wrote:

Been with my wife for over 20 years. I couldn't imagine being back in the dating scene. I can 100% be myself with my wife and don't have to pretend to like movies, restaurants, bands, etc. just to have a chance at getting some action. Being in a perpetual state of dating is a horrible way to live. Why in the world would anyone want to spend all their time trying to compete for a woman's attention when you can get married and be done with that?

Why would you want to be with the same person for your entire life? Doesn't that get stale? It's like eating the same food for every meal. Even if it's your favorite, you're going to get sick of it.